STA is keeping AP classes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA caves to the parents. Can't say I am surprised.

I am happy STA offers AP classes. I took several in highschool and it was helpful to be able to get those credits in college and lighten my course load in college a few semesters plus the classes were interesting.

My private had zero classes which were labelled "AP" but offered in-school AP exams for every course. Even though our courses were not labeled "AP" and did not strictly follow the official "AP" curriculum, students routinely received 4s and 5s on the AP exames.

I see no particular value in any good private limiting their class to the official "AP" curriculum. A good school with good students ought to be able to teach a broader curriculum which better educated students, while still enabling the student to take the applicable AP exam at their own school.

You misunderstand what AP classes are. There are other threads on this you can search. The bolded is misinformed marketing bunk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA caves to the parents. Can't say I am surprised.

I am happy STA offers AP classes. I took several in highschool and it was helpful to be able to get those credits in college and lighten my course load in college a few semesters plus the classes were interesting.

My private had zero classes which were labelled "AP" but offered in-school AP exams for every course. Even though our courses were not labeled "AP" and did not strictly follow the official "AP" curriculum, students routinely received 4s and 5s on the AP exames.

I see no particular value in any good private limiting their class to the official "AP" curriculum. A good school with good students ought to be able to teach a broader curriculum which better educated students, while still enabling the student to take the applicable AP exam at their own school.

You misunderstand what AP classes are. There are other threads on this you can search. The bolded is misinformed marketing bunk.

No small amount of irony if you’re defending AP classes using the phrase “marketing bunk”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why these schools made such a fuss about AP exams in the first place.
I am a college professor and the AP curriculum in certain subjects (the ones I’m familiar with) is quite good.
Why complicate the landscape so much? I guess it is less stress on the teachers this way.

They did it so they could artificially distinguish themselves from the top area public high schools. Why pay tens of thousands of dollars a year for private when the same curriculum is offered by public school? Except they were too chicken sh*t to go it alone and didn’t dare pull the plug on APs without making sure all of them would go along with it.

Yes, and it's not working that well, because in the absence of a high school national exam like the Baccalaureat or Abitur, standardized subject exams and tests are actually quite useful for college admissions.

Really quite the opposite. Any standardized result made it harder to manipulate admissions based on virtue signaling. Admins don’t want any honest metric that undermines them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to the GDS poster . .you seem to have a complex. Perhaps your child is a great test taker and got 5s, but but many of my daughter's classmates from GDS completely bombed the AP exams and will not be taking any others.That may be part of why so many people are leaving the school.

DP, but

Wow you just left me speechless. I might have a complex but then again so do you. You just exhibited it.

What "complex" did I just exhibit? I expect this to be a fascinating diagnosis. Please note that I am the person who laughed at the notion that "so many" people are leaving GDS, not the person who claimed it.

No, you go first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand why these schools made such a fuss about AP exams in the first place.
I am a college professor and the AP curriculum in certain subjects (the ones I’m familiar with) is quite good.
Why complicate the landscape so much? I guess it is less stress on the teachers this way.

They did it so they could artificially distinguish themselves from the top area public high schools. Why pay tens of thousands of dollars a year for private when the same curriculum is offered by public school? Except they were too chicken sh*t to go it alone and didn’t dare pull the plug on APs without making sure all of them would go along with it.

Yes, and it's not working that well, because in the absence of a high school national exam like the Baccalaureat or Abitur, standardized subject exams and tests are actually quite useful for college admissions.

Really quite the opposite. Any standardized result made it harder to manipulate admissions based on virtue signaling. Admins don’t want any honest metric that undermines them.

Favoring rich donors and legacies is virtue signaling? What virtue?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA caves to the parents. Can't say I am surprised.

I am happy STA offers AP classes. I took several in highschool and it was helpful to be able to get those credits in college and lighten my course load in college a few semesters plus the classes were interesting.

My private had zero classes which were labelled "AP" but offered in-school AP exams for every course. Even though our courses were not labeled "AP" and did not strictly follow the official "AP" curriculum, students routinely received 4s and 5s on the AP exames.

I see no particular value in any good private limiting their class to the official "AP" curriculum. A good school with good students ought to be able to teach a broader curriculum which better educated students, while still enabling the student to take the applicable AP exam at their own school.

You misunderstand what AP classes are. There are other threads on this you can search. The bolded is misinformed marketing bunk.

No small amount of irony if you’re defending AP classes using the phrase “marketing bunk”

Fair enough, but you should actually look at the wide variety of ways in which teachers can and do approach the AP material, the depth and breadth covered, and the critical thinking and analysis required on the exams. If someone told you there is one official AP curriculum, they lied. Some school districts will limit their teachers to the District's AP curriculum for equity across schools or because they only want to pay to have one approved and everyone uses it, but that doesn't apply to teachers elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to the GDS poster . .you seem to have a complex. Perhaps your child is a great test taker and got 5s, but but many of my daughter's classmates from GDS completely bombed the AP exams and will not be taking any others.That may be part of why so many people are leaving the school.

GDS messaging about APs has been atrocious for years. Only this year did they even put out a FAQ as to who should consider signing up to take the tests and why. In classic GDS fashion, they think they are avoiding hurting people's feelings by being oblique about the AP test.

Meanwhile, I heard from some parents after all these years of de-emphasizing the AP test that the profile thing that GDS sends to all universities again for 2022-2023 application cycle puts front and center - as in top of the main page - how many kids at GDS took AP tests and that 90% or something scored 4 or more.

Long time parent and GDS inability to be direct with kids and parents on who should and shouldn't do things because they want to protect people from having their feelings hurt is maddening - or maybe they dont believe in testing. Much better to be upfront.

It took them 3 years to put out a FAQ around who should even take the tests instead of saying blanket "you dont need to take the tests". Meanwhile the UL teachers in some classes do side tutoring (for free) of their classes for 6 weeks prior to AP tests.

I agree that the GDS messaging is terrible and misleading. They say that the only reason to take an AP test is if the student is applying to overseas colleges or if the student wants to get credit or place out of requirements in order to graduate early. They don't say that it's beneficial to many students to place out of basic requirements even if they don't want to graduate early because it frees up time to take other courses. And despite what some posters on this board say, many, many top colleges award credit or allow higher placement for 4s and 5s on many AP tests. GDS's messaging doesn't explain any of this.

Talk about inequality and inequity of basic information and facts. Sheesh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA caves to the parents. Can't say I am surprised.

I am happy STA offers AP classes. I took several in highschool and it was helpful to be able to get those credits in college and lighten my course load in college a few semesters plus the classes were interesting.

My private had zero classes which were labelled "AP" but offered in-school AP exams for every course. Even though our courses were not labeled "AP" and did not strictly follow the official "AP" curriculum, students routinely received 4s and 5s on the AP exames.

I see no particular value in any good private limiting their class to the official "AP" curriculum. A good school with good students ought to be able to teach a broader curriculum which better educated students, while still enabling the student to take the applicable AP exam at their own school.

You misunderstand what AP classes are. There are other threads on this you can search. The bolded is misinformed marketing bunk.

No small amount of irony if you’re defending AP classes using the phrase “marketing bunk”

Fair enough, but you should actually look at the wide variety of ways in which teachers can and do approach the AP material, the depth and breadth covered, and the critical thinking and analysis required on the exams. If someone told you there is one official AP curriculum, they lied. Some school districts will limit their teachers to the District's AP curriculum for equity across schools or because they only want to pay to have one approved and everyone uses it, but that doesn't apply to teachers elsewhere.

And when the college board tells you that their courses are college equivalent and then 9th graders are taking AP classes, who’s buying the marketing bunk?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to the GDS poster . .you seem to have a complex. Perhaps your child is a great test taker and got 5s, but but many of my daughter's classmates from GDS completely bombed the AP exams and will not be taking any others.That may be part of why so many people are leaving the school.

GDS messaging about APs has been atrocious for years. Only this year did they even put out a FAQ as to who should consider signing up to take the tests and why. In classic GDS fashion, they think they are avoiding hurting people's feelings by being oblique about the AP test.

Meanwhile, I heard from some parents after all these years of de-emphasizing the AP test that the profile thing that GDS sends to all universities again for 2022-2023 application cycle puts front and center - as in top of the main page - how many kids at GDS took AP tests and that 90% or something scored 4 or more.

Long time parent and GDS inability to be direct with kids and parents on who should and shouldn't do things because they want to protect people from having their feelings hurt is maddening - or maybe they dont believe in testing. Much better to be upfront.

It took them 3 years to put out a FAQ around who should even take the tests instead of saying blanket "you dont need to take the tests". Meanwhile the UL teachers in some classes do side tutoring (for free) of their classes for 6 weeks prior to AP tests.

I agree that the GDS messaging is terrible and misleading. They say that the only reason to take an AP test is if the student is applying to overseas colleges or if the student wants to get credit or place out of requirements in order to graduate early. They don't say that it's beneficial to many students to place out of basic requirements even if they don't want to graduate early because it frees up time to take other courses. And despite what some posters on this board say, many, many top colleges award credit or allow higher placement for 4s and 5s on many AP tests. GDS's messaging doesn't explain any of this.

Totally agree - also a GDS HS parent. Their current messaging (after 2-3 years of no messaging at all other than AP test should not be taken") actually disadvantages the kids. Other than the Ivies and perhaps a few others, almost every school in Top 50/100 takes AP credit. So what, my kid now has to take Spanish or Calc 101 even though they took UL class at GDS - which was taught AP level and decided to actually listen to the college office and not take the AP test.

It's ridiculous and actually for a school that cares so much about equity...this is non-equitable. Kids are actually disadvantaged entering college by not having taken the tests because many families I know in the last years did not take the AP tests despite having kids in language, math and history UL classes because GDS said to not bother unless applying to UK

They also said that fewer GDS are taking AP tests now...of course, because the school is trying to discourage it, including by noting that fact! I assume solely in order to justify their decision to get rid of AP-labeled courses? We are really happy with everything else about GDS high school, but it seems like this is an issue that should be raised with admin and/or college counseling (the email on this recently did not come from college counseiing). Does any GDS parent posting here know whether it has been raised already? Or do most just ignore the advice about AP tests? I talked to my kid about this and they said that the students tend to know that there are good reasons to sit for AP tests despite what admin is saying...

[Anonymous]

For the naysayers complaining that taking away AP is a ploy these private schools use to remove accountability of rigor by teachers....I'd disagree.

Even though Sidwell doesn't do the best at being transparent about the benefits for students to take AP exams, we have found that the courses ARE at a high level. It does not appear to be difficult for a student who gets As in these courses to get 5s on the AP exams without putting in that much extra effort outside of class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to the GDS poster . .you seem to have a complex. Perhaps your child is a great test taker and got 5s, but but many of my daughter's classmates from GDS completely bombed the AP exams and will not be taking any others.That may be part of why so many people are leaving the school.

GDS messaging about APs has been atrocious for years. Only this year did they even put out a FAQ as to who should consider signing up to take the tests and why. In classic GDS fashion, they think they are avoiding hurting people's feelings by being oblique about the AP test.

Meanwhile, I heard from some parents after all these years of de-emphasizing the AP test that the profile thing that GDS sends to all universities again for 2022-2023 application cycle puts front and center - as in top of the main page - how many kids at GDS took AP tests and that 90% or something scored 4 or more.

Long time parent and GDS inability to be direct with kids and parents on who should and shouldn't do things because they want to protect people from having their feelings hurt is maddening - or maybe they dont believe in testing. Much better to be upfront.

It took them 3 years to put out a FAQ around who should even take the tests instead of saying blanket "you dont need to take the tests". Meanwhile the UL teachers in some classes do side tutoring (for free) of their classes for 6 weeks prior to AP tests.

Top of page two on the 21-22 “ADVANCED PLACEMENT EXAMS:
In May 2021, 114 GDS high school students sat for 174 Advanced Placement examinations; 41% earned scores of 5, 73% earned scores of 4 or above, and 91% earned scores of 3 or above.”
https://resources.finalsite.net/images/v1636400955/gdsorg/ciq4lvx8wbgfzccyswox/2021-22GDSHSProfile.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:to the GDS poster . .you seem to have a complex. Perhaps your child is a great test taker and got 5s, but but many of my daughter's classmates from GDS completely bombed the AP exams and will not be taking any others.That may be part of why so many people are leaving the school.

DP, but

Wow you just left me speechless. I might have a complex but then again so do you. You just exhibited it.

What "complex" did I just exhibit? I expect this to be a fascinating diagnosis. Please note that I am the person who laughed at the notion that "so many" people are leaving GDS, not the person who claimed it.

No, you go first.

Go first at what? I never said you had a complex. I literally wrote only "DP, but " and you think it has given you some insight into my psyche. I haven't claimed anything like that about you, so there is nothing for me to say about you first.

You do realize that the DP means different poster? And that I reiterated that in my second comment? In fact, those were my only two comments on this thread. I'm starting to think you are very confused.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:STA only offers in math/science.

That sucks. My son’s favorite classes have been all of his AP history courses. He really loved AP Euro history.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:STA only offers in math/science.

That sucks. My son’s favorite classes have been all of his AP history courses. He really loved AP Euro history.

I’d be willing to bet that the Euro history course that remains will still be great and that your son would be prepared to take AP exam

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For the naysayers complaining that taking away AP is a ploy these private schools use to remove accountability of rigor by teachers....I'd disagree.

Even though Sidwell doesn't do the best at being transparent about the benefits for students to take AP exams, we have found that the courses ARE at a high level. It does not appear to be difficult for a student who gets As in these courses to get 5s on the AP exams without putting in that much extra effort outside of class.

I would have said the purpose is to allow a rich/athletic/connected student to take the “highest level” course, and get a high grade (which is something the school can control), without there being anything suspicious about his failure to take the corresponding AP exam (the AP score being a thing that the school cannot control).