Another change to the grading policy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Great, more dumbing down and regression to the mean. These kids are bing set-up for failure. My DC had a staggering number of kids drop out of their AP classes the past few weeks, either because the kids couldn’t handle them or were too afraid of messing up their perfect GPAs.
MCPS isn’t helping kids by lowering the standards. So glad this is our last year in the system.

Our HS has had a ridiculous number of schedule changes for kids dropping from AP to Honors and Honors to on-level classes. I think this year's 11th graders have been particularly hard-hit with an overestimation of their readiness for challenging classes. They spent 9th grade on-line with no real accountability for what they actually learned. Last year in 10th grade they had overly generous grading policies that inflated their grades. 11th grade is when many students try to take AP courses for the first time in several classes, and they have been encouraged by counselors to "challenge themselves".

I teach an 11th grade Honors course. In the past 4 weeks I've had almost 30% of my students dropped from my rosters and 40% students added due to schedule changes (not specifically because they were changing levels in my subject). Big time bailout of AP classes - Language, World History, Statistics/Calculus, Science, Language. Also a lot of dropping levels in math, social studies, and science. The actual balance between number of AP/Honors/on-level sections needed is now closer to the pre-covid normal. But we started the year with more sections of higher level courses than usual. We are going to have to shift teachers and # of sections of different courses for semester B because class sizes are so unbalanced now.

Changing the grading policy may make parents and students feel better, but it won't change the underlying problem of student readiness for independent studying.

+1 Given that students still have gaps in learning from the pandemic closures - especially in math - shouldn’t all be reassessed and reassigned so they are In appropriate classes? Leave the number of assignments and grading to teachers. It’s difficult to have a blanket policy that is appropriate for all students and courses.

Final exams were removed due to the supposed stress argument. The flip side of loosing cumulative exams is that there’s no data points to demonstrate the overall course material students have mastered.

Please don't start with this again! Yes, some kids who goofed off fell behind but not everyone. Seriously, find a hobby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

Sounds great! This will allow kids to learn even more.

I am very much in favor of a reduction in student stress. I think a grading policy like this can help. I think constant testing is incredibly stressful. With 7 classes in high school. my kid seems to have some type of test every day. Often multiple tests in a day. If a retake is needed, it is no small feat to accomplish it and earn a higher grade.

There are definitely many smart kids in HS right now, who just did not receive adequate instruction (in Math and Foreign language especially), who need to have the time to learn/relearn fundamental underpinnings. This might not be a perfect plan, but I am happy to hear that MCPS has taken secondary student stress seriously and is willing to act to reduce stressors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Great, more dumbing down and regression to the mean. These kids are bing set-up for failure. My DC had a staggering number of kids drop out of their AP classes the past few weeks, either because the kids couldn’t handle them or were too afraid of messing up their perfect GPAs.
MCPS isn’t helping kids by lowering the standards. So glad this is our last year in the system.

Our HS has had a ridiculous number of schedule changes for kids dropping from AP to Honors and Honors to on-level classes. I think this year's 11th graders have been particularly hard-hit with an overestimation of their readiness for challenging classes. They spent 9th grade on-line with no real accountability for what they actually learned. Last year in 10th grade they had overly generous grading policies that inflated their grades. 11th grade is when many students try to take AP courses for the first time in several classes, and they have been encouraged by counselors to "challenge themselves".

I teach an 11th grade Honors course. In the past 4 weeks I've had almost 30% of my students dropped from my rosters and 40% students added due to schedule changes (not specifically because they were changing levels in my subject). Big time bailout of AP classes - Language, World History, Statistics/Calculus, Science, Language. Also a lot of dropping levels in math, social studies, and science. The actual balance between number of AP/Honors/on-level sections needed is now closer to the pre-covid normal. But we started the year with more sections of higher level courses than usual. We are going to have to shift teachers and # of sections of different courses for semester B because class sizes are so unbalanced now.

Changing the grading policy may make parents and students feel better, but it won't change the underlying problem of student readiness for independent studying.

+1 Given that students still have gaps in learning from the pandemic closures - especially in math - shouldn’t all be reassessed and reassigned so they are In appropriate classes? Leave the number of assignments and grading to teachers. It’s difficult to have a blanket policy that is appropriate for all students and courses.

Final exams were removed due to the supposed stress argument. The flip side of loosing cumulative exams is that there’s no data points to demonstrate the overall course material students have mastered.

Please don't start with this again! Yes, some kids who goofed off fell behind but not everyone. Seriously, find a hobby.

I guess you missed the last Board of Education meeting. Gaps in learning still exist and MCPS is still struggling to come up with a plan. It’s hard to say kids were goofing off when the curriculum was cut to make up for 1/5 less instructional time. Cumulative subjects like foreign language and math had whole units cut with no plan on how to fill in the gaps as students were passed on to the next level. That’s why so many students are struggling and therefore stressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

if any of this ia true things will be much harder than the status quo but parents as usual will push to relax the enhanced rigor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Great, more dumbing down and regression to the mean. These kids are bing set-up for failure. My DC had a staggering number of kids drop out of their AP classes the past few weeks, either because the kids couldn’t handle them or were too afraid of messing up their perfect GPAs.
MCPS isn’t helping kids by lowering the standards. So glad this is our last year in the system.

Our HS has had a ridiculous number of schedule changes for kids dropping from AP to Honors and Honors to on-level classes. I think this year's 11th graders have been particularly hard-hit with an overestimation of their readiness for challenging classes. They spent 9th grade on-line with no real accountability for what they actually learned. Last year in 10th grade they had overly generous grading policies that inflated their grades. 11th grade is when many students try to take AP courses for the first time in several classes, and they have been encouraged by counselors to "challenge themselves".

I teach an 11th grade Honors course. In the past 4 weeks I've had almost 30% of my students dropped from my rosters and 40% students added due to schedule changes (not specifically because they were changing levels in my subject). Big time bailout of AP classes - Language, World History, Statistics/Calculus, Science, Language. Also a lot of dropping levels in math, social studies, and science. The actual balance between number of AP/Honors/on-level sections needed is now closer to the pre-covid normal. But we started the year with more sections of higher level courses than usual. We are going to have to shift teachers and # of sections of different courses for semester B because class sizes are so unbalanced now.

Changing the grading policy may make parents and students feel better, but it won't change the underlying problem of student readiness for independent studying.

+1 Given that students still have gaps in learning from the pandemic closures - especially in math - shouldn’t all be reassessed and reassigned so they are In appropriate classes? Leave the number of assignments and grading to teachers. It’s difficult to have a blanket policy that is appropriate for all students and courses.

Final exams were removed due to the supposed stress argument. The flip side of loosing cumulative exams is that there’s no data points to demonstrate the overall course material students have mastered.

Please don't start with this again! Yes, some kids who goofed off fell behind but not everyone. Seriously, find a hobby.

I guess you missed the last Board of Education meeting. Gaps in learning still exist and MCPS is still struggling to come up with a plan. It’s hard to say kids were goofing off when the curriculum was cut to make up for 1/5 less instructional time. Cumulative subjects like foreign language and math had whole units cut with no plan on how to fill in the gaps as students were passed on to the next level. That’s why so many students are struggling and therefore stressed.

parents who were self-absorbed and ignored their children fell behind

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

Sounds great! This will allow kids to learn even more.

I am very much in favor of a reduction in student stress. I think a grading policy like this can help. I think constant testing is incredibly stressful. With 7 classes in high school. my kid seems to have some type of test every day. Often multiple tests in a day. If a retake is needed, it is no small feat to accomplish it and earn a higher grade.

There are definitely many smart kids in HS right now, who just did not receive adequate instruction (in Math and Foreign language especially), who need to have the time to learn/relearn fundamental underpinnings. This might not be a perfect plan, but I am happy to hear that MCPS has taken secondary student stress seriously and is willing to act to reduce stressors.

I was stressed in HS and can’t even imagine how bad it is now. My 9th grader has hours of homework and tests or quizzes nearly every day. I don’t know what the solution is but I wish they would focus more on making sure the kids are learning and absorbing the information rather than testing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

Sounds great! This will allow kids to learn even more.

I am very much in favor of a reduction in student stress. I think a grading policy like this can help. I think constant testing is incredibly stressful. With 7 classes in high school. my kid seems to have some type of test every day. Often multiple tests in a day. If a retake is needed, it is no small feat to accomplish it and earn a higher grade.

There are definitely many smart kids in HS right now, who just did not receive adequate instruction (in Math and Foreign language especially), who need to have the time to learn/relearn fundamental underpinnings. This might not be a perfect plan, but I am happy to hear that MCPS has taken secondary student stress seriously and is willing to act to reduce stressors.

I was stressed in HS and can’t even imagine how bad it is now. My 9th grader has hours of homework and tests or quizzes nearly every day. I don’t know what the solution is but I wish they would focus more on making sure the kids are learning and absorbing the information rather than testing.

Personally, these standards seem reasonable to me too. I hate it when my kid gets some crazy teacher who has them do 2X as much work as any other teacher teaching the same class. Also, sure retakes make it easier since kids get a 2nd chance but if they mange to learn the material who cares after all that's the entire point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

Sounds great! This will allow kids to learn even more.

I am very much in favor of a reduction in student stress. I think a grading policy like this can help. I think constant testing is incredibly stressful. With 7 classes in high school. my kid seems to have some type of test every day. Often multiple tests in a day. If a retake is needed, it is no small feat to accomplish it and earn a higher grade.

There are definitely many smart kids in HS right now, who just did not receive adequate instruction (in Math and Foreign language especially), who need to have the time to learn/relearn fundamental underpinnings. This might not be a perfect plan, but I am happy to hear that MCPS has taken secondary student stress seriously and is willing to act to reduce stressors.

I was stressed in HS and can’t even imagine how bad it is now. My 9th grader has hours of homework and tests or quizzes nearly every day. I don’t know what the solution is but I wish they would focus more on making sure the kids are learning and absorbing the information rather than testing.

It’s hard to manage all the various and learning styles. One kid prefers more frequent quizzes that are worth less than another kid who prefers fewer tests that cover more material and are worth more.

[Anonymous]

As a college professor, let me tell you: the # of kids who have done poorly on tests or assignments this year who have come to me saying "can't I retake this? I could always retake things high school" is alarming. I'm familiar with the concept because my kid can also retake things, but it's a really problematic disjoint between HS and college. This never happened before the pandemic (in the before times they just asked for extra credit).

The best thing you can do for your kids is tell them starting in middle school that retakes are not setting them up for success and if they want to train themselves to be less stressed out and more successful over time, they need to develop study habits that make retakes unnecessary. One here and there isn't going to be a catastrophe, but relying on the option of a retake is detrimental.

Yeah yeah I know in the real world if you don't do something well at work the first time you just fix it and don't get fired, and that's good, but tests are tests. It's like a big presentation to a client: you don't get to redo that.

[Anonymous]

I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

[Anonymous]

Watkin's Mill -soon to be the best high school in Montgomery County.

Dumb down the better schools and everyone gets a trophy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What are 90% grades and 10% grades?

The overall weight of those graded assignments on the final grade.

For example, in my child's math class, all the homework grades count towards 10% of the overall grade. Quizzes and test count toward 90% of the overall grade.

So if a child scored 100% average on all homework assignments, and 80% average on all quizzes/tests, then they end up with an 82 in the class because the homework grades can't really pull up bad quiz/test score.

Another things is that all 10% category grades are for completion (or attempt really). A student can earn a 100%, a 90% for turning it in late, or 0% for not turning it in. It’s not a true assessment of understanding. Just grade inflation. And it confusing parents who see a string of As. This is one reason MCPS finally decided to limit the number of grades in the 10% category.

OMG everything is grade inflation with you isn't it? Can this ever be about learning and retention?

I have never before posted a complaint about grade inflation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What are 90% grades and 10% grades?

The overall weight of those graded assignments on the final grade.

For example, in my child's math class, all the homework grades count towards 10% of the overall grade. Quizzes and test count toward 90% of the overall grade.

So if a child scored 100% average on all homework assignments, and 80% average on all quizzes/tests, then they end up with an 82 in the class because the homework grades can't really pull up bad quiz/test score.

Another things is that all 10% category grades are for completion (or attempt really). A student can earn a 100%, a 90% for turning it in late, or 0% for not turning it in. It’s not a true assessment of understanding. Just grade inflation. And it confusing parents who see a string of As. This is one reason MCPS finally decided to limit the number of grades in the 10% category.

OMG everything is grade inflation with you isn't it? Can this ever be about learning and retention?

I have never before posted a complaint about grade inflation.

Just try reading this forum then. Almost daily there are posts about classes being too hard or too easy. Personally, I don't care about grades just that my kid is learning the material.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

I remember only certain kids were invited to take some APs, but when the less advanced kids didn't get in, their parents would lobby the school. Once all those kids were admitted they had to dumb down the classes. My point is parents have themselves to blame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m hearing rumors that the second marking period will bring substantial and worrisome changes to the grading policy for secondary schools. Normally, I ignore rumors until I see the memo, but several reputable sources at school and county levels independently tell me and other teachers the same things:
Starting 11/9, the maximum number of assignments will be 12 for the entire marking period.
No more than 8 assignments can be in the 90% category.
All assignments in the 90% category can be redone multiple times.
This change is in response to parent complaints about student stress.

I’m very sensitive to student stress, but if this is true, I think it is alarming.

If you as a parent have complained about student stress, is this what you wanted?

Sounds great! This will allow kids to learn even more.

I am very much in favor of a reduction in student stress. I think a grading policy like this can help. I think constant testing is incredibly stressful. With 7 classes in high school. my kid seems to have some type of test every day. Often multiple tests in a day. If a retake is needed, it is no small feat to accomplish it and earn a higher grade.

There are definitely many smart kids in HS right now, who just did not receive adequate instruction (in Math and Foreign language especially), who need to have the time to learn/relearn fundamental underpinnings. This might not be a perfect plan, but I am happy to hear that MCPS has taken secondary student stress seriously and is willing to act to reduce stressors.

I was stressed in HS and can’t even imagine how bad it is now. My 9th grader has hours of homework and tests or quizzes nearly every day. I don’t know what the solution is but I wish they would focus more on making sure the kids are learning and absorbing the information rather than testing.

It’s hard to manage all the various and learning styles. One kid prefers more frequent quizzes that are worth less than another kid who prefers fewer tests that cover more material and are worth more.

That's interesting. I hope they learn to adapt. I hear that's an important skill in life.