Another change to the grading policy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

Seems like more and more kids are entering college with more APs than ever so someone is doing well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

Seems like more and more kids are entering college with more APs than ever so someone is doing well.

More kids are taking APs than before because institutional barriers to opportunity are being dismantled. It doesn’t mean the students taking them are highly gifted. I’ve taught AP in MCPS. You don’t need to be highly gifted to earn AP credits. The biggest factor is a willingness to put on the hard work or learning the material and taking practice exams. Many students willing to do that were tracked out of AP in the past. Even those not officially tracked out were sometimes made to feel unwelcome. One of my daughters was “welcomed” on her first day in her first AP class with “Are you sure you are in the right class?” when she walked in and took a seat. The teacher couldn’t seem to explain to me, the guidance counselor, and the principal why he greeted the sole AA student that way, but it was hard for him to deny since several students heard him say it. I’m happy to report that 13 years later when he had my son and several other boys of color, the teacher managed to keep any surprise he had to himself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Great, more dumbing down and regression to the mean. These kids are bing set-up for failure. My DC had a staggering number of kids drop out of their AP classes the past few weeks, either because the kids couldn’t handle them or were too afraid of messing up their perfect GPAs.
MCPS isn’t helping kids by lowering the standards. So glad this is our last year in the system.

Yes, this is not how to treat stress. What about wellness rooms and tutoring?

[Anonymous]

Anyone else’s school (or just a department at the school) change to standards based grading? My child’s English department now no longer gives a single grade for a paper but assesses essays for different standards such as dialogue/thesis etc. These can be reassessed. Once my child “shows mastery” (gets an A?) then they aren’t assessed on that skill any longer. Grade on that can’t go down. Curious if it’s just my kid’s school or if this is everywhere. Seems like it would make sense for math…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

Seems like more and more kids are entering college with more APs than ever so someone is doing well.

More kids are taking APs than before because institutional barriers to opportunity are being dismantled. It doesn’t mean the students taking them are highly gifted. I’ve taught AP in MCPS. You don’t need to be highly gifted to earn AP credits. The biggest factor is a willingness to put on the hard work or learning the material and taking practice exams. Many students willing to do that were tracked out of AP in the past. Even those not officially tracked out were sometimes made to feel unwelcome. One of my daughters was “welcomed” on her first day in her first AP class with “Are you sure you are in the right class?” when she walked in and took a seat. The teacher couldn’t seem to explain to me, the guidance counselor, and the principal why he greeted the sole AA student that way, but it was hard for him to deny since several students heard him say it. I’m happy to report that 13 years later when he had my son and several other boys of color, the teacher managed to keep any surprise he had to himself.

I don't know if its any consolation but I have a disability and growing up several decades ago met with similar skepticism despite being one of the top students in these classes. I had to actually fight to even be allowed. They'd tell me it will be hard for you to keep up. Somehow I managed straight A's in all these classes. I also went on to win about 30 academic awards by competing at the state level in one subject. The year I graduated a person from the county asked me my secret since nobody else with similar issues had done as well. My answer was it my disability wasn't a factor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else’s school (or just a department at the school) change to standards based grading? My child’s English department now no longer gives a single grade for a paper but assesses essays for different standards such as dialogue/thesis etc. These can be reassessed. Once my child “shows mastery” (gets an A?) then they aren’t assessed on that skill any longer. Grade on that can’t go down. Curious if it’s just my kid’s school or if this is everywhere. Seems like it would make sense for math…

bump

anyone?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else’s school (or just a department at the school) change to standards based grading? My child’s English department now no longer gives a single grade for a paper but assesses essays for different standards such as dialogue/thesis etc. These can be reassessed. Once my child “shows mastery” (gets an A?) then they aren’t assessed on that skill any longer. Grade on that can’t go down. Curious if it’s just my kid’s school or if this is everywhere. Seems like it would make sense for math…

Yes, my 9th grader's English class is using mastery grading. I don't fully understand how it works, but it sounds like it was a new change this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else’s school (or just a department at the school) change to standards based grading? My child’s English department now no longer gives a single grade for a paper but assesses essays for different standards such as dialogue/thesis etc. These can be reassessed. Once my child “shows mastery” (gets an A?) then they aren’t assessed on that skill any longer. Grade on that can’t go down. Curious if it’s just my kid’s school or if this is everywhere. Seems like it would make sense for math…

Yes, my 9th grader's English class is using mastery grading. I don't fully understand how it works, but it sounds like it was a new change this year.

More evidence that these changes happen without a lot of public hoopla.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Anyone else’s school (or just a department at the school) change to standards based grading? My child’s English department now no longer gives a single grade for a paper but assesses essays for different standards such as dialogue/thesis etc. These can be reassessed. Once my child “shows mastery” (gets an A?) then they aren’t assessed on that skill any longer. Grade on that can’t go down. Curious if it’s just my kid’s school or if this is everywhere. Seems like it would make sense for math…

Yes, my 9th grader's English class is using mastery grading. I don't fully understand how it works, but it sounds like it was a new change this year.

More evidence that these changes happen without a lot of public hoopla.

Sounds wonderful!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is grading policy on the next BOE meeting agenda? Wouldn't the members need to vote on this?

When did the BOE vote that the retake grade didn’t replace the original grade if the original grade was higher? Because that is a new policy this year and I don’t remember the BOE ever discussing it.

OP has a misleading title. There is no proposed change to grading Policies, which would go through an entire committee review and public comment period, before the BOE votes on it.

What OP is sharing is a rumor that the guidance for implementing the policies may change. This has nitty gritty details that are intended to ensure uniform practices across MCPS and became necessary to describe in detail during the pandemic. You can find the guidance here:
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/info/grading/report-cards-secondary.aspx

Thanks, PP. I'm so tired of these fictions from crazy right-wing MCPS board trolls just sowing public resentment and mistrust.

This is clearly just a troll since there's no such item on the board's agenda next month.

Agree but the funny part is I think the changes are reasonable. Basically giving students a practice test so they know what to expect and setting an upper boundary on assignments that results in no more than one assignment per day over a quarter seems great. Still sure this is all fiction so it doesn't matter.

Isn’t that what quizzes were for? A practice before the test.

Unless the assessment is returned to the student, no matter what title you give the assessment, the student is not receiving feedback necessary on the practice. Students need an opportunity to learn from their mistakes.

This may make sense for classes like math or chem where applying formulas takes rote practice and seeing the error of your ways is very beneficial and should be mastered for progression. But for art or english or history or sociology...you either showed up and read and engaged or you didn't. (Yes, sometimes we have quizzes and tests, too.) I am not writing two tests to pander to people who didn't study. Especially when I provide a study guide. Especially[i] when my tests are open note/book.

For English, social studies, and sociology - students still need feedback. There are many reasons why a student doesn’t learn a concept.

All of your tests are open note? No responsibility for any historical knowledge?

- another History teacher

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is grading policy on the next BOE meeting agenda? Wouldn't the members need to vote on this?

When did the BOE vote that the retake grade didn’t replace the original grade if the original grade was higher? Because that is a new policy this year and I don’t remember the BOE ever discussing it.

OP has a misleading title. There is no proposed change to grading Policies, which would go through an entire committee review and public comment period, before the BOE votes on it.

What OP is sharing is a rumor that the guidance for implementing the policies may change. This has nitty gritty details that are intended to ensure uniform practices across MCPS and became necessary to describe in detail during the pandemic. You can find the guidance here:
https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/info/grading/report-cards-secondary.aspx

Thanks, PP. I'm so tired of these fictions from crazy right-wing MCPS board trolls just sowing public resentment and mistrust.

This is clearly just a troll since there's no such item on the board's agenda next month.

Agree but the funny part is I think the changes are reasonable. Basically giving students a practice test so they know what to expect and setting an upper boundary on assignments that results in no more than one assignment per day over a quarter seems great. Still sure this is all fiction so it doesn't matter.

Isn’t that what quizzes were for? A practice before the test.

Unless the assessment is returned to the student, no matter what title you give the assessment, the student is not receiving feedback necessary on the practice. Students need an opportunity to learn from their mistakes.

This may make sense for classes like math or chem where applying formulas takes rote practice and seeing the error of your ways is very beneficial and should be mastered for progression. But for art or english or history or sociology...you either showed up and read and engaged or you didn't. (Yes, sometimes we have quizzes and tests, too.) I am not writing two tests to pander to people who didn't study. Especially when I provide a study guide. Especially[i] when my tests are open note/book.

For English, social studies, and sociology - students still need feedback. There are many reasons why a student doesn’t learn a concept.

All of your tests are open note? No responsibility for any historical knowledge?

- another History teacher

I wondered about that, too. Personally, I don’t care about memorizing dates or such, but having taught both AP and actual college courses, I’d consider students poorly prepared if all of their assessments were open note.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

Seems like more and more kids are entering college with more APs than ever so someone is doing well.

More kids are taking APs than before because institutional barriers to opportunity are being dismantled. It doesn’t mean the students taking them are highly gifted. I’ve taught AP in MCPS. You don’t need to be highly gifted to earn AP credits. The biggest factor is a willingness to put on the hard work or learning the material and taking practice exams. Many students willing to do that were tracked out of AP in the past. Even those not officially tracked out were sometimes made to feel unwelcome. One of my daughters was “welcomed” on her first day in her first AP class with “Are you sure you are in the right class?” when she walked in and took a seat. The teacher couldn’t seem to explain to me, the guidance counselor, and the principal why he greeted the sole AA student that way, but it was hard for him to deny since several students heard him say it. I’m happy to report that 13 years later when he had my son and several other boys of color, the teacher managed to keep any surprise he had to himself.

You’ve told this story before and it was too bad. But the pendulum has swung too far. I am an AP teacher on several Teacher fora. There are many teachers saying that the majority of their students are below grade level. That is a problem for those who could actually handle college level work, because they are not getting that. Scores also don’t measure the decline as the exams have changed along with the classrooms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I also wonder if AP and Honors being default for our middle of the road or better kids isn't driving these policies? APs and Honors used to be for exceptional learners. These are the kids who can typically handle these stressors. Maybe there are more stressed out kids now, in part, because we are forcing them into unnecessarily stressful situations for the sake of our pride or "college admissions" or to keep up with the neighbors' kids.

+1 billion

You’ve never taught in a MCPS magnet if you think highly gifted kids can handle these stressers. Many of them freak out or freeze when the workload is intense.

Seems like more and more kids are entering college with more APs than ever so someone is doing well.

More kids are taking APs than before because institutional barriers to opportunity are being dismantled. It doesn’t mean the students taking them are highly gifted. I’ve taught AP in MCPS. You don’t need to be highly gifted to earn AP credits. The biggest factor is a willingness to put on the hard work or learning the material and taking practice exams. Many students willing to do that were tracked out of AP in the past. Even those not officially tracked out were sometimes made to feel unwelcome. One of my daughters was “welcomed” on her first day in her first AP class with “Are you sure you are in the right class?” when she walked in and took a seat. The teacher couldn’t seem to explain to me, the guidance counselor, and the principal why he greeted the sole AA student that way, but it was hard for him to deny since several students heard him say it. I’m happy to report that 13 years later when he had my son and several other boys of color, the teacher managed to keep any surprise he had to himself.

You’ve told this story before and it was too bad. But the pendulum has swung too far. I am an AP teacher on several Teacher fora. There are many teachers saying that the majority of their students are below grade level. That is a problem for those who could actually handle college level work, because they are not getting that. Scores also don’t measure the decline as the exams have changed along with the classrooms.

If you think I’ve told this story on DCUM or any social media before, it’s because someone else had the same experience. Likely several other people.

[Anonymous]

I have one in MS and one in HS, and between the two there are several teachers who have retake policies really focused on learning. So, you can retake the test, but only if you turn in complete corrections on the original test. For at least one, you even have to explain your mistakes (not just give the correct answer) before you can retake. To me, this is a great way to reduce student stress while making sure the kids really know the content. This doesn’t seem to be true in every class, but the teachers with this policy teach different subjects - math, Spanish, and history.