MCPS faces Teacher shortage next year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCEA is committed to the salary steps which keep experienced teachers from earning decent pay when transferring to MCPS. MCEA is a big part of the problem. They also keep sub pay low. I would not recommend voting for any MCEA endorsed BOE candidates (Yang, Coll, Rivera-Oven).

If you had witnessed any part of the public contract negotiations that took place before the pandemic, you would know that is completely untrue. MCEA submitted proposals based on a perceived professional salary of $100k and how long one would expect to get to that level. They also requested dramatic increases in substitute teacher pay. MCPS responded with some gobbledegook of a salary scale which actually included pay decreases for more experienced staff. When called on it, they withdrew the counter offer and did not submit a new one. Increasing teacher pay and planning time have been priorities in MCEA bargaining. Which you would know, again, if you had witnessed any part of the negotiations.

I’m not the PP. I read that as MCEA discourages experienced teachers from transferring in. I don’t think she was referring to existing MCPS teachers.

I posted above about being offered a position. I was offered a job that would pay me 25K less than the published step I should be on if they respected my experience. Instead, I went to a neighboring county that offered me $19K more than MCPS offered. Truthfully, I felt rather disrespected by MCPS. The offer was rather insulting considering my experience and qualifications. (I also received a private school offer that was more than MCPS’s offer.)

Name the school district. I don’t believe you. I have 20 years experience at even though I would enter at a higher step in PG, Howard and Fairfax County, it wasn’t step 20 and the pay wasn’t that much (if at all) higher than MCPS. Also, I spent 9 years working in a MoCo private school with $40k annual tuition and I was paid exactly what MCPS would have paid me at the REDUCED entry of step 8. When I first moved to Maryland in 2012, MCPS allowed external candidates with a Master’s to enter at step 12. Then it was reduced to step 10 and now it’s step 8.

MCPS step 18 Masters - 102K
MCPS step 8 Masters (top salary for transfer) - 73K
PGCPS step 18 Masters - 88K
HCPSS step 18 Masters - 91K
Fairfax County step 13 Masters - 85K - cap for transfers is 13 and still higher than MCPS


What’s there not to believe? So the numbers may have been a bit off because I’m using current salary scales, but the point remains. MCPS is not attractive to experienced teachers.

As for your private experience, private schools vary WIDELY.

The point is your numbers were off and that ALL experienced teachers get paid less when moving districts. It’s unfortunate because these policies were designed for folks within 3-5 years of retirement trying to game the pension formulas. In reality, we have recessions and reductions in force that cause many people to pick and move where they can find a job.

Also, don’t forget to calculate benefits. How do the health and county pensions compare? Oh wait, some of those districts don’t have county pensions in addition to state pensions. What are the health care costs for retirees? I guarantee this is where you see the stark differences. Current employees are paying the costs of retirees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“As of June 13, there were 581 unfilled positions. Meanwhile, 973 teachers have indicated they will be resigning or retiring.“


https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-faces-teacher-shortage-for-next-school-year/


No mention of staffing for student support or bus driver positions.

Omg omg the sky is falling!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCEA is committed to the salary steps which keep experienced teachers from earning decent pay when transferring to MCPS. MCEA is a big part of the problem. They also keep sub pay low. I would not recommend voting for any MCEA endorsed BOE candidates (Yang, Coll, Rivera-Oven).

If you had witnessed any part of the public contract negotiations that took place before the pandemic, you would know that is completely untrue. MCEA submitted proposals based on a perceived professional salary of $100k and how long one would expect to get to that level. They also requested dramatic increases in substitute teacher pay. MCPS responded with some gobbledegook of a salary scale which actually included pay decreases for more experienced staff. When called on it, they withdrew the counter offer and did not submit a new one. Increasing teacher pay and planning time have been priorities in MCEA bargaining. Which you would know, again, if you had witnessed any part of the negotiations.

I’m not the PP. I read that as MCEA discourages experienced teachers from transferring in. I don’t think she was referring to existing MCPS teachers.

I posted above about being offered a position. I was offered a job that would pay me 25K less than the published step I should be on if they respected my experience. Instead, I went to a neighboring county that offered me $19K more than MCPS offered. Truthfully, I felt rather disrespected by MCPS. The offer was rather insulting considering my experience and qualifications. (I also received a private school offer that was more than MCPS’s offer.)

Name the school district. I don’t believe you. I have 20 years experience at even though I would enter at a higher step in PG, Howard and Fairfax County, it wasn’t step 20 and the pay wasn’t that much (if at all) higher than MCPS. Also, I spent 9 years working in a MoCo private school with $40k annual tuition and I was paid exactly what MCPS would have paid me at the REDUCED entry of step 8. When I first moved to Maryland in 2012, MCPS allowed external candidates with a Master’s to enter at step 12. Then it was reduced to step 10 and now it’s step 8.

MCPS step 18 Masters - 102K
MCPS step 8 Masters (top salary for transfer) - 73K
PGCPS step 18 Masters - 88K
HCPSS step 18 Masters - 91K
Fairfax County step 13 Masters - 85K - cap for transfers is 13 and still higher than MCPS


What’s there not to believe? So the numbers may have been a bit off because I’m using current salary scales, but the point remains. MCPS is not attractive to experienced teachers.

As for your private experience, private schools vary WIDELY.

Yea, private school pay does vary widely. However, the salaries I’ve been offered at other local private schools was still below $80k. My spouse works in DC private that costs over $40k a year and gets paid $70k on the dot. Health insurance at private schools is also terrible. This is one of the main reasons I’m moving back to public. There are no pensions for private school teachers and you’re at the whim of the stock market in your 403b. If you’re lucky you will get a percentage or 2 of matching from the school. My private school offered 50% tuition remission (valued at $20k/kid) plus free aftercare. My spouse gets 80% tuition remission. This is how private schools justify paying their teachers so little

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCEA is committed to the salary steps which keep experienced teachers from earning decent pay when transferring to MCPS. MCEA is a big part of the problem. They also keep sub pay low. I would not recommend voting for any MCEA endorsed BOE candidates (Yang, Coll, Rivera-Oven).

If you had witnessed any part of the public contract negotiations that took place before the pandemic, you would know that is completely untrue. MCEA submitted proposals based on a perceived professional salary of $100k and how long one would expect to get to that level. They also requested dramatic increases in substitute teacher pay. MCPS responded with some gobbledegook of a salary scale which actually included pay decreases for more experienced staff. When called on it, they withdrew the counter offer and did not submit a new one. Increasing teacher pay and planning time have been priorities in MCEA bargaining. Which you would know, again, if you had witnessed any part of the negotiations.

I’m not the PP. I read that as MCEA discourages experienced teachers from transferring in. I don’t think she was referring to existing MCPS teachers.

I posted above about being offered a position. I was offered a job that would pay me 25K less than the published step I should be on if they respected my experience. Instead, I went to a neighboring county that offered me $19K more than MCPS offered. Truthfully, I felt rather disrespected by MCPS. The offer was rather insulting considering my experience and qualifications. (I also received a private school offer that was more than MCPS’s offer.)

Name the school district. I don’t believe you. I have 20 years experience at even though I would enter at a higher step in PG, Howard and Fairfax County, it wasn’t step 20 and the pay wasn’t that much (if at all) higher than MCPS. Also, I spent 9 years working in a MoCo private school with $40k annual tuition and I was paid exactly what MCPS would have paid me at the REDUCED entry of step 8. When I first moved to Maryland in 2012, MCPS allowed external candidates with a Master’s to enter at step 12. Then it was reduced to step 10 and now it’s step 8.

MCPS step 18 Masters - 102K
MCPS step 8 Masters (top salary for transfer) - 73K
PGCPS step 18 Masters - 88K
HCPSS step 18 Masters - 91K
Fairfax County step 13 Masters - 85K - cap for transfers is 13 and still higher than MCPS


What’s there not to believe? So the numbers may have been a bit off because I’m using current salary scales, but the point remains. MCPS is not attractive to experienced teachers.

As for your private experience, private schools vary WIDELY.

The point is your numbers were off and that ALL experienced teachers get paid less when moving districts. It’s unfortunate because these policies were designed for folks within 3-5 years of retirement trying to game the pension formulas. In reality, we have recessions and reductions in force that cause many people to pick and move where they can find a job.

Also, don’t forget to calculate benefits. How do the health and county pensions compare? Oh wait, some of those districts don’t have county pensions in addition to state pensions. What are the health care costs for retirees? I guarantee this is where you see the stark differences. Current employees are paying the costs of retirees.

The numbers weren’t off enough to make a difference. I initially said I was offered 25K less than a MCPS teacher with similar experience. It seems that number has actually grown to almost 30K using the current salary scale.

The county pension would only make a difference if an older teacher could stay long enough to be vested. Otherwise, it’s not a major factor that is going to replace a 30K reduction in salary. As for the state pension, that travels with you. Health care? A stellar plan still isn’t going to make up for that severe drop in pay.

My point is that MCPS isn’t appealing for transferring teachers with many years of experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“As of June 13, there were 581 unfilled positions. Meanwhile, 973 teachers have indicated they will be resigning or retiring.“


https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-faces-teacher-shortage-for-next-school-year/


No mention of staffing for student support or bus driver positions.

These are ghost positions. They do not really intend to fill them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“As of June 13, there were 581 unfilled positions. Meanwhile, 973 teachers have indicated they will be resigning or retiring.“


https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-faces-teacher-shortage-for-next-school-year/


No mention of staffing for student support or bus driver positions.

These are ghost positions. They do not really intend to fill them

So shouldn’t the budget then be adjusted? What did MCPS do with the funding this year for the open positions that were not filled? What did they do with last year’s surplus?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCEA is committed to the salary steps which keep experienced teachers from earning decent pay when transferring to MCPS. MCEA is a big part of the problem. They also keep sub pay low. I would not recommend voting for any MCEA endorsed BOE candidates (Yang, Coll, Rivera-Oven).

If you had witnessed any part of the public contract negotiations that took place before the pandemic, you would know that is completely untrue. MCEA submitted proposals based on a perceived professional salary of $100k and how long one would expect to get to that level. They also requested dramatic increases in substitute teacher pay. MCPS responded with some gobbledegook of a salary scale which actually included pay decreases for more experienced staff. When called on it, they withdrew the counter offer and did not submit a new one. Increasing teacher pay and planning time have been priorities in MCEA bargaining. Which you would know, again, if you had witnessed any part of the negotiations.

I’m not the PP. I read that as MCEA discourages experienced teachers from transferring in. I don’t think she was referring to existing MCPS teachers.

I posted above about being offered a position. I was offered a job that would pay me 25K less than the published step I should be on if they respected my experience. Instead, I went to a neighboring county that offered me $19K more than MCPS offered. Truthfully, I felt rather disrespected by MCPS. The offer was rather insulting considering my experience and qualifications. (I also received a private school offer that was more than MCPS’s offer.)

MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.


Name the school district. I don’t believe you. I have 20 years experience at even though I would enter at a higher step in PG, Howard and Fairfax County, it wasn’t step 20 and the pay wasn’t that much (if at all) higher than MCPS. Also, I spent 9 years working in a MoCo private school with $40k annual tuition and I was paid exactly what MCPS would have paid me at the REDUCED entry of step 8. When I first moved to Maryland in 2012, MCPS allowed external candidates with a Master’s to enter at step 12. Then it was reduced to step 10 and now it’s step 8.

MCPS step 18 Masters - 102K
MCPS step 8 Masters (top salary for transfer) - 73K
PGCPS step 18 Masters - 88K
HCPSS step 18 Masters - 91K
Fairfax County step 13 Masters - 85K - cap for transfers is 13 and still higher than MCPS


What’s there not to believe? So the numbers may have been a bit off because I’m using current salary scales, but the point remains. MCPS is not attractive to experienced teachers.

As for your private experience, private schools vary WIDELY.

The point is your numbers were off and that ALL experienced teachers get paid less when moving districts. It’s unfortunate because these policies were designed for folks within 3-5 years of retirement trying to game the pension formulas. In reality, we have recessions and reductions in force that cause many people to pick and move where they can find a job.

Also, don’t forget to calculate benefits. How do the health and county pensions compare? Oh wait, some of those districts don’t have county pensions in addition to state pensions. What are the health care costs for retirees? I guarantee this is where you see the stark differences. Current employees are paying the costs of retirees.

The numbers weren’t off enough to make a difference. I initially said I was offered 25K less than a MCPS teacher with similar experience. It seems that number has actually grown to almost 30K using the current salary scale.

The county pension would only make a difference if an older teacher could stay long enough to be vested. Otherwise, it’s not a major factor that is going to replace a 30K reduction in salary. As for the state pension, that travels with you. Health care? A stellar plan still isn’t going to make up for that severe drop in pay.

My point is that MCPS isn’t appealing for transferring teachers with many years of experience.

[Anonymous]

MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“As of June 13, there were 581 unfilled positions. Meanwhile, 973 teachers have indicated they will be resigning or retiring.“

https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-faces-teacher-shortage-for-next-school-year/

No mention of staffing for student support or bus driver positions.

Just as a point of clarification, that 581 already accounts for the 973 teachers who resigned or retired. In other words, many of those positions have already been filled. Right now there's ~110 HS positions open, 1/3 of which are special education. Usually around this time the HS positions are ~60-70. There may still be more resignations during summer, as teachers rethink future options.

Yes, there are more open positions than usual and it is harder to find qualified and interested candidates. No, the sky is not falling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“As of June 13, there were 581 unfilled positions. Meanwhile, 973 teachers have indicated they will be resigning or retiring.“


https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-faces-teacher-shortage-for-next-school-year/


No mention of staffing for student support or bus driver positions.

These are ghost positions. They do not really intend to fill them

So shouldn’t the budget then be adjusted? What did MCPS do with the funding this year for the open positions that were not filled? What did they do with last year’s surplus?

Paid some (but not enough) subs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.

Really? My friends daughter graduated Magna Cum Laude from college this spring with a degree in elementary education. Excellent reviews from her student teaching. A very smart, well spoken and engaging young lady. I could not believe how many jobs she was turned down for. I thought any elementary school in the county would grab her up quickly but instead she was turned down multiple times. I was shocked. All I could think was- "I guess MCPS doesn't want to hire smart, talented, highly motivated young teachers." Fortunately, she's now been offered a teaching position in the county, but she was just about to start looking at Howard and Fairfax. I was absolutely dumbfounded.

[Anonymous]

We lost 3 teachers at my MCPS elementary school last week. People are just done!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.

Really? My friends daughter graduated Magna Cum Laude from college this spring with a degree in elementary education. Excellent reviews from her student teaching. A very smart, well spoken and engaging young lady. I could not believe how many jobs she was turned down for. I thought any elementary school in the county would grab her up quickly but instead she was turned down multiple times. I was shocked. All I could think was- "I guess MCPS doesn't want to hire smart, talented, highly motivated young teachers." Fortunately, she's now been offered a teaching position in the county, but she was just about to start looking at Howard and Fairfax. I was absolutely dumbfounded.

That's at the county and policy level. I'm sure individual principals still prize experience in staff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.

Really? My friends daughter graduated Magna Cum Laude from college this spring with a degree in elementary education. Excellent reviews from her student teaching. A very smart, well spoken and engaging young lady. I could not believe how many jobs she was turned down for. I thought any elementary school in the county would grab her up quickly but instead she was turned down multiple times. I was shocked. All I could think was- "I guess MCPS doesn't want to hire smart, talented, highly motivated young teachers." Fortunately, she's now been offered a teaching position in the county, but she was just about to start looking at Howard and Fairfax. I was absolutely dumbfounded.

That's at the county and policy level. I'm sure individual principals still prize experience in staff.

Right- although there is a teacher shortage overall, some MCPS schools are still considered relatively desirable places to work and have a higher number of applicants to fill a position. So those will be more competitive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:MCPS doesn't actually want experienced, expensive teachers. It wants to hire cheap, impressionable young teachers.

Really? My friends daughter graduated Magna Cum Laude from college this spring with a degree in elementary education. Excellent reviews from her student teaching. A very smart, well spoken and engaging young lady. I could not believe how many jobs she was turned down for. I thought any elementary school in the county would grab her up quickly but instead she was turned down multiple times. I was shocked. All I could think was- "I guess MCPS doesn't want to hire smart, talented, highly motivated young teachers." Fortunately, she's now been offered a teaching position in the county, but she was just about to start looking at Howard and Fairfax. I was absolutely dumbfounded.

Maybe she doesn't interview well? (I don't mean that disparagingly) You can have all of the credentials, be brilliant, etc. but don't just don't have interview skills.