Study: "Discussions of D.C. public school options in an online forum" (yes, this one)

[Anonymous]

Sorry if this is an ignorant question, but doesn't the Walton family foundation support charters and privatization of education? Doesn't this study comes out sort of anti charter?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:This is their conclusion:

The conversations on DC Urban Moms illustrate what other research has also shown: When privileged parents choose, they tend to choose segregation

This is an extremely unfair characterization that completely misses the nuanced and complex reality. It is extremely disappointing to see such drivel presented as serious research.

Whether it’s the case on DCUM or not, this is a fundamental finding of several studies. And seems consistent with what I’ve see in DC.

So if other people are saying it, it must be true? This seems kind of nutty. It suggests that rich white people are choosing to send their kids to inferior schools simply because they are predominantly white. That just seems obviously wrong, and actively misleading. First of all, aside from private schools, is there a single public school in DC that is predominantly white? Second, the reality is that DC has a few good public high schools and lots and lots of really bad ones. It shouldnt be surprising that lots of people are trying to not go to the bad ones.

I assume you don’t live in DC. At the elementary level there are several majority white schools, both WOTP and on the Hill.

[Anonymous]

I agree, Nothing worse than being called a racist for simply wanting the best for one’s family!

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Nonetheless, the language on the site can be extreme. “Let the Hunger Games BEGINNNNNN!” writes one commenter in a 2015 thread, comparing the school lottery to a fictional dystopia in which children are forced to fight to the death"

That was a JOKE. They are noticing the very thing you are critiquing and making fun of it.

The same thing happened when the Washington City Paper did the famous "Mommy Fight Site" article. They took a clearly sarcastic post and treated it as if it were serious.

Oh, c'mon - DCUM as a site driven by snarky dismissiveness is like it's brand identity. Whatever you think of the Brookings report, WCP was funny and not out to lunch. Even Washingtonian pretty much agrees: https://www.washingtonian.com/2021/03/30/dc-urban-moms-the-catty-parenting-site-of-washingtons-elite-is-now-the-subject-of-academic-research-on-segregation/

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Nonetheless, the language on the site can be extreme. “Let the Hunger Games BEGINNNNNN!” writes one commenter in a 2015 thread, comparing the school lottery to a fictional dystopia in which children are forced to fight to the death"

That was a JOKE. They are noticing the very thing you are critiquing and making fun of it.

The same thing happened when the Washington City Paper did the famous "Mommy Fight Site" article. They took a clearly sarcastic post and treated it as if it were serious.

Oh, c'mon - DCUM as a site driven by snarky dismissiveness is like it's brand identity. Whatever you think of the Brookings report, WCP was funny and not out to lunch. Even Washingtonian pretty much agrees: https://www.washingtonian.com/2021/03/30/dc-urban-moms-the-catty-parenting-site-of-washingtons-elite-is-now-the-subject-of-academic-research-on-segregation/

I agree with you. The City Paper should have treated obvious snark as snark. Instead they treated it like a serious statement.

[Anonymous]

I’m a single mom who lives in upper NW DC and work in Bethesda. So now I am a racist because I wanted a short commute and decent schools? Guess I should have just picked an apartment in Bethesda. Damned if you do and damned if you don’t!

[Anonymous]

I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

[Anonymous]

I asked this in the other thread but it occurred to me maybe this is the better place to ask:

Out of curiosity, is there anyone who believes the actual academic scholarship done here (word frequency analysis without contextual controls) qualifies as good scholarship? I'm not sure I have seen a Brookings-level report before where the discussion about the publication is so unanimous in agreement that the underlying methodology is significantly flawed. Maybe I am missing something, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

Dude, I am glad there is somebody else here who agrees with me. Granted this site is anonymous so this makes no sense, but I hope to see you around. A whole lot of picking apart a so-so study so that its core truths don't have to be considered by people who don't want to "be the change they supposedly want to see."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:This is their conclusion:

The conversations on DC Urban Moms illustrate what other research has also shown: When privileged parents choose, they tend to choose segregation

This is an extremely unfair characterization that completely misses the nuanced and complex reality. It is extremely disappointing to see such drivel presented as serious research.

Whether it’s the case on DCUM or not, this is a fundamental finding of several studies. And seems consistent with what I’ve see in DC.

So if other people are saying it, it must be true? This seems kind of nutty. It suggests that rich white people are choosing to send their kids to inferior schools simply because they are predominantly white. That just seems obviously wrong, and actively misleading. First of all, aside from private schools, is there a single public school in DC that is predominantly white? Second, the reality is that DC has a few good public high schools and lots and lots of really bad ones. It shouldnt be surprising that lots of people are trying to not go to the bad ones.

That's what segregation used to be, now the concern is whether or not the school is primarily FARMS. Deal is 14% FARMS, 4% ELL. Wilson Jumps to 27% FARMS and 9% ELL, but those numbers are nothing compared to Eastern, Dunbar, Roosevelt, Coolidge...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

Dude, I am glad there is somebody else here who agrees with me. Granted this site is anonymous so this makes no sense, but I hope to see you around. A whole lot of picking apart a so-so study so that its core truths don't have to be considered by people who don't want to "be the change they supposedly want to see."

+2, I'm a black PP and made a couple comments in a similar vein about Banneker and Shepherd but PP really spelled it out. I also thought the bolded re: Banneker being an HBCU type of HS rang hollow. Folks twist themselves in knots to justify their choices--they want schools with the most white kids possible, even within a majority minority school system, because they feel these schools will be the "best" of the available options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

Dude, I am glad there is somebody else here who agrees with me. Granted this site is anonymous so this makes no sense, but I hope to see you around. A whole lot of picking apart a so-so study so that its core truths don't have to be considered by people who don't want to "be the change they supposedly want to see."

+100 the methodology of the study may be flawed, but the conclusions have truth.

The liberals in this city make the most racist decisions I have ever seen when it comes to choosing schools for their kids. Just because you are making anti-racist choices in other areas doesn't make these choices any less racist. In fact it kinda makes it worse IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

I would love for my kids to go there. It's a peer group I'd be thrilled to put my kids in. I don't know why this isn't a more popular viewpoint. Maybe people are willing to be an only when they don't have other options, and by the time you make it through middle school and to high school, you have other options.

[Anonymous]

Thanks. Long PP Banneker poster. Glad to see I’m not on an island. Look, I get that it can be scary to be a first. But it’s done all the time. I get the sense that once a DC school gets to about 10% white, it seems ripe for gentrifying for white folk. They usually do this in an concerted, planned effort. (See CH schools and most recently Hardy middle school). Recent parents that have begun to gentrify Hardy are not your typical “racist”, sure. They wouldn’t even consider any DC schools if that were the case, yet alone one that is 80% black. But there is still something inherently racist about not considering one of the top schools in the country. Especially Banneker. I mean it’s not a Lean On Me type school. You’re DC is not going to be jumped for wearing the wrong colors.

Seriously, why haven’t a group of 10-20 families joined together to commit to Banneker the same way they did to Hardy 5 years ago?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry but I just can’t with this thread.

Until someone can give me a solid reason white folks in DC don’t flock to Banneker, I will not just swallow that we all want what is best for our children even if it happens to mean keeping our children segregated in schools that are 5% black.

1.) The most recent narrative that Banneker is just too precious of a school for the black community for white folks to mess up a good thing is bulls$&@. 20 years ago, Walls was 13% white and 73% black. Today it’s 50% white and 25% black. White folk had zero problems gentrifying Walls but won’t touch Banneker with a 10 foot pole.

2.) The other BS excuse that Banneker SAT scores are merely right above average don’t take into account that Banneker is an all black school. So its 1120 SAT scores should be measured against national averages for black students (946). Let’s not even get into income inequality. Did you know the average white student with family below poverty scores 130 points higher than the average black student? Anyone that has even the most basic understanding of statistics knows not to measure the SATs at Banneker to nationwide but they continue to site this as an excuse of not being interested in Banneker.

Banneker is top 100 high schools in the nation and is is tied for first in the nation for Math and Reading Performance Rank (How aggregated scores on state assessments compare to U.S. News' expectations given the proportions of students who are black, Hispanic and from low-income households). Imagine how your brilliant white student can excel there.

3.) Banneker is just too hard of a school - See Basis, TJ

4.) I plan to “look” at Banneker when my 1st grader is old enough - yeah we’ve heard that before.

5.) I don’t want my child to be an only - what did white patents 20 years ago think when they gentrified Walls, Deal, Wilson and are doing now on the Hill and at Shepherd?

6.) My child wants to play X sport - recent Banneker grad played football (and maybe track) at Roosevelt and was a super star gaining admissions to various Ivy League schools

Sure, Banneker is not for everyone. But certainly it’s a good fit for more than the 2 white kids that attend every year.

Supporting arguments: see Creative Minds popularity vs nearby Whittier, Barnard, Truesdell etc.

I would love for my kids to go there. It's a peer group I'd be thrilled to put my kids in. I don't know why this isn't a more popular viewpoint. Maybe people are willing to be an only when they don't have other options, and by the time you make it through middle school and to high school, you have other options.

I will file you under excuse #4. Not sure I buy your second part of having other options for high school being as though there are kids that don’t get into Walls and settle for Wilson (and not because they’re athletes).

Next?!