APS: Elementary Walk Zone surveys out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:APS doesn’t care why UMC families choice out. They know why, and they simply don’t care.

.

So just let them choice into a school like Tuckahoe, McKinley, Reed, Nottingham or where ever there will be space....

Fine with me
-future Randolph parent

What about those who just want a decent school that actually reflects the community within its boundaries? Does aps really feel it has no obligation to respond to make neighborhood schools attractive to everyone who is zoned for them? Future randolph parent - what's the appeal for you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:APS doesn’t care why UMC families choice out. They know why, and they simply don’t care.

.

So just let them choice into a school like Tuckahoe, McKinley, Reed, Nottingham or where ever there will be space....

Fine with me
-future Randolph parent

What about those who just want a decent school that actually reflects the community within its boundaries? Does aps really feel it has no obligation to respond to make neighborhood schools attractive to everyone who is zoned for them? Future randolph parent - what's the appeal for you?

I am not the PP but I think that part of the issue is that people have vastly different definitions of "decent school" . and "community" and who or is not a member of their community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS to Barcroft. Barcroft loses almost as many kids to choice school transfers as it has in the neighborhood. Alcova to Fleet. Divide Bacroft between Randolph and Barrett. Recapture the choice kids you are losing to those schools anyway! Also, encourages S Arl students (and disadvantaged families) to take advantage of ATS.

No room at Randolph for all the low income kids at Barcroft - they're not going to enter the lottery for ATS. And would prob give Randolph a farms rate higher than carlin springs.

Can't send half of Barcroft to Barrett either - you will upset the balance that exists at Barrett and keeps UMC families at the school. Don't want to undo 15 years of community buy-in and send Barrett parents scrambling for option schools as they did in the past before visionary former principal convinced Arlington Forest families that their kids would turn out fine. Barrett is one of the few high-FARMS schools that UMC families are happy with. It has a huge number of walkers and fairly balanced ethnic/racial/SES demographics. Not something to upset by playing the "where should we move ATS" game.

Tell me more about Barrett. It's got nearly identical farms rate as Barcroft (60%). Does it really have buy in from SFH, Morris than Barcroft? What's different there, apart from the calendar?

I’m not the previous poster, but Barrett is not diverse. It’s all Hispanic, plus a minority of Arlington Forest families.
And yes, that a good question to ask, because there is a lot of lamenting about Barcroft, but Barrett is no better in its demographics.
PTA participation and parent participation is limited, and I don’t see SES (or ethnic) diversity.

I'd really like to see what percentage of students in each elementary school boundary go to an option school. By planning unit would be even better. We all know what it would show: north Arlington students option at lower rates than south, and are attracted by perceived prestige and less crowded schools. South Arlington students option to avoid going to a segregated school whose resources are organized around serving a disadvantaged majority. But showing these patterns of demand for option schools would underscore that every school should get some sort of distinctive identity like an option school. No, we can't replace the biggest option school advantage - self selected, motivated and engaged parents- but giving Barrett, Barcroft, Carlin Springs and Randolph a focus or identity would help. The UMC has basically decided that those schools are organized around immigrant ELL and social services and they're not wrong. Giving those schools an additional identity that speaks to their aspirations would help. Why send you kid to a school specializing in what he/she has no need for? Something - more immersion programs, cultural exchange, a common denominator between two very different populations. That's where the key immersion came from. Can we not do that again? Are we just bereft of ideas?

Truth in the bolded above.
Giving those schools an additional identity or focus is not going to help; they already have that! Randolph is IB, Barrett has project Discovery and is a NASA Explorer school. It’s exciting stuff, but what does that mean day to day?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS to Barcroft. Barcroft loses almost as many kids to choice school transfers as it has in the neighborhood. Alcova to Fleet. Divide Bacroft between Randolph and Barrett. Recapture the choice kids you are losing to those schools anyway! Also, encourages S Arl students (and disadvantaged families) to take advantage of ATS.

No room at Randolph for all the low income kids at Barcroft - they're not going to enter the lottery for ATS. And would prob give Randolph a farms rate higher than carlin springs.

Can't send half of Barcroft to Barrett either - you will upset the balance that exists at Barrett and keeps UMC families at the school. Don't want to undo 15 years of community buy-in and send Barrett parents scrambling for option schools as they did in the past before visionary former principal convinced Arlington Forest families that their kids would turn out fine. Barrett is one of the few high-FARMS schools that UMC families are happy with. It has a huge number of walkers and fairly balanced ethnic/racial/SES demographics. Not something to upset by playing the "where should we move ATS" game.

Tell me more about Barrett. It's got nearly identical farms rate as Barcroft (60%). Does it really have buy in from SFH, Morris than Barcroft? What's different there, apart from the calendar?

I’m not the previous poster, but Barrett is not diverse. It’s all Hispanic, plus a minority of Arlington Forest families.
And yes, that a good question to ask, because there is a lot of lamenting about Barcroft, but Barrett is no better in its demographics.
PTA participation and parent participation is limited, and I don’t see SES (or ethnic) diversity.

I'd really like to see what percentage of students in each elementary school boundary go to an option school. By planning unit would be even better. We all know what it would show: north Arlington students option at lower rates than south, and are attracted by perceived prestige and less crowded schools. South Arlington students option to avoid going to a segregated school whose resources are organized around serving a disadvantaged majority. But showing these patterns of demand for option schools would underscore that every school should get some sort of distinctive identity like an option school. No, we can't replace the biggest option school advantage - self selected, motivated and engaged parents- but giving Barrett, Barcroft, Carlin Springs and Randolph a focus or identity would help. The UMC has basically decided that those schools are organized around immigrant ELL and social services and they're not wrong. Giving those schools an additional identity that speaks to their aspirations would help. Why send you kid to a school specializing in what he/she has no need for? Something - more immersion programs, cultural exchange, a common denominator between two very different populations. That's where the key immersion came from. Can we not do that again? Are we just bereft of ideas?

Truth in the bolded above.
Giving those schools an additional identity or focus is not going to help; they already have that! Randolph is IB, Barrett has project Discovery and is a NASA Explorer school. It’s exciting stuff, but what does that mean day to day?

Adding that the bolded includes North Arlington, too, in case of Barrett or Key.

[Anonymous]

It means those schools are overwhelmed with poor kids and the county has seen that it stays that way.
It also means that developers will start looking for new and creative ways to start introducing more multi family housing in North Arlington, because it can command a premium.
We will not see the needle move on a few of these south Arlington schools. Randolph’s neighborhood has something like 800 sfh’s. It has over 3000 affordable units within its bounds. Lovely neighborhood, but it has been understood by people living there for decades that you don’t send your kid there.
Every few years someone will talk about all the strollers they see, and it’s true that the neighborhood has gotten younger and wealthier. Those families will come to the same conclusions as those before.
There are a few exceptions, but I don’t see a big enough shift happening. It just isn’t possible.

[Anonymous]

Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

Self selecting choice school.
Not the same thing as Randolph, Barcroft, Drew, Carlin Springs. You’ve basically cherry picked the most motivated, and engaged immigrant families and dropped them in Campbell. Apples and oranges. If people are going to say that the UMC kids need to stay at the neighborhood schools to benefit the entire community, the same should be said for this group as well.
Either make space for all kids to have a choice, or actually force integration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

Self selecting choice school.
Not the same thing as Randolph, Barcroft, Drew, Carlin Springs. You’ve basically cherry picked the most motivated, and engaged immigrant families and dropped them in Campbell. Apples and oranges. If people are going to say that the UMC kids need to stay at the neighborhood schools to benefit the entire community, the same should be said for this group as well.
Either make space for all kids to have a choice, or actually force integration.

Randolph parent here. I feel that my children benefit from the title 1 resources too. Are there things in the communications and outreach of the school that are targeted at low income kids—yes. They don’t hurt me or my kids. Sometimes we still participate and learn things and enjoy them. We still benefit from a supportive environment, wonderful teachers, individual attention and differentiation. We also supplement with enrichment and activities outside of school. Personally I also really love the IB program too. Many parents simply dont believe this and won’t seriously consider the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

That's good to hear. I do wonder if the fact that Campbell is like 35% farms and Barrett and barcroft are 60, along with not being self selecting does make a difference though.

[Anonymous]

Gee 30% more poverty...
Could that make a difference?
Twice as many impoverished kids coming from families without formal education and no understanding of its benefits...
Could that make a difference? Hmmm... couldn’t say.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

That's good to hear. I do wonder if the fact that Campbell is like 35% farms and Barrett and barcroft are 60, along with not being self selecting does make a difference though.

Campbell is only 35% ? That has gone way, way down! (I recall something just under 60% a few years back?). That means they lost Title 1 status.
Did they keep the same number of VPI classes? Did the ratings/scores/stats change with that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

That's good to hear. I do wonder if the fact that Campbell is like 35% farms and Barrett and barcroft are 60, along with not being self selecting does make a difference though.

Campbell is only 35% ? That has gone way, way down! (I recall something just under 60% a few years back?). That means they lost Title 1 status.
Did they keep the same number of VPI classes? Did the ratings/scores/stats change with that?

No. Campbell is 54% FRL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Barcroft resident here, I mostly agree with PPs, but a few caveats.

Campbell is much like Barrett and barcroft as far as SES demographics. And, although it is a choice School, it has a disproportionately large VPI class from local kids and they stay at the school. Those parents like me self selected that School.

But there is something different about that school, they embrace their diversity in many ways and I don’t feel that the School caters only to the immigrant community. It is all one community. Maybe it is the way the school administration deals with it, I give a lot of credit to the principle because a lot of that attitude comes from the top.

And don’t be so sure that your UMC kid won’t benefit from the Title I services. Campbell makes those extra resources available to all kids who need them. Mine gets some extra help in certain subjects, like math. I am grateful for the extra help.

That's good to hear. I do wonder if the fact that Campbell is like 35% farms and Barrett and barcroft are 60, along with not being self selecting does make a difference though.

Campbell is only 35% ? That has gone way, way down! (I recall something just under 60% a few years back?). That means they lost Title 1 status.
Did they keep the same number of VPI classes? Did the ratings/scores/stats change with that?

No. Campbell is 54% FRL.

Barcroft is around 60, so you can see what a difference families makes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS to Barcroft. Barcroft loses almost as many kids to choice school transfers as it has in the neighborhood. Alcova to Fleet. Divide Bacroft between Randolph and Barrett. Recapture the choice kids you are losing to those schools anyway! Also, encourages S Arl students (and disadvantaged families) to take advantage of ATS.

No room at Randolph for all the low income kids at Barcroft - they're not going to enter the lottery for ATS. And would prob give Randolph a farms rate higher than carlin springs.

Can't send half of Barcroft to Barrett either - you will upset the balance that exists at Barrett and keeps UMC families at the school. Don't want to undo 15 years of community buy-in and send Barrett parents scrambling for option schools as they did in the past before visionary former principal convinced Arlington Forest families that their kids would turn out fine. Barrett is one of the few high-FARMS schools that UMC families are happy with. It has a huge number of walkers and fairly balanced ethnic/racial/SES demographics. Not something to upset by playing the "where should we move ATS" game.

Tell me more about Barrett. It's got nearly identical farms rate as Barcroft (60%). Does it really have buy in from SFH, Morris than Barcroft? What's different there, apart from the calendar?

I’m not the previous poster, but Barrett is not diverse. It’s all Hispanic, plus a minority of Arlington Forest families.
And yes, that a good question to ask, because there is a lot of lamenting about Barcroft, but Barrett is no better in its demographics.
PTA participation and parent participation is limited, and I don’t see SES (or ethnic) diversity.

Barrett has 60% FARMS which is more diverse than a school that is 80% FARMS or 4% FARMS.

Barrett is 50% Hispanic, 28% White, 10% Black, which is more diverse than schools that are 70+% White or Hispanic. Not all the families that live in SFHs in Arlington Forest are white (not all the minority students at Barrett receive free lunch). Yes, some families choose Key/ATS/Campbell but the neighborhood is absolutely crawling with kids and most attend Barrett.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:ATS to Barcroft. Barcroft loses almost as many kids to choice school transfers as it has in the neighborhood. Alcova to Fleet. Divide Bacroft between Randolph and Barrett. Recapture the choice kids you are losing to those schools anyway! Also, encourages S Arl students (and disadvantaged families) to take advantage of ATS.

No room at Randolph for all the low income kids at Barcroft - they're not going to enter the lottery for ATS. And would prob give Randolph a farms rate higher than carlin springs.

Can't send half of Barcroft to Barrett either - you will upset the balance that exists at Barrett and keeps UMC families at the school. Don't want to undo 15 years of community buy-in and send Barrett parents scrambling for option schools as they did in the past before visionary former principal convinced Arlington Forest families that their kids would turn out fine. Barrett is one of the few high-FARMS schools that UMC families are happy with. It has a huge number of walkers and fairly balanced ethnic/racial/SES demographics. Not something to upset by playing the "where should we move ATS" game.

Tell me more about Barrett. It's got nearly identical farms rate as Barcroft (60%). Does it really have buy in from SFH, Morris than Barcroft? What's different there, apart from the calendar?

I’m not the previous poster, but Barrett is not diverse. It’s all Hispanic, plus a minority of Arlington Forest families.
And yes, that a good question to ask, because there is a lot of lamenting about Barcroft, but Barrett is no better in its demographics.
PTA participation and parent participation is limited, and I don’t see SES (or ethnic) diversity.

Barrett has 60% FARMS which is more diverse than a school that is 80% FARMS or 4% FARMS.

Barrett is 50% Hispanic, 28% White, 10% Black, which is more diverse than schools that are 70+% White or Hispanic. Not all the families that live in SFHs in Arlington Forest are white (not all the minority students at Barrett receive free lunch). Yes, some families choose Key/ATS/Campbell but the neighborhood is absolutely crawling with kids and most attend Barrett.

So this suggests to me that Barcroft's calendar is a HUGE deterrent for many families. Only about 100 students opt out of Barrett, while close to 300 so so at Barcroft. They have similar demographics, and similar neighborhood profiles. The major difference is the CALENDAR.