what is the difference between Madison HS, Oakton, and Reston high schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there really much difference academically between Herndon and South Lakes?

I know a lot of kids transfer for South Lakes sports teams and pretend its for IB [pffft no you don't know that]

Academically you could note that in school year 2022-23 at South Lakes, 489 kids took IB exams and 418 scored a 4 or better on an IB exam.
Meanwhile at Herndon, 383 kids took AP exams and 276 scored a 3 or better on an AP exam.

So you have similar sized schools with similar demographics, and in both cases roughly similar percentages of kids participated in the advanced academic programs and the success on the exams was better at the IB school than the AP school. This hardly supports the common claim that "hardly any" kids do IB compared to AP and that AP has a superior academic outcome.

One conclusion is that if you are a motivated white or Asian kid, then there is not much difference between Herndon and South Lakes.

South Lakes and Herndon do not have similar demographics. A much higher percentage of students at Herndon are on free and reduced lunch. Herndon is also majority Hispanic.

South lakes has a plurality of white students, and more Asian students. Demographics are also wealthier in comparison.

The School Board intervened in 2008 to alter South Lakes' demographics. They haven't taken any similar action yet at Herndon.

It would be very interesting to know the demographics of the Herndon students at South Lakes. Maybe, FARMS would be quite different in proportion if they 'stayed home."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there really much difference academically between Herndon and South Lakes?

I know a lot of kids transfer for South Lakes sports teams and pretend its for IB [pffft no you don't know that]

Academically you could note that in school year 2022-23 at South Lakes, 489 kids took IB exams and 418 scored a 4 or better on an IB exam.
Meanwhile at Herndon, 383 kids took AP exams and 276 scored a 3 or better on an AP exam.

So you have similar sized schools with similar demographics, and in both cases roughly similar percentages of kids participated in the advanced academic programs and the success on the exams was better at the IB school than the AP school. This hardly supports the common claim that "hardly any" kids do IB compared to AP and that AP has a superior academic outcome.

One conclusion is that if you are a motivated white or Asian kid, then there is not much difference between Herndon and South Lakes.

South Lakes and Herndon do not have similar demographics. A much higher percentage of students at Herndon are on free and reduced lunch. Herndon is also majority Hispanic.

South lakes has a plurality of white students, and more Asian students. Demographics are also wealthier in comparison.

The School Board intervened in 2008 to alter South Lakes' demographics. They haven't taken any similar action yet at Herndon.

It would be very interesting to know the demographics of the Herndon students at South Lakes. Maybe, FARMS would be quite different in proportion if they 'stayed home."

Stu Gibson handpicked the Herndon neighborhoods to send to South Lakes with the assistance of Kathy Smith. It was mostly kids living in Herndon attending Westfield who got moved to South Lakes. Westfield would look a lot different today if they hadn't intervened. Herndon too, but probably to a lesser extent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there really much difference academically between Herndon and South Lakes?

I know a lot of kids transfer for South Lakes sports teams and pretend its for IB [pffft no you don't know that]

Academically you could note that in school year 2022-23 at South Lakes, 489 kids took IB exams and 418 scored a 4 or better on an IB exam.
Meanwhile at Herndon, 383 kids took AP exams and 276 scored a 3 or better on an AP exam.

So you have similar sized schools with similar demographics, and in both cases roughly similar percentages of kids participated in the advanced academic programs and the success on the exams was better at the IB school than the AP school. This hardly supports the common claim that "hardly any" kids do IB compared to AP and that AP has a superior academic outcome.

One conclusion is that if you are a motivated white or Asian kid, then there is not much difference between Herndon and South Lakes.

South Lakes and Herndon do not have similar demographics. A much higher percentage of students at Herndon are on free and reduced lunch. Herndon is also majority Hispanic.

South lakes has a plurality of white students, and more Asian students. Demographics are also wealthier in comparison.

The School Board intervened in 2008 to alter South Lakes' demographics. They haven't taken any similar action yet at Herndon.

It would be very interesting to know the demographics of the Herndon students at South Lakes. Maybe, FARMS would be quite different in proportion if they 'stayed home."

Stu Gibson handpicked the Herndon neighborhoods to send to South Lakes with the assistance of Kathy Smith. It was mostly kids living in Herndon attending Westfield who got moved to South Lakes. Westfield would look a lot different today if they hadn't intervened. Herndon too, but probably to a lesser extent.

It happens. Elaine Tholen hand picked the McLean kids she wanted moved to Langley in 2021: 100% single-family houses after FCPS staff had proposed to move some Tysons apartments. And Kathy Smith got what she wanted at Poplar Tree and Virginia Run, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there really much difference academically between Herndon and South Lakes?

I know a lot of kids transfer for South Lakes sports teams and pretend its for IB [pffft no you don't know that]

Academically you could note that in school year 2022-23 at South Lakes, 489 kids took IB exams and 418 scored a 4 or better on an IB exam.
Meanwhile at Herndon, 383 kids took AP exams and 276 scored a 3 or better on an AP exam.

So you have similar sized schools with similar demographics, and in both cases roughly similar percentages of kids participated in the advanced academic programs and the success on the exams was better at the IB school than the AP school. This hardly supports the common claim that "hardly any" kids do IB compared to AP and that AP has a superior academic outcome.

One conclusion is that if you are a motivated white or Asian kid, then there is not much difference between Herndon and South Lakes.

South Lakes and Herndon do not have similar demographics. A much higher percentage of students at Herndon are on free and reduced lunch. Herndon is also majority Hispanic.

South lakes has a plurality of white students, and more Asian students. Demographics are also wealthier in comparison.

The School Board intervened in 2008 to alter South Lakes' demographics. They haven't taken any similar action yet at Herndon.

It would be very interesting to know the demographics of the Herndon students at South Lakes. Maybe, FARMS would be quite different in proportion if they 'stayed home."

Stu Gibson handpicked the Herndon neighborhoods to send to South Lakes with the assistance of Kathy Smith. It was mostly kids living in Herndon attending Westfield who got moved to South Lakes. Westfield would look a lot different today if they hadn't intervened. Herndon too, but probably to a lesser extent.

It happens. Elaine Tholen hand picked the McLean kids she wanted moved to Langley in 2021: 100% single-family houses after FCPS staff had proposed to move some Tysons apartments. And Kathy Smith got what she wanted at Poplar Tree and Virginia Run, too.

It seems obvious now, but she wanted Langley to remain 100% single family homes. Obfuscatory language made the boundary move more palatable.

[Anonymous]

SLHS demographics, I am pretty sure participating in IB means taking a class, a good number of kids in the IB classes don’t take the exams:

Asian 10%, 70% participate in IB
Black 13% 32% participate in IB
Hispanic: 29% 30% participate in IB
White: 40% 70% participate in IB
Other: 8%

16% ELL
30% FARMs

I know Fox Mill ES was at Oakton for HS before it was moved to SLHS. I am not sure what other ES were moved at the time. I believe Floris had some kids moved to SLHS at the time as well.

Herndon, It looks like pretty much everyone who takes an AP class will take the AP exam.

Asian 8%, 56% participate in AP
Black 6% 30% participate in AP
Hispanic: 53% 13% participate in AP
White: 29% 66% participate in AP
Other: 5%

32% ELL
43% FARMS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SLHS demographics, I am pretty sure participating in IB means taking a class, a good number of kids in the IB classes don’t take the exams:

Asian 10%, 70% participate in IB
Black 13% 32% participate in IB
Hispanic: 29% 30% participate in IB
White: 40% 70% participate in IB
Other: 8%

16% ELL
30% FARMs

I know Fox Mill ES was at Oakton for HS before it was moved to SLHS. I am not sure what other ES were moved at the time. I believe Floris had some kids moved to SLHS at the time as well.

Herndon, It looks like pretty much everyone who takes an AP class will take the AP exam.

Asian 8%, 56% participate in AP
Black 6% 30% participate in AP
Hispanic: 53% 13% participate in AP
White: 29% 66% participate in AP
Other: 5%

32% ELL
43% FARMS

Fox Mill moved to South Lakes, along with part of Floris that had been at Westfield, part of Crossfield that had been at Oakton, and part of Wolftrap/Thoreau/Madison that was reassigned to Sunrise Valley/Hughes/South Lakes. And part of Navy moved from Chantilly to Oakton to compensate in part for the kids being moved out of Oakton. The latter is what triggered the infamous assault on Kathy Smith when she campaigned for Board of Supervisors in 2015, seven years after the boundary change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:SLHS demographics, I am pretty sure participating in IB means taking a class, a good number of kids in the IB classes don’t take the exams:

Asian 10%, 70% participate in IB
Black 13% 32% participate in IB
Hispanic: 29% 30% participate in IB
White: 40% 70% participate in IB
Other: 8%

16% ELL
30% FARMs

I know Fox Mill ES was at Oakton for HS before it was moved to SLHS. I am not sure what other ES were moved at the time. I believe Floris had some kids moved to SLHS at the time as well.

Herndon, It looks like pretty much everyone who takes an AP class will take the AP exam.

Asian 8%, 56% participate in AP
Black 6% 30% participate in AP
Hispanic: 53% 13% participate in AP
White: 29% 66% participate in AP
Other: 5%

32% ELL
43% FARMS

Students at South Lakes and Herndon, like students at most high schools in FCPS, get to decide whether to take IB or AP classes. If the schools want to inflate those statistics, they need to get FCPS to agree to make AP English or IB Language the default English class for almost all 11th and 12th graders, like at Marshall. Of course the classes get dumbed down when almost everyone enrolls in them, but it boosts the U.S. News ratings so it's all good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IB exams are graded on a scale of 1-7. A 4 on an IB exam is not a great score.

And if SL class gets no credit at colleges. If looking to maximize college credit are MUCH better to do dual enrollment or AP courses.

South Lakes course catalogue basic has 4 English options for grade 12-Eng 12, weight 1: IB HL, IB standard level. DE.
FCPS does not break out SL and HL on school profiles.

Oakton basic: Eng 12, Eng 12 Honors [.5 weight], 1 weight: DE, 2 APs.

So compare Eng 12 Honors [.5 extra weight] to IB SL [1 extra weight]. Why more for IB SL than honors? VDOE includes senior diploma candidates and diplomas whereas FCPS does any IB enrollment and exams taken. That school profile inclusion erroneously gives IB participation a bump since using Eng as an example a student at an AP HS might take Eng 12 HN and the same sudent at an IB school would be enrolled in Eng 12 IB SL.