the Atlantic: The Elite College Students Who Can't Read Books

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

This is so disappointing. My DS is in a private school in CA and he's read multiple full novels (Homegoing, Their Eyes Were Watching God, Great Gatsby) in just 9th and 10th grades, full plays (Macbeth, Uncle Vanya) and poems (many modern ones as well as ancient epic poem Gilgamesh). He just started 11th grade a month ago, and he's almost finished reading the full 600-page Crime and Punishment. I'm sad that other schools are only giving abridged or excerpts or reducing assignments to only one novel per year. These difficult books have undoubtedly stretched and challenged my DS, and he'd rather play video games or read excerpts if given the choice, but stretching and challenging him has led to growth.

I wish we'd give our kids more credit.

Your kid's English syllabus sounds awesome!! Crime and Punishment could be read quickly for fun but IMO it's best read and analyzed with a class when you can discuss and reflect and consider all the many layers and symbolism/imagery: religious, philosophical, historical. 19th century Russia (pre-revolution) produced some of the most multi-layered and interesting literature especially since discourse was banned so it fell on fiction to debate all the different schools of thought, isms and philosophy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

SAT optional yields these kinds of students.

You should work on your logic skills. No one needs to read a book to do well on the SAT. THey just need to a couple paragraphs, which is shorter than most assignments.

[Anonymous]

Glad I got my popcorn early. Y'all amazing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

Test prep. Read a short passage find the main idea. Move onto the next skill. Meanwhile, they've never read a whole book about anything. I totally understand why this is happening. Since there's no homework these days, I assign it. My kid is always reading a book for homework, and we're always discussing it.

But that just sounds like a run of the mill 4.0 GPA/grade grabber who we are repeatedly told can't get into, e.g. Columbia.

I mean, my 8th grader is not a big reader and she read a non-fiction psychiatry book over just a few days this summer and we discussed it. Pretty sure she would be capable of discussing Pride and prejudice and Crime and punishment within a couple of weeks. I read these books in HS. They are interesting and not that hard to read.

Those books aren't interesting at all. I mean, Crime & Punishment? Are you now going to tell me War & Peace is interesting too?

Perhaps if we let a kid read a non-fiction psychiatry book instead of Pride and Prejudice or whatever, then things would be better.

But, if you want to read Crime & Punishment, then go for it.

Wow, I feel sorry for you. Your inability to understand some of the greatest fiction ever written indicates lacks in other aspects of your understanding of life.

Why...there are a ton of people who hate all fiction writing. Why are you superior because you enjoy fiction and someone else would rather read a 1,000 page book on Oppenheimer or other non-fiction.

One thing is that non-fiction tends to be what-you-read-is-what-there-is. Whereas fiction involves subtle themes, style, symbolism, subtext….things you have to dig to discover. Reading non-fiction is a much more passive process.

Agreed except that I'd qualify and say "literary fiction" does what you argue more than popular fiction which is intentionally lighter and takes less work to consume.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

This is so disappointing. My DS is in a private school in CA and he's read multiple full novels (Homegoing, Their Eyes Were Watching God, Great Gatsby) in just 9th and 10th grades, full plays (Macbeth, Uncle Vanya) and poems (many modern ones as well as ancient epic poem Gilgamesh). He just started 11th grade a month ago, and he's almost finished reading the full 600-page Crime and Punishment. I'm sad that other schools are only giving abridged or excerpts or reducing assignments to only one novel per year. These difficult books have undoubtedly stretched and challenged my DS, and he'd rather play video games or read excerpts if given the choice, but stretching and challenging him has led to growth.

I wish we'd give our kids more credit.

Love this comment - and I also want to go to your kid's school now!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Glad I got my popcorn early. Y'all amazing.

Right? I can’t tell if some of these responses are satire. Some of these are satire, right???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Glad I got my popcorn early. Y'all amazing.

Right? I can’t tell if some of these responses are satire. Some of these are satire, right???

I always wonder what some of these people are like in real life. Honestly cannot picture it at all.

[Anonymous]

This article was eye opening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:CS nerds read Tolkien

Which ironically was written for little children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

This is so disappointing. My DS is in a private school in CA and he's read multiple full novels (Homegoing, Their Eyes Were Watching God, Great Gatsby) in just 9th and 10th grades, full plays (Macbeth, Uncle Vanya) and poems (many modern ones as well as ancient epic poem Gilgamesh). He just started 11th grade a month ago, and he's almost finished reading the full 600-page Crime and Punishment. I'm sad that other schools are only giving abridged or excerpts or reducing assignments to only one novel per year. These difficult books have undoubtedly stretched and challenged my DS, and he'd rather play video games or read excerpts if given the choice, but stretching and challenging him has led to growth.

I wish we'd give our kids more credit.

That sounds like my CT public school in the 00s. Sad that you have to go private these days to get that quality!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

SAT optional yields these kinds of students.

You should work on your logic skills. No one needs to read a book to do well on the SAT. THey just need to a couple paragraphs, which is shorter than most assignments.

That’s like saying a conductor just needs to know how to wave the pointy thing around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

Test prep. Read a short passage find the main idea. Move onto the next skill. Meanwhile, they've never read a whole book about anything. I totally understand why this is happening. Since there's no homework these days, I assign it. My kid is always reading a book for homework, and we're always discussing it.

But that just sounds like a run of the mill 4.0 GPA/grade grabber who we are repeatedly told can't get into, e.g. Columbia.

I mean, my 8th grader is not a big reader and she read a non-fiction psychiatry book over just a few days this summer and we discussed it. Pretty sure she would be capable of discussing Pride and prejudice and Crime and punishment within a couple of weeks. I read these books in HS. They are interesting and not that hard to read.

Those books aren't interesting at all. I mean, Crime & Punishment? Are you now going to tell me War & Peace is interesting too?

Perhaps if we let a kid read a non-fiction psychiatry book instead of Pride and Prejudice or whatever, then things would be better.

But, if you want to read Crime & Punishment, then go for it.

Um, yes, War and Peace is an extremely interesting and dynamic book. I literally read in it just a few days, I couldn't stop reading.

That person above is a Philistine dolt. Welcome to the STEM world where the humanities have been denigrated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CS nerds read Tolkien

Which ironically was written for little children.

Not a CS type, but this is untrue. The Hobbit was written for children, but Tolkien’s own letters state directly that the LOTR series is not intended for kids, and that it’s definitely not for young ones.

[Anonymous]

This must be a recent phenomenon, my kids graduated high school before 2020 and always read books as kids and had to do plenty of reading in public schools for honors, AP and IB classes.

[Anonymous]

*between 2015-2020