Do Daycare ratios apply to pre-school? If yes, how does Franklin Montessori have such large classes?

[Anonymous]

I assume the daycare ratios apply to preschools. If so, how does Franklin Montessori (on Connecticut Ave) get away with the ratios that it does? My child's 2 classrooms have 10 kids (some have 14) and there are only 2 teachers. For 2-2.5, the ratio is 4:1. Is there some exception that I'm not aware of?

[Anonymous]

If they are a licensed school and inspected by the MD State Dept of Ed they go by those school regulations.

This is directly from the State Dept of Ed rules and regs for child care centers, including pre-schools.

http://www.marylandpublicschools.org/NR/rdonlyres/FF4D42D2-46A0-44E6-9CEC-546C5641F978/31469/Sub16CTRamend012312.pdf

.03 Group Size and Staffing.
A. Assignment of Staff. One or more child care teachers shall be assigned to each group of children as needed to meet the requirements for group size and staffing set forth at §§C—G of this regulation.
B. Age of a Child. For purposes of determining group size and staff required under this chapter, the age of a child is determined solely according to the date of the child's most recent birthday.
C. Same-Age Groups. In a group of children of the same age, the following staff/child ratio and maximum group size requirements apply:

Child Ages : Staff/Child Ratio : Maximum Group Size
2 years old : 1 to 6 : 12
3 or 4 years old : 1 to 10 : 20
5 years old and older : 1 to 15 : 30

D. Mixed-Age Groups.
(1) A mixed age group with preschool children may not exceed 20 children.
(2) In a mixed age group with preschool children 3 years old or older, the staff to child ratio is 1 to 10.
(3) A maximum of six 2-year-olds may be in a mixed age group of 13 to 20 children.
(4) In mixed-age groups of varying sizes that include children who are 2 years old, the following minimum staffing levels apply:

Group Composition Group Size Minimum Staffing Level

Group includes one to three 2 year old children 7 to 10 1 staff member
Group includes four or more 2 year old children 7 to 10 2 staff members
Group includes one to three 2 year old children 13 to 20 2 staff members
Group includes four to six 2 year old children 13 to 20 3 staff members

E. Infant/Toddler Groups. In a group of children where each child is an infant or a toddler, the following staff/child ratio and maximum group size requirements apply:
Child Ages : Staff/Child Ratio : Maximum Group Size
Infants (6 weeks old to 18 months old) : 1 to 3 :6
Toddlers (18 months old to 2 years old) : 1 to 3 :9
Infants and toddlers, with 1 to 2 infants in the group : 1 to 3 : 9
Infants and toddlers, with 3 or more infants in the group : 1 to 3 : 6

F. Mixed-Age Infant/Toddler Groups. In a group where infants and toddlers are mixed with preschoolers, the following minimum staffing levels and maximum group size requirements apply:

Group Composition Minimum Staffing Level Maximum Group Size

Group includes 1 or 2 infants 2 staff members 9
Group includes 3 or more infants 2 staff members 6
Group includes 1 or 2 toddlers 2 staff members 12
Group includes 3 toddlers 2 staff members 9
Group includes 4 or more toddlers 3 staff members 9
Group includes no infants, 1 or 2 toddlers, 3 staff members 12
and 6 or more 2 year olds

G. Group Size and Staffing in Approved Educational Programs.

(1) During a school day approved by the Department, a teacher shall be assigned to each class and the following requirements apply:
Child Age : Group Staff/ Child Ratio : Maximum Group Size
2 years old : 1 to 6 : 12
3 or 4 years old: 1 to 12 : 24
5 years old or older : 1 to 15 : 30

(2) A nursery school may not exceed a staff/child ratio or group size requirement set forth at §G(1) of this regulation, except that a Montessori school that has been approved by the Department may exceed a staff/child ratio or group size requirement by no more than 1/3.

(3) When children who are 2 years old, 3 years old, 4 years old, and 5 years old are grouped together, the average age of all the children in the group as of September 1 of that school year is used to determine the group's maximum size and staff/child ratio.

[Anonymous]

Thanks but this is DC not MD.

[Anonymous]

Franklin is also one of the few "for profit" (to the owners) Montessori schools.

[Anonymous]

OK, so why doesn't someone report them to DC licensing? For profit or not, they still have to comply.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I assume the daycare ratios apply to preschools. If so, how does Franklin Montessori (on Connecticut Ave) get away with the ratios that it does? My child's 2 classrooms have 10 kids (some have 14) and there are only 2 teachers. For 2-2.5, the ratio is 4:1. Is there some exception that I'm not aware of?

yes - preschools need to stay within the liscensing requirements

are there ay children in the group who are more than 30 months? IF yes, this will allow them to do a ratio of 8:1 for the number of children who are more than 30 months.

[Anonymous]

A Montessori is not the same as a preschool. Is isn't run or managed the same way. Completely different in its method.

[Anonymous]

I'm pretty sure Franklin.complies with the legal requirements, whatever they may be. What i dont understand is how you missed the class size info during the tour. They were pretty clear about it during the tour and in all of the school info.

[Anonymous]

Well Randy was vague as to exactly how big the classes were.

[Anonymous]

Montessori class sizes are large because that is their methodology. Most Montessori schools are not licensed as preschools because they do not meet the usual ratios for preschools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Montessori class sizes are large because that is their methodology. Most Montessori schools are not licensed as preschools because they do not meet the usual ratios for preschools.

How does THAT work? What keeps Bright Horizons from licensing itself as a "Montessori school" so it can not comply with day care ratios?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Montessori class sizes are large because that is their methodology. Most Montessori schools are not licensed as preschools because they do not meet the usual ratios for preschools.

They would be shut down if not licensed - but I do believe they are currently outside the legal requirements. There is a section of the code that says:
343.7 When children of different ages are combined in one group, the adult/child ratio for the youngest child shall apply


I would be concerned and call the state licensing contact. You would not want something to happen and think to yourself - gosh I wish I called.

[Anonymous]

Daycare and Montessori schools are WORLDS apart, and Franklin is AMS certified. Trust me, both of my kids attended and they run a tight ship at Franklin. OP- they are very clear in terms of the class sizes at Franklin, so it sounds like you either weren't listening closely, or didn't realize what that looked like until school started. For what it's worth, in our class, it's run impressively well, at times you can hear a pin drop. It's partly the Montessori style learning where some kids are working independently, while others are working in smaller groups or individually with the teachers. Attend the Cirriculum Night and ask more questions about how it works- and learn more about Montessori. You won't want to go back to daycare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Daycare and Montessori schools are WORLDS apart, and Franklin is AMS certified. Trust me, both of my kids attended and they run a tight ship at Franklin. OP- they are very clear in terms of the class sizes at Franklin, so it sounds like you either weren't listening closely, or didn't realize what that looked like until school started. For what it's worth, in our class, it's run impressively well, at times you can hear a pin drop. It's partly the Montessori style learning where some kids are working independently, while others are working in smaller groups or individually with the teachers. Attend the Cirriculum Night and ask more questions about how it works- and learn more about Montessori. You won't want to go back to daycare.

So what are the class sizes. If it so clear you should be able to list them. It doesn't matter if they are AMS certified- that wasn't the question. It matters if they are meeting mandated ratios of teachers and children in each age group.

[Anonymous]

Why don't you call the school and ask?