Atheists/agnostics, why did you become atheist/agnostic

[Anonymous]

You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

Children believe ther eis a boogyman in their closet too. And in Santa Clause. And the Easter Rabbit. "tuned in," "a propensity to." Nice qualifiers there. They cant believe in God unless they are told about him, like "now I lay me down to sleep, I pray the lord my soul to keep and if I should die before I wake ..." Disgusting indoctrination of children that takes them years to shake off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

We are born without a god belief, and also the inability to speak or to think much beyond being hungry or thirsty. And while we may be tuned in to music, we can't compose music or play by ear" and most of us will never be able to -- it's a special talent.

Things change as we mature and are affected by the world around us and as our individual abilities and talents develop.

Regarding religion, we generally believe the religion that we are taught , while some of us seem be be born with a propensity not to believe and others with a propensity TO believe. As we get old enough to make our own decisions, some of us leave religion or change from the one we were taught as children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like atheist/agnostic is the default and the burden of proof rightly rests on the person or people who are asserting the existence and impact of supernatural/divine forces.

I think faith in the supernatural is a quirk of human evolution that we've used to bind ourselves into larger tribal identity groups ... and it's been pretty successful at that ... but the claims of religions that assert the supernatural don't hold up to close examination.

I was raised Catholic, tried evangelical etc ... and for many years really tried to give faith a good try, willing it to happen etc .. but in the end when I stopped 'pressing,' it just wasn't there ... which actually works just fine.

In the end (at least for me), admitting the presence of big existential questions actually brings more inner peace than all the cognitive dissonance of lying to yourself ... but I understand that doesn't work for everyone and don't begrudge people of faith pursuing what works for them.

Lovely, Thanks. I've heard about people like you who "try" to believe and it just doesn't work. I look forward to the day when people are not expected to believe, or forced to believe, and when "people of faith" are not considered superior because they are able to believe in the supernatural.

Christians do not think they are superior to anyone else. We are all the same. Sinners in need of the redemptive blood of Christ. Every person is created in God’s image and has the same sinful nature, and no one is better than the next person.

No one is forced to believe any religion in America.

WHAT IS RELIGIOUS FREEDOM EXACTLY?

The First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution says that everyone in the United States has the right to practice his or her own religion, or no religion at all.

The Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment gives you the right to worship or not as you choose. The government can't penalize you because of your religious beliefs.

IS IT EVER OK TO PRAY IN SCHOOL?

Sure. Individual students have the right to pray whenever they want to, as long as they don't disrupt classroom instruction or other educational activities -- or try to force others to pray along with them. If a school official has told you that you can't pray at all during the school day, your right to exercise your religion is being violated. Contact your local ACLU for help.

Student-organized Bible clubs are OK as long as three conditions are met:

(1) the activity must take place during non-school hours; (2) school officials can't be involved in organizing or running the club, and (3) the school must make its facilities available to all student groups on an equal basis. So your Bible club couldn't be the only group allowed access to the school grounds. Neither could your school let other student groups use the building for meetings and events and deny your Bible club the same opportunity.

https://www.aclu.org/other/your-right-religious-freedom

Again, anti- theism is different from atheism. Atheism is a personal choice to not believe in a God, gods, or practice any religious beliefs or worship any deity.

Anti- theism is an opposition to theism.

Dystheism is a belief in a deity that is not benevolent, and an opposition to gods or God.

Misotheism is a hatred of God.

Christopher Hitchens offers an example of this approach in Letters to a Young Contrarian (2001), in which he writes: "I'm not even an atheist so much as I am an antitheist; I not only maintain that all religions are versions of the same untruth, but I hold that the influence of churches, and the effect of religious belief, is positively harmful.

Other definitions of antitheism include that of the French Catholic philosopher Jacques Maritain (1953), for whom it is "an active struggle against everything that reminds us of God.”

Anti-theism is incompatible with our freedom of religion and our values as Americans.


Some See Extreme 'Anti-Theism' As Motive In N.C. Killings

Outrage over the murder of three young Muslim Americans in North Carolina last week has gone international. The Organization of Islamic Cooperation said Saturday that the killings reflected "Islamophobia" and "bear the symptoms of a hate crime," but local authorities say they don't yet know what motivated the murders.

The man held responsible for the killings is an avowed atheist. Whether that's relevant in this case is not clear, but some experts see a new extremism developing among some atheists.

On his Facebook page, Craig Hicks, the alleged gunman, criticized all religions. His wife said he had nothing against Muslims in particular, but Hicks described himself as a gun-toting atheist.

Religion scholar Reza Aslan says ordinary atheists just don't believe in God. Hicks, Aslan says, was an anti-theist.

Antitheism is primarily an attitude of aggressive hostility toward religion and, by extension, religious people and ideas. Unfortunately, antitheism tends to express itself in negative ways, with arrogance, derision, or outright bigotry.

https://www.npr.org/2015/02/15/386406810/some-see-extreme-anti-theism-as-motive-in-n-c-killings

(Link to news article quoted)

"Unfortunately, antitheism tends to express itself in negative ways, with arrogance, derision, or outright bigotry."

Ha Ha -- sounds like fundamentalist Christianity!

[Anonymous]

^ We're all born atheist. You don't "become atheist." I just think religion is largely irrelevant and the case was never made for why I should think otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2008/nov/25/religion-children-god-belief

Out of the mouths of babes
Justin L Barrett

Do children believe because they're told to by adults? The evidence suggests otherwise

Correct link

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2008/nov/25/religion-children-god-belief

Out of the mouths of babes
Justin L Barrett

Do children believe because they're told to by adults? The evidence suggests otherwise

Correct link

Children, for the most part, will believe anything you tell them, at least for a while.

Even so, some kids never believe in a diety. They are the ones who get in trouble in Sunday school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2008/nov/25/religion-children-god-belief

Out of the mouths of babes
Justin L Barrett

Do children believe because they're told to by adults? The evidence suggests otherwise

Correct link

No. the article says they believe things their minds are tuned to believing. OK, fair enough. This includes the Easter bunny, Santa Clause, and the the tooth fairy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2008/nov/25/religion-children-god-belief

Out of the mouths of babes
Justin L Barrett

Do children believe because they're told to by adults? The evidence suggests otherwise

Correct link

Haven't checked the link to see how scientists could determine that babies believe in a creator -- but even so, they could not believe in Jesus or the Christian God, or the God of any religion. You have to be taught that.

But even if babies "believe" in a creator, that doesn't make it so. Bables also believe they are the center of the universe and all their needs should be met.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't "become atheist." That's the default position we're all born with. You have to be indoctrinated to believe otherwise. Some parents don't send their kids to church, and some just think religious belief is irrelevant. Science, yes. Philosophy maybe. Religion, no. But it is fascinating, theology. Like I do find the King James version of the Bible beautiful as literature.

Developmental psychologists have provided evidence that children are naturally tuned to believe in gods of one sort or another.

• Children tend to see natural objects as designed or purposeful in ways that go beyond what their parents teach, as Deborah Kelemen has demonstrated. Rivers exist so that we can go fishing on them, and birds are here to look pretty.

• Children doubt that impersonal processes can create order or purpose. Studies with children show that they expect that someone not something is behind natural order. No wonder that Margaret Evans found that children younger than 10 favoured creationist accounts of the origins of animals over evolutionary accounts even when their parents and teachers endorsed evolution. Authorities' testimony didn't carry enough weight to over-ride a natural tendency.

Recent research by Paul Bloom, Jesse Bering, and Emma Cohen suggests that children may also be predisposed to believe in a soul that persists beyond death.

That belief comes so naturally to children may sound like an attack on religious belief (belief in gods is just leftover childishness) or a promotion of religious belief (God has implanted a seed for belief in children). What both sides should agree upon is the scientific evidence: certainly cultural inputs help fill in the details but children's minds are not a level playing field. They are tilted in the direction of belief.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/quote/255/20209883.page

The opposite is true. Children exhibit a propensity to a belief in a Creator.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2008/nov/25/religion-children-god-belief

Out of the mouths of babes
Justin L Barrett

Do children believe because they're told to by adults? The evidence suggests otherwise

Correct link

No. the article says they believe things their minds are tuned to believing. OK, fair enough. This includes the Easter bunny, Santa Clause, and the the tooth fairy.

One of my kids had an imaginary friend for a little while when he was younger.

[Anonymous]

I started questioning more when I learned that devout beliefs in Greek gods (mythology) had lasted longer than christianity. It bothered me that beliefs in the Americas were put down as barbaric by european invaders, the most barbaric of all. I ended up seeing history is written by the victors and their gods replace the old (not just with christianity, it happened all over). I wonder what will come next in the future and suspect it will be tech related.

I worried about my kids being raised to be good without religion and I could not have been more wrong with that concern. They are better and more honest and charitable with others and wildlife than I was at their age. They did not need the prospect of hell to be kind and concerned about their fellow man.

[Anonymous]

When you're not raised religious, when you first hear of it you think people are joking. It all sounds so unbelievable, hypocritical, unreal.

And then the more you learn, the more that's all confirmed!

I never "became" atheist. I have never been anything else. Religion is learned.

[Anonymous]

I was brought up Catholic, but I never believed in the resurrection. I think we die and that's it. I did not state my beliefs to my family until I was in my mid-twenties, and when I did, it caused some family relationships to be irrevocably damaged. Soon after that, the sexual abuse scandals came to light. It caused me to think more deeply about my beliefs, and I came to the realization that I am agnostic. Religion does not interest me at all anymore, and I am skeptical about the existence of God. I think we just do the best we can with the life we have and hopefully feel good about our lives when we die.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was brought up Catholic, but I never believed in the resurrection. I think we die and that's it. I did not state my beliefs to my family until I was in my mid-twenties, and when I did, it caused some family relationships to be irrevocably damaged. Soon after that, the sexual abuse scandals came to light. It caused me to think more deeply about my beliefs, and I came to the realization that I am agnostic. Religion does not interest me at all anymore, and I am skeptical about the existence of God. I think we just do the best we can with the life we have and hopefully feel good about our lives when we die.

^ well said.