DD wants to transfer out of top university but DH won't allow it

[Anonymous]

Would receiving some tutoring help?

[Anonymous]

dcmom12345 wrote:Hi,
I find myself in a difficulty situation caught between my husband and daughter. My daughter is currently a college freshman at an Ivy majoring in Math and has had a terrible experience so far. No friends, high stress, and is generally miserable. She expressed concerns over wanting to transfer in the first month but I told her to give it a little more time(until winter break) to confirm there is more than typical trouble adjusting to college issues. Well winter break came and she is more adamant than not over wanting to transfer. I accepted that and asked her what schools she was considering and this was her list(Umiami, Colgate, W&L, Syracuse, Penn State, MSU, and Florida State). DH blew up and announced he would not finance any schools on that list. He only agrees to finance her current school or another Ivy/schools he deems as ivy equivalent(not many). We don't qualify for FA and I can't afford a refusal to contribute. Her grades are good so I'm not worried about her not getting into one of her listed schools, but am dealing with either a miserable child for another 4 years or not being able to afford college. Advice?

Follow your gut. Let her transfer or at least do a semester abroad or there are colleges within the us that have semsters in the us like in Washingotn DC for government programs. Let her get a break. I dont want to freak you out but princeton has had 8 suicides in 3 years.

[Anonymous]

What did OP decide?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom12345 wrote:To add- we live in Maryland so I brought up in UMD as an option with DD seemed okay with but DH put on list of "will not pay for". He gave a list of universities he would consider acceptable which was limited to Chicago, Duke, MIT, Stanford, Caltech, AWS, JHU, Northwestern, RICE, Vandy, Michigan, and Berkeley.

She would probably enjoy Vandy or Rice. Go visit over a weekend.

I agree, Vanderbilt is great. Emory would also be a good option, Atlanta is a very easy place to find your tribe socially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Cornell is a very high pressure environment and weather is worse. Transferring there seems like a mistake.

This 100+ as a science grad. Cornell math majors are not very happy folks. It’s also hard to find your people in such a huge place esp as a transfer. A lot of schools your H supports are equally pressure cookers for any math majors. H triple majored at Rice one of was for math and then on to Caltech for grad. Laughing at PP suggesting Berkley. Ex boyfriend double majored there as history/ math and it was quite intense.

[Anonymous]

dcmom12345 wrote:Update:
Socially everything has gotten better and I fee DD is enjoying the city but academics have even gotten a little worse which is adding more stress(multiple phone calls home crying over exams and homework). Thinking about switching major(wants to ensure ad least a 3.0 gpa) but she has never enjoyed the humanities before and is a little sad about "losing math".

My impression from this thread is that your daughter is starting to like Columbia, has an IQ of 150 or the equivalent, was never challenged at all in grade school or high school, and now is in classes designed to challenge kids with IQs of about 165 or the equivalent, is passing everything, is getting some C’s and is getting a lot of B minuses.

If that’s correct, I think she should just stay at Columbia, get tutoring, take a lot of economics electives and learn to swim with the sharks.

Reasoning:

- The people here who expect all kids in T30 STEM majors to get GPAs over 3.5 every year are ignorant idiots who should be trampled to death by elephants. Or drowned in ponds. They have no idea what it’s like to have an IQ of 150 and suddenly be in a room where a third of the students have IQs of 165. It takes some time for a normal, very bright kid to get used to studying with a bunch of baby Stephen Hawkings.

- Learning how to deal with academic challenges is incredibly important for people with IQs of 150. People with IQs of 150 can do anything if they learn how to learn, but they’re pretty much as unemployable as semiliterate high school dropouts if they don’t learn how to apply themselves and cope with the boredom involved with studying difficult things. Your daughter is now experiencing what most other kids have experienced since third grade. The whole point of paying Columbia so much money is to put your daughter in the first place she’s ever been where learning is as hard for her as sixth grade was for most of her classmates.

- Chances are the professors are hazing the students to some extent and trying to weed out a lot of premeds and pre-engineers. Getting higher grades will probably get a lot easier for your daughter once the weeding out is over and your daughter understands how college works.

- STEM professors tend to be much harsher about grading than humanities majors are. If your daughter has a 2.5 GPA now, that’s probably the equivalent of a 3.5 GPA for a humanities major. Any sensible grad school admissions people who see many applications from Columbia grads will know that your daughter is a victim of grade deflation.

- Hanging out in classrooms full of baby Hawkings may be terrifying, but it’s also amazing. If your daughter can pass classes, why give that up?

- She can probably double major in economics, or take a lot of economics electives if Columbia doesn’t have formal double majors. Then, after she gets her bachelor’s, she can go to grad school for economics, data science, finance or actuarial science and change from being an ugly math-physics duckling into being a beautiful quantitative finance swan. She won’t get the privilege of slaving away as an academic for decades, but she will go be a quant for ungodly amounts of money at Goldman Sachs or the like. She’ll have a terrific quality of life, and no one will care what grades she got freshman year at Columbia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Encourage her to transfer. Her mental health is worth more than some perceived prestige. Way too many kids commit suicide over less.

+1
College experience encompasses many aspects, not only the academic part. She's expressing what she feels, I would try to follow her lead. Maybe there's an intersection with colleges that DHH agrees and she would dbe happy to go.
Best of luck. ❤️

[dcmom12345]

To be clear she currently has a 2.4 gpa and I think she wants to stay. Although one thing that might surprise people is that she did find high school challenging and never felt math came easy to her and had to put in a lot of work. I deifntiley believe she can improve but her performance isn't a result of never being challenged or finding something hard for the first time. My only concern is that if her grades don't improve next year(they haven't improved this semester) and she graduates with sub 3.0 gpa.

[dcmom12345]

Maybe give her first semester of sophomore year to try STEM major before she has to declare second semester? I don't want to impose major choice but nervous about jobs with a 2.4.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom12345 wrote:Update:
Socially everything has gotten better and I fee DD is enjoying the city but academics have even gotten a little worse which is adding more stress(multiple phone calls home crying over exams and homework). Thinking about switching major(wants to ensure ad least a 3.0 gpa) but she has never enjoyed the humanities before and is a little sad about "losing math".

My impression from this thread is that your daughter is starting to like Columbia, has an IQ of 150 or the equivalent, was never challenged at all in grade school or high school, and now is in classes designed to challenge kids with IQs of about 165 or the equivalent, is passing everything, is getting some C’s and is getting a lot of B minuses.

If that’s correct, I think she should just stay at Columbia, get tutoring, take a lot of economics electives and learn to swim with the sharks.

Reasoning:

- The people here who expect all kids in T30 STEM majors to get GPAs over 3.5 every year are ignorant idiots who should be trampled to death by elephants. Or drowned in ponds. They have no idea what it’s like to have an IQ of 150 and suddenly be in a room where a third of the students have IQs of 165. It takes some time for a normal, very bright kid to get used to studying with a bunch of baby Stephen Hawkings.

- Learning how to deal with academic challenges is incredibly important for people with IQs of 150. People with IQs of 150 can do anything if they learn how to learn, but they’re pretty much as unemployable as semiliterate high school dropouts if they don’t learn how to apply themselves and cope with the boredom involved with studying difficult things. Your daughter is now experiencing what most other kids have experienced since third grade. The whole point of paying Columbia so much money is to put your daughter in the first place she’s ever been where learning is as hard for her as sixth grade was for most of her classmates.

- Chances are the professors are hazing the students to some extent and trying to weed out a lot of premeds and pre-engineers. Getting higher grades will probably get a lot easier for your daughter once the weeding out is over and your daughter understands how college works.

- STEM professors tend to be much harsher about grading than humanities majors are. If your daughter has a 2.5 GPA now, that’s probably the equivalent of a 3.5 GPA for a humanities major. Any sensible grad school admissions people who see many applications from Columbia grads will know that your daughter is a victim of grade deflation.

- Hanging out in classrooms full of baby Hawkings may be terrifying, but it’s also amazing. If your daughter can pass classes, why give that up?

- She can probably double major in economics, or take a lot of economics electives if Columbia doesn’t have formal double majors. Then, after she gets her bachelor’s, she can go to grad school for economics, data science, finance or actuarial science and change from being an ugly math-physics duckling into being a beautiful quantitative finance swan. She won’t get the privilege of slaving away as an academic for decades, but she will go be a quant for ungodly amounts of money at Goldman Sachs or the like. She’ll have a terrific quality of life, and no one will care what grades she got freshman year at Columbia.

Has the IQ scale changed? I thought 140 was genius level back in the day.

So what is someone now classified with a 165?

[dcmom12345]

Although she says the work feels more doable and is doing better in the beginning of 2nd semester than she was in the beginning of 1rst semester which is a good sign even 2nd semester grade is not different from last semester's final grades. Just concerned about difficulty of bringing 2.4 gpa to 3.0 if there is no major improvements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom12345 wrote:Update:
Socially everything has gotten better and I fee DD is enjoying the city but academics have even gotten a little worse which is adding more stress(multiple phone calls home crying over exams and homework). Thinking about switching major(wants to ensure ad least a 3.0 gpa) but she has never enjoyed the humanities before and is a little sad about "losing math".

My impression from this thread is that your daughter is starting to like Columbia, has an IQ of 150 or the equivalent, was never challenged at all in grade school or high school, and now is in classes designed to challenge kids with IQs of about 165 or the equivalent, is passing everything, is getting some C’s and is getting a lot of B minuses.

If that’s correct, I think she should just stay at Columbia, get tutoring, take a lot of economics electives and learn to swim with the sharks.

Reasoning:

- The people here who expect all kids in T30 STEM majors to get GPAs over 3.5 every year are ignorant idiots who should be trampled to death by elephants. Or drowned in ponds. They have no idea what it’s like to have an IQ of 150 and suddenly be in a room where a third of the students have IQs of 165. It takes some time for a normal, very bright kid to get used to studying with a bunch of baby Stephen Hawkings.

- Learning how to deal with academic challenges is incredibly important for people with IQs of 150. People with IQs of 150 can do anything if they learn how to learn, but they’re pretty much as unemployable as semiliterate high school dropouts if they don’t learn how to apply themselves and cope with the boredom involved with studying difficult things. Your daughter is now experiencing what most other kids have experienced since third grade. The whole point of paying Columbia so much money is to put your daughter in the first place she’s ever been where learning is as hard for her as sixth grade was for most of her classmates.

- Chances are the professors are hazing the students to some extent and trying to weed out a lot of premeds and pre-engineers. Getting higher grades will probably get a lot easier for your daughter once the weeding out is over and your daughter understands how college works.

- STEM professors tend to be much harsher about grading than humanities majors are. If your daughter has a 2.5 GPA now, that’s probably the equivalent of a 3.5 GPA for a humanities major. Any sensible grad school admissions people who see many applications from Columbia grads will know that your daughter is a victim of grade deflation.

- Hanging out in classrooms full of baby Hawkings may be terrifying, but it’s also amazing. If your daughter can pass classes, why give that up?

- She can probably double major in economics, or take a lot of economics electives if Columbia doesn’t have formal double majors. Then, after she gets her bachelor’s, she can go to grad school for economics, data science, finance or actuarial science and change from being an ugly math-physics duckling into being a beautiful quantitative finance swan. She won’t get the privilege of slaving away as an academic for decades, but she will go be a quant for ungodly amounts of money at Goldman Sachs or the like. She’ll have a terrific quality of life, and no one will care what grades she got freshman year at Columbia.

Has the IQ scale changed? I thought 140 was genius level back in the day.

So what is someone now classified with a 165?

My thoughts too, exactly. 165 is nuts. But I do appreciate the points made in the post overall. Maybe compare 125 to 140 or 145.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom12345 wrote:Update:
Socially everything has gotten better and I fee DD is enjoying the city but academics have even gotten a little worse which is adding more stress(multiple phone calls home crying over exams and homework). Thinking about switching major(wants to ensure ad least a 3.0 gpa) but she has never enjoyed the humanities before and is a little sad about "losing math".

My impression from this thread is that your daughter is starting to like Columbia, has an IQ of 150 or the equivalent, was never challenged at all in grade school or high school, and now is in classes designed to challenge kids with IQs of about 165 or the equivalent, is passing everything, is getting some C’s and is getting a lot of B minuses.

If that’s correct, I think she should just stay at Columbia, get tutoring, take a lot of economics electives and learn to swim with the sharks.

Reasoning:

- The people here who expect all kids in T30 STEM majors to get GPAs over 3.5 every year are ignorant idiots who should be trampled to death by elephants. Or drowned in ponds. They have no idea what it’s like to have an IQ of 150 and suddenly be in a room where a third of the students have IQs of 165. It takes some time for a normal, very bright kid to get used to studying with a bunch of baby Stephen Hawkings.

- Learning how to deal with academic challenges is incredibly important for people with IQs of 150. People with IQs of 150 can do anything if they learn how to learn, but they’re pretty much as unemployable as semiliterate high school dropouts if they don’t learn how to apply themselves and cope with the boredom involved with studying difficult things. Your daughter is now experiencing what most other kids have experienced since third grade. The whole point of paying Columbia so much money is to put your daughter in the first place she’s ever been where learning is as hard for her as sixth grade was for most of her classmates.

- Chances are the professors are hazing the students to some extent and trying to weed out a lot of premeds and pre-engineers. Getting higher grades will probably get a lot easier for your daughter once the weeding out is over and your daughter understands how college works.

- STEM professors tend to be much harsher about grading than humanities majors are. If your daughter has a 2.5 GPA now, that’s probably the equivalent of a 3.5 GPA for a humanities major. Any sensible grad school admissions people who see many applications from Columbia grads will know that your daughter is a victim of grade deflation.

- Hanging out in classrooms full of baby Hawkings may be terrifying, but it’s also amazing. If your daughter can pass classes, why give that up?

- She can probably double major in economics, or take a lot of economics electives if Columbia doesn’t have formal double majors. Then, after she gets her bachelor’s, she can go to grad school for economics, data science, finance or actuarial science and change from being an ugly math-physics duckling into being a beautiful quantitative finance swan. She won’t get the privilege of slaving away as an academic for decades, but she will go be a quant for ungodly amounts of money at Goldman Sachs or the like. She’ll have a terrific quality of life, and no one will care what grades she got freshman year at Columbia.

Has the IQ scale changed? I thought 140 was genius level back in the day.

So what is someone now classified with a 165?

My thoughts too, exactly. 165 is nuts. But I do appreciate the points made in the post overall. Maybe compare 125 to 140 or 145.

Maybe convert that to an SAT score for me…what is a 120 IQ assuming a 140 is a 1580?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom12345 wrote:Update:
Socially everything has gotten better and I fee DD is enjoying the city but academics have even gotten a little worse which is adding more stress(multiple phone calls home crying over exams and homework). Thinking about switching major(wants to ensure ad least a 3.0 gpa) but she has never enjoyed the humanities before and is a little sad about "losing math".

My impression from this thread is that your daughter is starting to like Columbia, has an IQ of 150 or the equivalent, was never challenged at all in grade school or high school, and now is in classes designed to challenge kids with IQs of about 165 or the equivalent, is passing everything, is getting some C’s and is getting a lot of B minuses.

If that’s correct, I think she should just stay at Columbia, get tutoring, take a lot of economics electives and learn to swim with the sharks.

Reasoning:

- The people here who expect all kids in T30 STEM majors to get GPAs over 3.5 every year are ignorant idiots who should be trampled to death by elephants. Or drowned in ponds. They have no idea what it’s like to have an IQ of 150 and suddenly be in a room where a third of the students have IQs of 165. It takes some time for a normal, very bright kid to get used to studying with a bunch of baby Stephen Hawkings.

- Learning how to deal with academic challenges is incredibly important for people with IQs of 150. People with IQs of 150 can do anything if they learn how to learn, but they’re pretty much as unemployable as semiliterate high school dropouts if they don’t learn how to apply themselves and cope with the boredom involved with studying difficult things. Your daughter is now experiencing what most other kids have experienced since third grade. The whole point of paying Columbia so much money is to put your daughter in the first place she’s ever been where learning is as hard for her as sixth grade was for most of her classmates.

- Chances are the professors are hazing the students to some extent and trying to weed out a lot of premeds and pre-engineers. Getting higher grades will probably get a lot easier for your daughter once the weeding out is over and your daughter understands how college works.

- STEM professors tend to be much harsher about grading than humanities majors are. If your daughter has a 2.5 GPA now, that’s probably the equivalent of a 3.5 GPA for a humanities major. Any sensible grad school admissions people who see many applications from Columbia grads will know that your daughter is a victim of grade deflation.

- Hanging out in classrooms full of baby Hawkings may be terrifying, but it’s also amazing. If your daughter can pass classes, why give that up?

- She can probably double major in economics, or take a lot of economics electives if Columbia doesn’t have formal double majors. Then, after she gets her bachelor’s, she can go to grad school for economics, data science, finance or actuarial science and change from being an ugly math-physics duckling into being a beautiful quantitative finance swan. She won’t get the privilege of slaving away as an academic for decades, but she will go be a quant for ungodly amounts of money at Goldman Sachs or the like. She’ll have a terrific quality of life, and no one will care what grades she got freshman year at Columbia.

Has the IQ scale changed? I thought 140 was genius level back in the day.

So what is someone now classified with a 165?

My thoughts too, exactly. 165 is nuts. But I do appreciate the points made in the post overall. Maybe compare 125 to 140 or 145.

Keep going down. Most kids at these schools are 120 IQ types; they just work hard and have had all the educational privileges to be had growing up. Makes sense, because 120 IQ types tend to be more successful than 140+ types. Once you get way higher on the scale, you have kids who march to the beat of their own drum or don’t have a work ethic. For that reason, would not at all be surprised if you numerically found more true geniuses at a large, mid-tier state flagships than, say, Columbia.

[Anonymous]

OP, how did she go from grades are fine in your original post at end of Dec to a 2.4?!