City people... when is enough enough re: crime

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Murder at Navy Yard metro this morning.

But, repeat after me, “things were worse in the 90s.”

That was a shooting on the train not at the station but yeah … point taken.

I lived there in the ‘90s and it was much worse. But that doesn’t mean today’s level of crime is ok and should be tolerated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We live in the city and our kids attend solid schools (one DCPS and one charter). We love our neighborhood, our friends and our life here. But we are increasingly uncomfortable with the level of unchecked crime happening in the city and the hopelessness we feel about things getting better.

I know things have been a lot worse in the city in the past. But each year, we seem to be going further backwards. Neighborhood stores are closing because they can't operate with this level of crime. There are shootings and car jackings in our neighborhood, where that was unheard of before. I drive by cars everyday up on blocks because the wheels were stolen. And I have a constant feeling of "wtf" because Bowser and the Council seem to either not care or not have a realistic plan to fix it.

When is it time to call it quits?

I am more concerned about getting lynched or attacked by a rural methhead than any crime in DC.

what’s the probability of that actually happening?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

[Anonymous]

This happened around 5:30pm today—

“Mom with kid in a stroller just had her purse stolen at Lincoln park. Guy ran into a white minivan with temp tags parked on 13th between NC and constitution Avenue”

— per my friend who saw it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t quite understand the argument that people should leave the city due to crime, when suburbs also have troubling crime? People are cherry picking a scenario where a family is living in east Capitol Hill (which, yes, has seen a troubling crime uptick) and moving to, like, Olney or Potomac or somewhere with less crime.

We live in NE DC and while there is crime and we don’t like it, the suburbs we can afford and that make sense in terms of commute have similar crime problems. There are upsetting violent crimes in places like Wheaton, Hyattsville, Arlington, etc., all the time. Our friends in the suburbs complain about carjackings and shootings near their homes. The gun laws in VA make a lot of people (me included) anxious about gun violence there.

We are looking to move out of DC due to the school issues, but don’t view there to be a clear difference in crime between where we live in DC and where we might move in MD or VA. Many close in suburbs have fairly similar crime stats to where we live now, and moving very far out means spending a lot more time commuting (plus worrying about traffic accidents with all the added car time).

There is absolutely a difference between urban areas and suburbs with mostly educated families. White flight is a real thing. If you move to most suburbs or towns you’ll find a local government that does everything it can to fight and prevent crime along with zoning and other laws to keep crime out. The best way to avoid crime is to not live anywhere close to public transportation and to not live where there is inexpensive housing.

This is contradictory. If public transit and density lead to crime, then your point about how there’s “absolutely” a difference between the city and suburbs in this respect is false.

Many parts of MoCo are denser and have more public transit than parts of DC. Foxhall has lower crime than Wheaton. But someone who can afford to live in Foxhall isn’t going to move to Wheaton, and vice versa.

But someone who lives in Petworth and is tired of crime probably can’t afford Foxhall or, importantly, its suburban counterparts (Falls Church). The could probably afford a neighborhood like Homewood, between Kensington and Wheaton. It’s less dense than Petworth but only a bit, and crime in and around Wheaton metro will be on their radar. How much have the won in terms of less crime in this deal? Maybe a bit. But say it adds 30 minutes to their commute daily. Worth it? For many people: no.

This is not the no-brainer y’all make it out to be.

Semantics. Most places in the US with greater access to public transportation and higher density have more homeless people and crime. You need to live somewhere the undesirables can’t afford and can’t reach you.

The best way to have a high QOL in this country is to move somewhere with mostly UMC families and no public transit or one train stop max.

My town doesn’t have any public transportation, is all white educated people and there aren’t any apartment buildings. Practically no crime. You don’t need to lock your doors. Our local police don’t allow for any homeless. One time there was some random guy with a grocery cart walking down a suburban road and the cops were called. Never saw the guy again. He likely got taken to a nearby city and dropped off.

Racist

When the facts don’t fit the agenda they become racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

I don’t think that happened on the Hill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

I don’t think that happened on the Hill.

You’re right, that was Logan Circle. The one on Capitol Hill was the young father who was pushing a stroller that was attacked with a brick and paralyzed. Silly us. So hard to keep it straight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

+1 when random crime starts targeting women and children, that's beyond too far gone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t quite understand the argument that people should leave the city due to crime, when suburbs also have troubling crime? People are cherry picking a scenario where a family is living in east Capitol Hill (which, yes, has seen a troubling crime uptick) and moving to, like, Olney or Potomac or somewhere with less crime.

We live in NE DC and while there is crime and we don’t like it, the suburbs we can afford and that make sense in terms of commute have similar crime problems. There are upsetting violent crimes in places like Wheaton, Hyattsville, Arlington, etc., all the time. Our friends in the suburbs complain about carjackings and shootings near their homes. The gun laws in VA make a lot of people (me included) anxious about gun violence there.

We are looking to move out of DC due to the school issues, but don’t view there to be a clear difference in crime between where we live in DC and where we might move in MD or VA. Many close in suburbs have fairly similar crime stats to where we live now, and moving very far out means spending a lot more time commuting (plus worrying about traffic accidents with all the added car time).

There is absolutely a difference between urban areas and suburbs with mostly educated families. White flight is a real thing. If you move to most suburbs or towns you’ll find a local government that does everything it can to fight and prevent crime along with zoning and other laws to keep crime out. The best way to avoid crime is to not live anywhere close to public transportation and to not live where there is inexpensive housing.

This is contradictory. If public transit and density lead to crime, then your point about how there’s “absolutely” a difference between the city and suburbs in this respect is false.

Many parts of MoCo are denser and have more public transit than parts of DC. Foxhall has lower crime than Wheaton. But someone who can afford to live in Foxhall isn’t going to move to Wheaton, and vice versa.

But someone who lives in Petworth and is tired of crime probably can’t afford Foxhall or, importantly, its suburban counterparts (Falls Church). The could probably afford a neighborhood like Homewood, between Kensington and Wheaton. It’s less dense than Petworth but only a bit, and crime in and around Wheaton metro will be on their radar. How much have the won in terms of less crime in this deal? Maybe a bit. But say it adds 30 minutes to their commute daily. Worth it? For many people: no.

This is not the no-brainer y’all make it out to be.

Semantics. Most places in the US with greater access to public transportation and higher density have more homeless people and crime. You need to live somewhere the undesirables can’t afford and can’t reach you.

The best way to have a high QOL in this country is to move somewhere with mostly UMC families and no public transit or one train stop max.

My town doesn’t have any public transportation, is all white educated people and there aren’t any apartment buildings. Practically no crime. You don’t need to lock your doors. Our local police don’t allow for any homeless. One time there was some random guy with a grocery cart walking down a suburban road and the cops were called. Never saw the guy again. He likely got taken to a nearby city and dropped off.

Racist

You know what’s racist? The welfare system that encouraged AA women to have kids out of wedlock along with a criminal justice system that disproportionately incarcerates AA men. Because of these two factors, we now have disadvantaged AA men wreaking havoc in American cities. It is absolutely terrible that most educated families with children cannot live in urban areas across this country without putting their families at risk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

I don’t think that happened on the Hill.

You’re right, that was Logan Circle. The one on Capitol Hill was the young father who was pushing a stroller that was attacked with a brick and paralyzed. Silly us. So hard to keep it straight.

The father wasn’t paralyzed but he was hit in the head with a brick and his baby in a stroller was hit in the face with a brick which is terrifying. In another nearby incident a young mother was walking with her toddler when she was knocked to the sidewalk by a homeless man. I believe she lost some of her teeth. Both of these incidents happened in areas with a lot of foot traffic between the hours of 9-6. These are the kind of attacks that made me nervous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t quite understand the argument that people should leave the city due to crime, when suburbs also have troubling crime? People are cherry picking a scenario where a family is living in east Capitol Hill (which, yes, has seen a troubling crime uptick) and moving to, like, Olney or Potomac or somewhere with less crime.

We live in NE DC and while there is crime and we don’t like it, the suburbs we can afford and that make sense in terms of commute have similar crime problems. There are upsetting violent crimes in places like Wheaton, Hyattsville, Arlington, etc., all the time. Our friends in the suburbs complain about carjackings and shootings near their homes. The gun laws in VA make a lot of people (me included) anxious about gun violence there.

We are looking to move out of DC due to the school issues, but don’t view there to be a clear difference in crime between where we live in DC and where we might move in MD or VA. Many close in suburbs have fairly similar crime stats to where we live now, and moving very far out means spending a lot more time commuting (plus worrying about traffic accidents with all the added car time).

There is absolutely a difference between urban areas and suburbs with mostly educated families. White flight is a real thing. If you move to most suburbs or towns you’ll find a local government that does everything it can to fight and prevent crime along with zoning and other laws to keep crime out. The best way to avoid crime is to not live anywhere close to public transportation and to not live where there is inexpensive housing.

This is contradictory. If public transit and density lead to crime, then your point about how there’s “absolutely” a difference between the city and suburbs in this respect is false.

Many parts of MoCo are denser and have more public transit than parts of DC. Foxhall has lower crime than Wheaton. But someone who can afford to live in Foxhall isn’t going to move to Wheaton, and vice versa.

But someone who lives in Petworth and is tired of crime probably can’t afford Foxhall or, importantly, its suburban counterparts (Falls Church). The could probably afford a neighborhood like Homewood, between Kensington and Wheaton. It’s less dense than Petworth but only a bit, and crime in and around Wheaton metro will be on their radar. How much have the won in terms of less crime in this deal? Maybe a bit. But say it adds 30 minutes to their commute daily. Worth it? For many people: no.

This is not the no-brainer y’all make it out to be.

Semantics. Most places in the US with greater access to public transportation and higher density have more homeless people and crime. You need to live somewhere the undesirables can’t afford and can’t reach you.

The best way to have a high QOL in this country is to move somewhere with mostly UMC families and no public transit or one train stop max.

My town doesn’t have any public transportation, is all white educated people and there aren’t any apartment buildings. Practically no crime. You don’t need to lock your doors. Our local police don’t allow for any homeless. One time there was some random guy with a grocery cart walking down a suburban road and the cops were called. Never saw the guy again. He likely got taken to a nearby city and dropped off.

Racist

You know what’s racist? The welfare system that encouraged AA women to have kids out of wedlock along with a criminal justice system that disproportionately incarcerates AA men. Because of these two factors, we now have disadvantaged AA men wreaking havoc in American cities. It is absolutely terrible that most educated families with children cannot live in urban areas across this country without putting their families at risk.

Disproportionate commission of crime will result in disproportionate rates of incarceration. But you probably knew that at some level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We live in the city and our kids attend solid schools (one DCPS and one charter). We love our neighborhood, our friends and our life here. But we are increasingly uncomfortable with the level of unchecked crime happening in the city and the hopelessness we feel about things getting better.

I know things have been a lot worse in the city in the past. But each year, we seem to be going further backwards. Neighborhood stores are closing because they can't operate with this level of crime. There are shootings and car jackings in our neighborhood, where that was unheard of before. I drive by cars everyday up on blocks because the wheels were stolen. And I have a constant feeling of "wtf" because Bowser and the Council seem to either not care or not have a realistic plan to fix it.

When is it time to call it quits?

I am more concerned about getting lynched or attacked by a rural methhead than any crime in DC.

what’s the probability of that actually happening?

Rural crimes/killings are far easier to cover up. Plenty of people "go missing" in these areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The father wasn’t paralyzed but he was hit in the head with a brick and his baby in a stroller was hit in the face with a brick which is terrifying. In another nearby incident a young mother was walking with her toddler when she was knocked to the sidewalk by a homeless man. I believe she lost some of her teeth. Both of these incidents happened in areas with a lot of foot traffic between the hours of 9-6. These are the kind of attacks that made me nervous.

Do we know what happened to the criminals that attacked the people in these two cases?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What neighborhood are you in, OP?

Capitol Hill.

I would have left when that mom and her four year-old got shot by the scooter dude

OMG, I must have missed that one. It is so hard to keep up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The father wasn’t paralyzed but he was hit in the head with a brick and his baby in a stroller was hit in the face with a brick which is terrifying. In another nearby incident a young mother was walking with her toddler when she was knocked to the sidewalk by a homeless man. I believe she lost some of her teeth. Both of these incidents happened in areas with a lot of foot traffic between the hours of 9-6. These are the kind of attacks that made me nervous.

Do we know what happened to the criminals that attacked the people in these two cases?

My recollection is they were both mentally ill/drugged up homeless guys . . . so I suppose that is a whole different kettle of fish (than the violent crime perpetrated by the young thugs).