Lemonade

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

- the poster to whom you are responding is only poster who is saying what she is saying -- you just don't get it - no matter who says it

- who in the hell are you to say anyone's life is rough other than yours

- just because someone has more money does not automatically mean someone else's life can be described as "rough"

- intersectionality does not negate nuance, but nuance and individual experience seem to escape you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

- the poster to whom you are responding is only poster who is saying what she is saying -- you just don't get it - no matter who says it

- who in the hell are you to say anyone's life is rough other than yours

- just because someone has more money does not automatically mean someone else's life can be described as "rough"

- intersectionality does not negate nuance, but nuance and individual experience seem to escape you

Meant to say the poster to whom you are responding is NOT the only poster who is saying what she is saying

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

- the poster to whom you are responding is only poster who is saying what she is saying -- you just don't get it - no matter who says it

- who in the hell are you to say anyone's life is rough other than yours

- just because someone has more money does not automatically mean someone else's life can be described as "rough"

- intersectionality does not negate nuance, but nuance and individual experience seem to escape you

Substitute "less privilege" if it makes you happier. You're being pedantic, and a bit of a twat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

- the poster to whom you are responding is only poster who is saying what she is saying -- you just don't get it - no matter who says it

- who in the hell are you to say anyone's life is rough other than yours

- just because someone has more money does not automatically mean someone else's life can be described as "rough"

- intersectionality does not negate nuance, but nuance and individual experience seem to escape you

Are you seriously denying that, on average, black women have it harder than white people because they're black? Because THAT would be a racism-denying, white-privilege-negating, amazingly ignorant statement. I don't want to believe that's actually what you mean.

Are you seriously saying that having money and not having money afford a person the same ease of lifestyle? Does it help to switch the frame of this point, and call the lifestyle of a person with class privilege 'easier' rather than speaking to the difficulty level increase for those who lack class privilege?

And how the hell does pointing out the advantage of privilege, and the lack of advantage of a lack of privilege, in any way speak to "______ enough", or in any way address individual experience?

It's like you're having a whole separate conversation with yourself or someone else, but replying to me. Which is somewhat terrifying, because I think, ultimately, we probably even believe the same things.

What part of my post is difficult for you to understand?

[Anonymous]

"The most disrespected person in America is the black woman.
The most unprotected person in America is the black woman.
The most neglected person in America is the black woman."

Sorry, Malcolm. #notallblackwomen, apparently. Shame on you for generalizing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

[Anonymous]

^^Exactly. I really don't understand why so many are defending that statement. Just because she didn't grow up dirt poor in the ghetto doesn't take anything from her being a Black women.

It's clear from many posters here she's being disrespected. (For "pretending" to articulate "The Black Woman Experience")

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

Literal vs context. It's obvious was what meant which is what other posters are trying to explain to you. Please let it go already.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

Probably because she wrote it, so now she's doing a poor imitation of the moon walk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

Literal vs context. It's obvious was what meant which is what other posters are trying to explain to you. Please let it go already.

It's not obvious if so many posters have questioned it. And you are the one who is obtuse if you think it is only one or two people questioning how some white woman can define what it is to be a Black woman in these United States. Ask Oprah if all of her money and privilege has prevented intentional racists acts against her. She did an entire show on the matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^Exactly. I really don't understand why so many are defending that statement. Just because she didn't grow up dirt poor in the ghetto doesn't take anything from her being a Black women.

It's clear from many posters here she's being disrespected. (For "pretending" to articulate "The Black Woman Experience")

I understand it perfectly. It is how those individuals define Black people or Black women. To the supporters of that statement, the only context they have of a Black woman is poor, uneducated, and unmarried. They choose not to see or recognize anything else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

Literal vs context. It's obvious was what meant which is what other posters are trying to explain to you. Please let it go already.

It's not obvious if so many posters have questioned it. And you are the one who is obtuse if you think it is only one or two people questioning how some white woman can define what it is to be a Black woman in these United States. Ask Oprah if all of her money and privilege has prevented intentional racists acts against her. She did an entire show on the matter.

Nobody is doing that. Seriously. You keep reading this into/over what's being said, but nobody has said that. In fact, the quoted text says exactly the opposite: "Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc." Because intersectionality. What is your argument against this? Do you have one? Is it based in logic, or is it just a bunch of "YOU'RE RACIST!!!" without any substance to back it?

And no, I'm not the poster who made the original comment, nor can I moonwalk (that would be awesome, though). Unlike that poster, I'm very clear with what I mean, not that it seems to help you understand any. Since there are plenty of folks on this thread who seem to be able to understand me just fine, I suspect the problem is that understanding isn't your goal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP.. With all the dismissiveness upthread, can the poster who said "I doubt Beyoncé knows what it's like to be a Black woman" explain that statement. What exactly do you think it's like to be a Black woman? I too took it to mean the poster meant it as a Black woman is equivalent to all the negative pejorative stereotypes imaginable. Perhaps, I and the other posters are wrong in our interpretation of that sentence.

I took it to mean that the average Black woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af black woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege, while still subject to problems of being black in a culture that doesn't respect, appreciate, or even sometimes tolerate blackness. The sentences preceding the quoted passage above both reference Beyonce's class/status specifically, so it's pretty straightforward to apply that context.

If, you know, taking it in context was someone's goal. If you want to separate it from the context and make it something inflammatory, you can do that (and several posts have).

I am the poster who requested the explanation. Now substitute Black and insert White or Asian. If someone wrote they doubt Jennifer Anniston knows what it's like to be a white woman or Mindy Kaling an Asian woman how would you define that? I mean they both grew up upper middle class and have privileged lives. Do all white women or Asian women have the same experiences? Absolutely not! Does that make them any less White, or Asian. No. Perhaps, the original poster meant a poor Black woman, or a poor woman period. But it was clear her intent was to conquer and divide just by inserting race.

I've always had a problem with Black people trying to define whether another Black person is Black enough, but Jesus this is a new low with other races of people wanting to define who is and isn't Black enough. More important, other people trying define what it is to be Black. In spite of my close associations and friendships with more than a few white women, I expect you would not want me to opine on what a typical white woman's life experiences are. First, it would be trite stereotyping. Second, it's down right ignorant, something I'm not.

I took it to mean that the average white woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af white woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average brown woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af brown woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average asian woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af asian woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit
I took it to mean that the average queer woman has it pretty rough, unlike a rich af queer woman who would have an easier go of it by virtue of her class privilege. Seems legit.

Point: intersectionality matters. Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc.

I don't know where the hell you get "black enough" from any of this. And average and typical aren't really synonymous. All women, by virtue of being women, lack at least the advantages granted men. That's pretty rough. Making cents on the dollar is kinda fucking rough. Not being safe in your skin is kinda fucking rough. And, get ready for it, adding race to the mix makes it even MORE rough.

This isn't ignorance, it's fact. I don't know what the hell you have against facts, but it's making it rul hard to have a conversation with you.

Why did I call out the post for questioning her Blackness? Because it literally said "Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman". If they were only talking about class privilege, wouldn't they have said that Beyoncé doesn't know what it's like to be an everyday woman? The poster's first sentence was "This album is not her experience as a Black woman". Then they described her upper middle class background, and concluded with the offensive statement that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Why are you so hell bent on defending that obviously racist post?

Literal vs context. It's obvious was what meant which is what other posters are trying to explain to you. Please let it go already.

It's not obvious if so many posters have questioned it. And you are the one who is obtuse if you think it is only one or two people questioning how some white woman can define what it is to be a Black woman in these United States. Ask Oprah if all of her money and privilege has prevented intentional racists acts against her. She did an entire show on the matter.

Nobody is doing that. Seriously. You keep reading this into/over what's being said, but nobody has said that. In fact, the quoted text says exactly the opposite: "Class privilege does NOT negate/remove racial biases, but having class privilege can and does shape the narrative of a life by virtue of additional resources, opportunities, etc." Because intersectionality. What is your argument against this? Do you have one? Is it based in logic, or is it just a bunch of "YOU'RE RACIST!!!" without any substance to back it?

And no, I'm not the poster who made the original comment, nor can I moonwalk (that would be awesome, though). Unlike that poster, I'm very clear with what I mean, not that it seems to help you understand any. Since there are plenty of folks on this thread who seem to be able to understand me just fine, I suspect the problem is that understanding isn't your goal.

No one is arguing against intersectionality. You know perfectly well that we are talking about the original statement, that Beyoncé does not know what it's like to be a Black woman.

Just in case you are confused, here is the original comment again. The first paragraph was about "reverse racism" and called Black women Shaneeqas. The second paragraph invoked the loud Black woman trope, and the third paragraph was clear attempt to undermine Beyoncé by questioning her Blackness.

That post was clearly racist. If anyone is taking things out of context, it is you. You keep attempting to apply the intersectionailty angle, when it is clear that that's not what the poster meant.

So you guys would be fine if Taylor Swift sang "You better call Shaneequa with the afro" and all the white women retorted "this is not about you or your experience, you have no place to comment"?

I doubt that. You'd be screaming it was racist and how dare she.... and all of your loud voices would have plenty to say.

Please don't forget this album is not Beyonce's experience as a black woman. She grew up in an upper middle class neighborhood, both parents had excellent jobs, she had the best of everything, went to private school, and her dad quit his job to manage her budding career after she went to a school for the performing arts. I doubt SHE knows what it's like to be a black woman. Some other poetic visionary genius whittled this together and is using Bey as their vehicle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^Exactly. I really don't understand why so many are defending that statement. Just because she didn't grow up dirt poor in the ghetto doesn't take anything from her being a Black women.

It's clear from many posters here she's being disrespected. (For "pretending" to articulate "The Black Woman Experience")

I understand it perfectly. It is how those individuals define Black people or Black women. To the supporters of that statement, the only context they have of a Black woman is poor, uneducated, and unmarried. They choose not to see or recognize anything else.

This is not a true statement... I don't have that context of Black women at all... Isn't this in relation to Beyonces visuals and her songs about black women? I 100% recognize more than that visual, however we are talking about what Beyonce is singing about and her privileged upbringing.

I would feel the same if Taylor Swift was putting out visual albums depicting poor white America or if a boy band was singing about Katrina or socioeconomic or race struggles. I get people write lyrics and that songs can be about anything, but the specific lyrics may not be Taylor's experience or that boy band's experience or Beyonce's experience...