The Absurdity of U.S. News College Rankings - Per Malcolm Gladwell
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
Anonymous
See, when you type ridiculous stuff like this everyone discounts anything else you have to say, no matter how valuable. |
Anonymous
|
I knew this thread would soon become another one of those pointless arguments about prestige, like grown men fighting over whether Michael Jordan or Magic Johnson was the better player.
So here’s the tier list from the last one of these threads, which became a ridiculous 30-page brawl until people more or less reached a consensus. Undergraduate: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Princeton Columbia Caltech Penn Chicago Duke Northwestern Dartmouth Brown Cornell JHU Berkeley Overall: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Columbia Princeton Penn Chicago Berkeley Duke Northwestern |
Anonymous
Wrong Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Princeton Caltech Columbia (yes, NYC) Penn Dartmouth Brown Cornell Chicago Duke Northwestern JHU Berkeley Overall: Harvard Stanford MIT Berkeley Princeton Yale Columbia Penn Chicago Cornell Dartmouth Brown Duke Northwestern |
Anonymous
| Also, JHU above Berkeley undergraduate only for pred-med or related subjects. |
Anonymous
MJ was better. |
Anonymous
Wrong. Undergraduate: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Princeton Columbia Caltech Penn Chicago Duke Northwestern Dartmouth Brown Cornell JHU Berkeley Overall: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Columbia Princeton Penn Chicago Berkeley Duke Northwestern |
Anonymous
Wrong Undergraduate: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Princeton Columbia Caltech Penn Chicago Dartmouth Brown Duke Cornell Northwestern JHU Berkeley Overall: Harvard Stanford Berkeley MIT Columbia Princeton Yale Penn Chicago Cornell Dartmouth Brown Duke Northwestern |
Anonymous
You clearly don't work in academia because there is absolutely no way Dartmouth and Brown would be included in a list of the overall best universities in the nation. Undergraduate: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Princeton Columbia Caltech Penn Chicago Duke Northwestern Dartmouth Brown Cornell JHU Berkeley Overall: Harvard Stanford MIT Yale Columbia Princeton Penn Chicago Berkeley Duke Northwestern |
Anonymous
Good list |
Anonymous
First of all, the list was for overall prestige, not overall best. And second, you claim to work in academia and yet have Berkeley equivalent to Penn/Chicago and lower than Yale/Columba in a "overall best" list? Overall, Berkeley in considered to be in the tier of Harvard, Stanford, and MIT inside academia. In academia, it is considered equivalent to MIT/Stanford in engineering, equivalent to Yale in the humanities, equivalent to Harvard in the social sciences and equivalent to Stanford/Harvard/MIT in the natural sciences. And it competes for professors with these universities in these fields, despite the often lower pay. |
Anonymous
|
And in terms of undergraduates, although its true that Yale and Princeton were always more prestigious than Stanford and MIT historically, it isn't true anymore but rather the opposite.
The majority of top students would choose Stanford or MIT (given they could hack it) over Yale and Princeton today. The top Ivies used to have a virtual guarantee of top traditional jobs in finance and consulting but that Stanford/MIT is found more favorable even in those industries today. Anything related to high-tech, Stanford and MIT are the pinnacle while Yale and Princeton are quite a bit further down. |
Anonymous
And you base this opinion on...? |
Anonymous
it must be nice to be 50 and make a list. the overall reputations are completely inaccurate for 2021. They worked in 1990. are you 50? Princeton only has the Woodrow Wilson School (I don't know the new name so it can't be a top overall school (no law medical or business) same for MIT. You are just making things up. Plus you left off a lot of top universities. Screaming from NoVa does not make it true. |
Anonymous
Recruiting trends in these industries today? Do you think the tech industry views Yale/Princeton as equivalent to Stanford/MIT? Do you think the finance and consulting industries views Stanford/MIT as weaker than Yale/Princeton today? As for student preferences: Harvard - 82% Stanford - 82% MIT - 77% Princeton - 70% Yale - 69% Note that these schools are likely competing for the same students, although perhaps Harvard/MIT/Stanford are competing for slightly more talented ones. Thought MIT's yield would be lower considering its reputation as being extremely difficult. In terms of yield, Princeton/Yale are closer to Dartmouth than Harvard/Stanford/MIT, and closer to Columbia/Brown/Cornell than Harvard/Stanford. Yale is closer to Notre Dame than Harvard/Stanford. Parchment is unreliable, but for versus: Yale 30 - Harvard 70 Yale 39 - Stanford 61 Yale 33 - MIT 67 Thought Stanford would have an even bigger edge over Yale, TBH. Perhaps Yale has stronger financial aid. Princeton 23 - Harvard 77 Princeton 29 - Stanford 71 Princeton 44 - MIT 56 Rather clear that Harvard/Stanford/MIT are all in a tier above Yale/Princeton for undergraduates in prestige, and they certainly are as overall universities. |
Anonymous
|
^^^ Sorry but you don't understand how statistics work.
You list only the extreme outliers and show differences in them as an example of a substantive difference. If you showed a graph of yield rates of all colleges, it would show that the yield rates for Stanford and Princeton are virtually equal. Also, you assume yield rates = prestige, which has several gigantic flaws. First, it is a tiny cohort of people, and does not represent the general populace. Second, you assume that tiny cohort makes the choice based on prestige. |