AAP Results 2023

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Going through the FCPS aap seleftion is a good prep before the college application in this country. We don't know why kids don't get in, still quite don't know why they get in.

With the similar test score & qualifications, some make it and some don't. There are thousands of factors behind it.

My son put it so correctly, "Mom, actually not all the kids in AAP are smart. I think there is another way that they can get in."

Great observation!

Backdoor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who do some parents think test scores should be the most important factor in admissions? People here state that some kids do heavy prep (tutors) or are enrolled in academic extracurriculars which can “inflate” scores. My child did 1 practice test at home. Some of the verbal section questions seem knowledge based rather than measuring purely aptitude. Thus skewing towards kids who prep or are UMC. We are UMC but DC couldn’t identify some of the items on the practice verbal section (picture of a microscope and vocabulary that seemed advanced for a 2nd grader like paleontologist, appliance). DC used process of elimination but that only got down to 2 choices. I didn’t think it fair to prep DC on vocabulary just for the test. DC tested high on quantitative and nonverbal but average on verbal on the CogAT similar to the practice test results. CogAT Cumulative score was 137 which was not in pool for our high SES school. DC got in to LIV.

To me, GBRS is a better reflection of the student than a test. 1st grade and 2nd grade teachers speak highly of DC’s motivation, work, and knowledge acquisition (quickly absorbs and comprehends new concepts). For example, DC took the initiative to write 10 chapters for an in-class book assignment when only 3 were required. I haven’t received the AAP submission packet so I can only assume GBRS was high. I don’t have a child in AAP yet but I assume a child who has a poor GBRS despite high test scores wouldn’t be disciplined or driven enough for AAP.

To be clear, I don’t think my child is “gifted.” Based on the acronym Advanced Academic Program, I assume AAP is meant to be accelerated curriculum and not a Gifted program. I also don’t believe being gifted is an indicator of success. I was identified as gifted as a child (high test results / IQ, was in gifted program in a different state) but am no more successful than my spouse who has a strong work ethic but was not identified gifted.

I don't think any specific factor should be "the most important factor." A kid who is academically advanced and has a high GBRS, but low CogAT belongs in AAP. So does the kid who is academically advanced with high test scores that the teacher doesn't like or get. Likewise, the kid who has very high test scores and a high GBRS, but is on-grade level rather than being ahead belongs in AAP. It's absurd to bar any of these kids from accessing an advanced curriculum.

GBRS is pretty arbitrary and can drastically change from year to year. It shouldn't be used to exclude kids from AAP when they otherwise have the profile of an AAP kid.

I think a cogat of 150+ is generally sure shot with 99% iready even in high ses schools. NNAT 150+ helps but not as much as cogat. Anybody know of exceptions?

A cogAT of 150+ is an excessively high bar. That would be like 2 kids in the entire county.

My white child (this is relevant because we all know the bar is set to be Asian > White > Black-Hispanic) scored above a 150 on the COGAT and a 147 on the NNAT, 99% iready. His teacher e-mailed me before putting in the AAP packet saying, "sorry, but your child has not demonstrated to me that they have the capability to perform well on advanced work." Lol get focked lady. He did, luckily make it into AAP and is thriving there despite his idiot teacher. This is why I think GBRS is trash

Huh? Doesn't the 99% on iReady demonstrate that? Weird.

This is my whole point. We are allowing random teachers who have often nothing more than an undergraduate degree in a field equivalent to "general studies," who themselves probably have very average IQs, to assess intelligence and ability in children who will probably end up far exceeding them. This comes with the inherent judgment biases in humans, susceptibility to student and parent brown-nosing, and other sources that make teacher evaluations practically useless

That's why these evaluation have fallen out of favor. In many cases they're great but often also just biased.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who do some parents think test scores should be the most important factor in admissions? People here state that some kids do heavy prep (tutors) or are enrolled in academic extracurriculars which can “inflate” scores. My child did 1 practice test at home. Some of the verbal section questions seem knowledge based rather than measuring purely aptitude. Thus skewing towards kids who prep or are UMC. We are UMC but DC couldn’t identify some of the items on the practice verbal section (picture of a microscope and vocabulary that seemed advanced for a 2nd grader like paleontologist, appliance). DC used process of elimination but that only got down to 2 choices. I didn’t think it fair to prep DC on vocabulary just for the test. DC tested high on quantitative and nonverbal but average on verbal on the CogAT similar to the practice test results. CogAT Cumulative score was 137 which was not in pool for our high SES school. DC got in to LIV.

To me, GBRS is a better reflection of the student than a test. 1st grade and 2nd grade teachers speak highly of DC’s motivation, work, and knowledge acquisition (quickly absorbs and comprehends new concepts). For example, DC took the initiative to write 10 chapters for an in-class book assignment when only 3 were required. I haven’t received the AAP submission packet so I can only assume GBRS was high. I don’t have a child in AAP yet but I assume a child who has a poor GBRS despite high test scores wouldn’t be disciplined or driven enough for AAP.

To be clear, I don’t think my child is “gifted.” Based on the acronym Advanced Academic Program, I assume AAP is meant to be accelerated curriculum and not a Gifted program. I also don’t believe being gifted is an indicator of success. I was identified as gifted as a child (high test results / IQ, was in gifted program in a different state) but am no more successful than my spouse who has a strong work ethic but was not identified gifted.

I don't think any specific factor should be "the most important factor." A kid who is academically advanced and has a high GBRS, but low CogAT belongs in AAP. So does the kid who is academically advanced with high test scores that the teacher doesn't like or get. Likewise, the kid who has very high test scores and a high GBRS, but is on-grade level rather than being ahead belongs in AAP. It's absurd to bar any of these kids from accessing an advanced curriculum.

GBRS is pretty arbitrary and can drastically change from year to year. It shouldn't be used to exclude kids from AAP when they otherwise have the profile of an AAP kid.

I think a cogat of 150+ is generally sure shot with 99% iready even in high ses schools. NNAT 150+ helps but not as much as cogat. Anybody know of exceptions?

A cogAT of 150+ is an excessively high bar. That would be like 2 kids in the entire county.

My white child (this is relevant because we all know the bar is set to be Asian > White > Black-Hispanic) scored above a 150 on the COGAT and a 147 on the NNAT, 99% iready. His teacher e-mailed me before putting in the AAP packet saying, "sorry, but your child has not demonstrated to me that they have the capability to perform well on advanced work." Lol get focked lady. He did, luckily make it into AAP and is thriving there despite his idiot teacher. This is why I think GBRS is trash

Huh? Doesn't the 99% on iReady demonstrate that? Weird.

This is my whole point. We are allowing random teachers who have often nothing more than an undergraduate degree in a field equivalent to "general studies," who themselves probably have very average IQs, to assess intelligence and ability in children who will probably end up far exceeding them. This comes with the inherent judgment biases in humans, susceptibility to student and parent brown-nosing, and other sources that make teacher evaluations practically useless

Wow. Are you sure it's not you the teacher dislikes?

DP. The teacher almost certainly dislikes PP. It still isn't right for the teacher to give a low GBRS to a kid simply because they dislike the parent or a high GBRS to a kid because they like the parent. One of the issues with the subjectivity is that the teachers are more likely to see the positive in the kids they like or the kids whose parents they like.

Even the AAP equity report stated that the GBRS was not a psychometrically valid gifted inventory and discouraged its heavy use.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who do some parents think test scores should be the most important factor in admissions? People here state that some kids do heavy prep (tutors) or are enrolled in academic extracurriculars which can “inflate” scores. My child did 1 practice test at home. Some of the verbal section questions seem knowledge based rather than measuring purely aptitude. Thus skewing towards kids who prep or are UMC. We are UMC but DC couldn’t identify some of the items on the practice verbal section (picture of a microscope and vocabulary that seemed advanced for a 2nd grader like paleontologist, appliance). DC used process of elimination but that only got down to 2 choices. I didn’t think it fair to prep DC on vocabulary just for the test. DC tested high on quantitative and nonverbal but average on verbal on the CogAT similar to the practice test results. CogAT Cumulative score was 137 which was not in pool for our high SES school. DC got in to LIV.

To me, GBRS is a better reflection of the student than a test. 1st grade and 2nd grade teachers speak highly of DC’s motivation, work, and knowledge acquisition (quickly absorbs and comprehends new concepts). For example, DC took the initiative to write 10 chapters for an in-class book assignment when only 3 were required. I haven’t received the AAP submission packet so I can only assume GBRS was high. I don’t have a child in AAP yet but I assume a child who has a poor GBRS despite high test scores wouldn’t be disciplined or driven enough for AAP.

To be clear, I don’t think my child is “gifted.” Based on the acronym Advanced Academic Program, I assume AAP is meant to be accelerated curriculum and not a Gifted program. I also don’t believe being gifted is an indicator of success. I was identified as gifted as a child (high test results / IQ, was in gifted program in a different state) but am no more successful than my spouse who has a strong work ethic but was not identified gifted.

I don't think any specific factor should be "the most important factor." A kid who is academically advanced and has a high GBRS, but low CogAT belongs in AAP. So does the kid who is academically advanced with high test scores that the teacher doesn't like or get. Likewise, the kid who has very high test scores and a high GBRS, but is on-grade level rather than being ahead belongs in AAP. It's absurd to bar any of these kids from accessing an advanced curriculum.

GBRS is pretty arbitrary and can drastically change from year to year. It shouldn't be used to exclude kids from AAP when they otherwise have the profile of an AAP kid.

I think a cogat of 150+ is generally sure shot with 99% iready even in high ses schools. NNAT 150+ helps but not as much as cogat. Anybody know of exceptions?

A cogAT of 150+ is an excessively high bar. That would be like 2 kids in the entire county.

My white child (this is relevant because we all know the bar is set to be Asian > White > Black-Hispanic) scored above a 150 on the COGAT and a 147 on the NNAT, 99% iready. His teacher e-mailed me before putting in the AAP packet saying, "sorry, but your child has not demonstrated to me that they have the capability to perform well on advanced work." Lol get focked lady. He did, luckily make it into AAP and is thriving there despite his idiot teacher. This is why I think GBRS is trash

Huh? Doesn't the 99% on iReady demonstrate that? Weird.

This is my whole point. We are allowing random teachers who have often nothing more than an undergraduate degree in a field equivalent to "general studies," who themselves probably have very average IQs, to assess intelligence and ability in children who will probably end up far exceeding them. This comes with the inherent judgment biases in humans, susceptibility to student and parent brown-nosing, and other sources that make teacher evaluations practically useless

Wow. Are you sure it's not you the teacher dislikes?

DP. The teacher almost certainly dislikes PP. It still isn't right for the teacher to give a low GBRS to a kid simply because they dislike the parent or a high GBRS to a kid because they like the parent. One of the issues with the subjectivity is that the teachers are more likely to see the positive in the kids they like or the kids whose parents they like.

Even the AAP equity report stated that the GBRS was not a psychometrically valid gifted inventory and discouraged its heavy use.

FCPS uses the black box of GBRS to create an AAP program that will fit with their equity initiates. It’s the only subjective input that they can use.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who do some parents think test scores should be the most important factor in admissions? People here state that some kids do heavy prep (tutors) or are enrolled in academic extracurriculars which can “inflate” scores. My child did 1 practice test at home. Some of the verbal section questions seem knowledge based rather than measuring purely aptitude. Thus skewing towards kids who prep or are UMC. We are UMC but DC couldn’t identify some of the items on the practice verbal section (picture of a microscope and vocabulary that seemed advanced for a 2nd grader like paleontologist, appliance). DC used process of elimination but that only got down to 2 choices. I didn’t think it fair to prep DC on vocabulary just for the test. DC tested high on quantitative and nonverbal but average on verbal on the CogAT similar to the practice test results. CogAT Cumulative score was 137 which was not in pool for our high SES school. DC got in to LIV.

To me, GBRS is a better reflection of the student than a test. 1st grade and 2nd grade teachers speak highly of DC’s motivation, work, and knowledge acquisition (quickly absorbs and comprehends new concepts). For example, DC took the initiative to write 10 chapters for an in-class book assignment when only 3 were required. I haven’t received the AAP submission packet so I can only assume GBRS was high. I don’t have a child in AAP yet but I assume a child who has a poor GBRS despite high test scores wouldn’t be disciplined or driven enough for AAP.

To be clear, I don’t think my child is “gifted.” Based on the acronym Advanced Academic Program, I assume AAP is meant to be accelerated curriculum and not a Gifted program. I also don’t believe being gifted is an indicator of success. I was identified as gifted as a child (high test results / IQ, was in gifted program in a different state) but am no more successful than my spouse who has a strong work ethic but was not identified gifted.

I don't think any specific factor should be "the most important factor." A kid who is academically advanced and has a high GBRS, but low CogAT belongs in AAP. So does the kid who is academically advanced with high test scores that the teacher doesn't like or get. Likewise, the kid who has very high test scores and a high GBRS, but is on-grade level rather than being ahead belongs in AAP. It's absurd to bar any of these kids from accessing an advanced curriculum.

GBRS is pretty arbitrary and can drastically change from year to year. It shouldn't be used to exclude kids from AAP when they otherwise have the profile of an AAP kid.

I think a cogat of 150+ is generally sure shot with 99% iready even in high ses schools. NNAT 150+ helps but not as much as cogat. Anybody know of exceptions?

A cogAT of 150+ is an excessively high bar. That would be like 2 kids in the entire county.

My white child (this is relevant because we all know the bar is set to be Asian > White > Black-Hispanic) scored above a 150 on the COGAT and a 147 on the NNAT, 99% iready. His teacher e-mailed me before putting in the AAP packet saying, "sorry, but your child has not demonstrated to me that they have the capability to perform well on advanced work." Lol get focked lady. He did, luckily make it into AAP and is thriving there despite his idiot teacher. This is why I think GBRS is trash

Huh? Doesn't the 99% on iReady demonstrate that? Weird.

This is my whole point. We are allowing random teachers who have often nothing more than an undergraduate degree in a field equivalent to "general studies," who themselves probably have very average IQs, to assess intelligence and ability in children who will probably end up far exceeding them. This comes with the inherent judgment biases in humans, susceptibility to student and parent brown-nosing, and other sources that make teacher evaluations practically useless

Wow. Are you sure it's not you the teacher dislikes?

DP. The teacher almost certainly dislikes PP. It still isn't right for the teacher to give a low GBRS to a kid simply because they dislike the parent or a high GBRS to a kid because they like the parent. One of the issues with the subjectivity is that the teachers are more likely to see the positive in the kids they like or the kids whose parents they like.

Even the AAP equity report stated that the GBRS was not a psychometrically valid gifted inventory and discouraged its heavy use.

FCPS uses the black box of GBRS to create an AAP program that will fit with their equity initiates. It’s the only subjective input that they can use.

BINGO!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who do some parents think test scores should be the most important factor in admissions? People here state that some kids do heavy prep (tutors) or are enrolled in academic extracurriculars which can “inflate” scores. My child did 1 practice test at home. Some of the verbal section questions seem knowledge based rather than measuring purely aptitude. Thus skewing towards kids who prep or are UMC. We are UMC but DC couldn’t identify some of the items on the practice verbal section (picture of a microscope and vocabulary that seemed advanced for a 2nd grader like paleontologist, appliance). DC used process of elimination but that only got down to 2 choices. I didn’t think it fair to prep DC on vocabulary just for the test. DC tested high on quantitative and nonverbal but average on verbal on the CogAT similar to the practice test results. CogAT Cumulative score was 137 which was not in pool for our high SES school. DC got in to LIV.

To me, GBRS is a better reflection of the student than a test. 1st grade and 2nd grade teachers speak highly of DC’s motivation, work, and knowledge acquisition (quickly absorbs and comprehends new concepts). For example, DC took the initiative to write 10 chapters for an in-class book assignment when only 3 were required. I haven’t received the AAP submission packet so I can only assume GBRS was high. I don’t have a child in AAP yet but I assume a child who has a poor GBRS despite high test scores wouldn’t be disciplined or driven enough for AAP.

To be clear, I don’t think my child is “gifted.” Based on the acronym Advanced Academic Program, I assume AAP is meant to be accelerated curriculum and not a Gifted program. I also don’t believe being gifted is an indicator of success. I was identified as gifted as a child (high test results / IQ, was in gifted program in a different state) but am no more successful than my spouse who has a strong work ethic but was not identified gifted.

I don't think any specific factor should be "the most important factor." A kid who is academically advanced and has a high GBRS, but low CogAT belongs in AAP. So does the kid who is academically advanced with high test scores that the teacher doesn't like or get. Likewise, the kid who has very high test scores and a high GBRS, but is on-grade level rather than being ahead belongs in AAP. It's absurd to bar any of these kids from accessing an advanced curriculum.

GBRS is pretty arbitrary and can drastically change from year to year. It shouldn't be used to exclude kids from AAP when they otherwise have the profile of an AAP kid.

I think a cogat of 150+ is generally sure shot with 99% iready even in high ses schools. NNAT 150+ helps but not as much as cogat. Anybody know of exceptions?

A cogAT of 150+ is an excessively high bar. That would be like 2 kids in the entire county.

My white child (this is relevant because we all know the bar is set to be Asian > White > Black-Hispanic) scored above a 150 on the COGAT and a 147 on the NNAT, 99% iready. His teacher e-mailed me before putting in the AAP packet saying, "sorry, but your child has not demonstrated to me that they have the capability to perform well on advanced work." Lol get focked lady. He did, luckily make it into AAP and is thriving there despite his idiot teacher. This is why I think GBRS is trash

Huh? Doesn't the 99% on iReady demonstrate that? Weird.

This is my whole point. We are allowing random teachers who have often nothing more than an undergraduate degree in a field equivalent to "general studies," who themselves probably have very average IQs, to assess intelligence and ability in children who will probably end up far exceeding them. This comes with the inherent judgment biases in humans, susceptibility to student and parent brown-nosing, and other sources that make teacher evaluations practically useless

Wow. Are you sure it's not you the teacher dislikes?

DP. The teacher almost certainly dislikes PP. It still isn't right for the teacher to give a low GBRS to a kid simply because they dislike the parent or a high GBRS to a kid because they like the parent. One of the issues with the subjectivity is that the teachers are more likely to see the positive in the kids they like or the kids whose parents they like.

Even the AAP equity report stated that the GBRS was not a psychometrically valid gifted inventory and discouraged its heavy use.

FCPS uses the black box of GBRS to create an AAP program that will fit with their equity initiates. It’s the only subjective input that they can use.

BINGO!

That’s why I try not to blame the teachers. They have a lot on their plate. And writing GBRS is a part of their jobs, sure, but so are the million other things that they do that are not a part of their jobs. The in pool localized cut offs was a school board decision. And then the ‘central selection committee’ gets to admit the kids they want based on whatever factors they want. And this isn’t college, nor is it necessarily for the gifted (which is like the top 0.5% or less). It’s an advanced (speed, depth, breadth) curriculum in a public school system for kids who can handle it. They should either offer it to everyone no matter what. Or offer it to every child who can handle it. Which is probably every kid who tests in whatever percentile cutoff of the CogAT seems appropriate, PLUS the kids from under resourced schools who may not have tested as well because lots of factors, but the teachers know they can handle it.

Instead FCPS has started using it as a symbols of their dedication to equity and has given those marching orders to admin and central selection committee alike.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Going through the FCPS aap seleftion is a good prep before the college application in this country. We don't know why kids don't get in, still quite don't know why they get in.

With the similar test score & qualifications, some make it and some don't. There are thousands of factors behind it.

My son put it so correctly, "Mom, actually not all the kids in AAP are smart. I think there is another way that they can get in."

Great observation!

I agree that AAP is not really a program for the gifted and I have two in it. I try to discourage the sentiment I see with some AAP kids that they are smarter than everyone else including gen ed kids, etc. Bc that’s not precocious, it’s obnoxious. But yes, non geniuses can succeed. It’s a lesson that extends well beyond college; lots of people making $$$ and climbing up the corporate ladder who aren’t smart in the standardized tests definition way but are savvy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Going through the FCPS aap seleftion is a good prep before the college application in this country. We don't know why kids don't get in, still quite don't know why they get in.

With the similar test score & qualifications, some make it and some don't. There are thousands of factors behind it.

My son put it so correctly, "Mom, actually not all the kids in AAP are smart. I think there is another way that they can get in."

Great observation!

I agree that AAP is not really a program for the gifted and I have two in it. I try to discourage the sentiment I see with some AAP kids that they are smarter than everyone else including gen ed kids, etc. Bc that’s not precocious, it’s obnoxious. But yes, non geniuses can succeed. It’s a lesson that extends well beyond college; lots of people making $$$ and climbing up the corporate ladder who aren’t smart in the standardized tests definition way but are savvy.

And that's the dilemna AAP is meant to cater to ONLY gifted kids as per VA law and there is so much dilution

[Anonymous]

I agree that AAP is not really a program for the gifted and I have two in it. I try to discourage the sentiment I see with some AAP kids that they are smarter than everyone else including gen ed kids, etc. Bc that’s not precocious, it’s obnoxious. But yes, non geniuses can succeed. It’s a lesson that extends well beyond college; lots of people making $$$ and climbing up the corporate ladder who aren’t smart in the standardized tests definition way but are savvy.

That is a huge issue for this country. Don’t be proud of it.

[Anonymous]

Current grade: 2nd
NNAT/CoGAT: 155/151
GBRS (if known): 4COs
School or center: Haycock
In/not in: In

Not sure how the curriculum will be different, but hopefully the program can offer a more academically challenging curriculum.

[Anonymous]

How do we find out what level IV center we attend? Our home school is Laurel Ridge. TIA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do we find out what level IV center we attend? Our home school is Laurel Ridge. TIA

You may contact AART at the school to find out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do we find out what level IV center we attend? Our home school is Laurel Ridge. TIA

Check below link for info:

https://www.fcps.edu/academics/elementary/advanced-academic-programs/advanced-academic-level-iv-school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I agree that AAP is not really a program for the gifted and I have two in it. I try to discourage the sentiment I see with some AAP kids that they are smarter than everyone else including gen ed kids, etc. Bc that’s not precocious, it’s obnoxious. But yes, non geniuses can succeed. It’s a lesson that extends well beyond college; lots of people making $$$ and climbing up the corporate ladder who aren’t smart in the standardized tests definition way but are savvy.

That is a huge issue for this country. Don’t be proud of it.
Where do you hear pride? It’s messed up but it’s very much a reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do we find out what level IV center we attend? Our home school is Laurel Ridge. TIA

It’s White Oaks and depending on where you live in the neighborhood, your kid can get on the bus at LRES or somewhere near your house.