Peer Masking as a Reasonable Accommodation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t read all the comments, so maybe this has been discussed. I think it would be reasonable BUT it would open a whole can of worms for parents to ask for accommodations that require actions by other peers in school, which is something we just can’t do. School administrators are constantly having to deny reasonable requests by reasonable parents because they’d be opening themselves up to unreasonable requests from unreasonable parents. Over my years in special education I’ve had parents want accommodations requiring other students to sit with their children at lunch, to not sing Happy Birthday, to not speak a foreign language, to not bring foods the child is not allowed to school ( not allergy related), and so, so much more. And these are not parents you can explain things to. And this is not even mentioning the unreasonable parents who would be upset that their child had to mask.

Schools have to field requests for accommodations all the time, some are off the wall and some are very needed. There's a process for it. But you are legally wrong that schools can't require actions by other peers in school.

By your logic we should get rid of all disability laws cuz they open up a can of worms.

I can’t think of any other accomodation that requires every kid to wear something/do something.

As parents we should set a good example and teach our kids it’s the right thing to do.

please just stop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I simply don't get it. School-aged kids can mask. Teaching them community responsibility is a good thing. Teaching them to care about other students, their families and staff is a good thing. If a child has SN and cannot wear one, it's one thing but given how many viruses are going around right now, it makes sense. It's funny how the same parents screaming about learning loss when kids get sick are the same refusing masks and wanting accommodations for their kids when they are out sick. I don't get why people enjoy being sick. We've been so much healthier by masking, only eating outdoors, etc.

My kids got much sicker during the 2021-22 school year while masking than this year so far. I think in part because they’re not constantly touching their faces to adjust their masks or pull them down. Their mental health is better. My oldest in particular had a lot of negative feelings about school after a year of virtual in K and a year of masking in 1st grade, he particularly hated masking during PE. He’s finally having his first normal year of elementary school and now loves to go. My younger kid has some sensory issues (and an IEP) and can’t wear a mask unless it’s one of those ridiculously thin athletic masks (which is what we did to check a box when masking was required so that he wouldn’t continue to lose out on needed services). So for my kids, not masking is absolutely a healthier choice. I know I’m not alone in not wanting my kids to mask. Stop trying to push the narrative that all kids can mask without issue, it’s just not true.

Maybe your kids got sicker as they were doing things outside of school not masked. That makes no sense they were sicker while masking. It sounds like you are part of the problem and what example you set and teach in your home. Perhaps you should have gotten your kids better-fitting masks. If they are having mental health issues, did you get them a therapist and make changes in your home to fix the problems at home? Sounds like there is much more to this and empathy toward others and teaching kids how to live in a community isn't a priority.

Ever think of kids like mine who have had to continue in virtual school because of kids like yours and families like yours? Perhaps your kids would have been healthier if as a community those who could, stayed home sick and everyone masked. I wish I could live in a self-centered world like you but I don't have your privilege.

Please get your kid's mental health treatment given their challenges. Unmasking isn't going to fix those things. And, get the younger child a full neuropsych as sensory issues are not a diagnosis.

DP. Can't the same be said for the sick child whose family requests a masked environment? Stay home where they can minimize additional risk?

No wonder our kids don’t get how to behave. If a child is sick, they would be getting reatment from a doctor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I simply don't get it. School-aged kids can mask. Teaching them community responsibility is a good thing. Teaching them to care about other students, their families and staff is a good thing. If a child has SN and cannot wear one, it's one thing but given how many viruses are going around right now, it makes sense. It's funny how the same parents screaming about learning loss when kids get sick are the same refusing masks and wanting accommodations for their kids when they are out sick. I don't get why people enjoy being sick. We've been so much healthier by masking, only eating outdoors, etc.

School-age kids can do lots of things. That doesn't mean that they should, nor should they be asked to.

Yes they should. You show them by example.

Pass on the forced masking. You can teach your kids that not all demands are reasonable and it's the right thing to do to not make unreasonable demands of others and only thinking of yourself when there is a classroom of children that may have their own issues and reasons that making doesn't work for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I simply don't get it. School-aged kids can mask. Teaching them community responsibility is a good thing. Teaching them to care about other students, their families and staff is a good thing. If a child has SN and cannot wear one, it's one thing but given how many viruses are going around right now, it makes sense. It's funny how the same parents screaming about learning loss when kids get sick are the same refusing masks and wanting accommodations for their kids when they are out sick. I don't get why people enjoy being sick. We've been so much healthier by masking, only eating outdoors, etc.

My kids got much sicker during the 2021-22 school year while masking than this year so far. I think in part because they’re not constantly touching their faces to adjust their masks or pull them down. Their mental health is better. My oldest in particular had a lot of negative feelings about school after a year of virtual in K and a year of masking in 1st grade, he particularly hated masking during PE. He’s finally having his first normal year of elementary school and now loves to go. My younger kid has some sensory issues (and an IEP) and can’t wear a mask unless it’s one of those ridiculously thin athletic masks (which is what we did to check a box when masking was required so that he wouldn’t continue to lose out on needed services). So for my kids, not masking is absolutely a healthier choice. I know I’m not alone in not wanting my kids to mask. Stop trying to push the narrative that all kids can mask without issue, it’s just not true.

Maybe your kids got sicker as they were doing things outside of school not masked. That makes no sense they were sicker while masking. It sounds like you are part of the problem and what example you set and teach in your home. Perhaps you should have gotten your kids better-fitting masks. If they are having mental health issues, did you get them a therapist and make changes in your home to fix the problems at home? Sounds like there is much more to this and empathy toward others and teaching kids how to live in a community isn't a priority.

Ever think of kids like mine who have had to continue in virtual school because of kids like yours and families like yours? Perhaps your kids would have been healthier if as a community those who could, stayed home sick and everyone masked. I wish I could live in a self-centered world like you but I don't have your privilege.

Please get your kid's mental health treatment given their challenges. Unmasking isn't going to fix those things. And, get the younger child a full neuropsych as sensory issues are not a diagnosis.

What unicorn diagnosis does your child have that is significant enough to require mandating an entire classroom of children and a teacher to wear a mask all day, every day, yet isn’t so limiting to preclude your child from being in class with 25 some odd kids of variable masking adherence who probably spent their weekend out at play place birthday parties and sleepovers and traveling?

My kids are too old for play dates but no, we stopped traveling, no sleep overs or going into others homes. It’s not the child but a parent. Children has aready lost one parent, isn’t that enough? Are you going to take the kids if another parent dies?

My kids mask due to choice. My kids go to virtual school by choice. Unlike you, they get it. They can go in person time they want. But, they know people like you will send their sick kids to school and not think twice and the, bringing home something can cause serious issues in our home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t read all the comments, so maybe this has been discussed. I think it would be reasonable BUT it would open a whole can of worms for parents to ask for accommodations that require actions by other peers in school, which is something we just can’t do. School administrators are constantly having to deny reasonable requests by reasonable parents because they’d be opening themselves up to unreasonable requests from unreasonable parents. Over my years in special education I’ve had parents want accommodations requiring other students to sit with their children at lunch, to not sing Happy Birthday, to not speak a foreign language, to not bring foods the child is not allowed to school ( not allergy related), and so, so much more. And these are not parents you can explain things to. And this is not even mentioning the unreasonable parents who would be upset that their child had to mask.

Schools have to field requests for accommodations all the time, some are off the wall and some are very needed. There's a process for it. But you are legally wrong that schools can't require actions by other peers in school.

By your logic we should get rid of all disability laws cuz they open up a can of worms.

I can’t think of any other accomodation that requires every kid to wear something/do something.

Well it sounds like you are not a lawyer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The "no peanut butter" analogy isn't really comparable. There's no meaningful effect on other kids if they can't bring peanut butter and jelly sandwiches to school. They have plenty of other lunch options.

I can't actually think of any comparable situation where "reasonable accommodation" has been interpreted to require other students (rather than schools) to take certain actions. I see requiring masks on other kids to be more equivalent to requiring the teacher to give instruction in sign language, and requiring the other kids to learn sign language to accommodate one deaf kid in the class.

Queue all the parents who ONLY can bring peanut butter for their very special kids.

NP. This always comes up and isn’t a thing. They sell pb&j at schools. Peanut butter is not airborne. It was never banned from lunches.

What decade are you living in? A lot of schools are peanut free, and even more classrooms are.

I have one in middle school and one in high school. We have not experienced a peanut free school since preschool.

Then you should limit your comments to your own experiences. You stated that it is never banned and that this isn't a thing. That's just not accurate.

The same applies to you, saying nuts are banned in schools. You are limited to your own experiences.

So you're really doubling down on this PB thing, huh. You think your own experience of having PB in your childrens' schools applies EVERYWHERE else? It's always interesting to see how parents put on tunnel vision to suit their own internal narrative.

Seems like you’re the one doubling down and thinking your experience is right.
-DP

Maybe do a little research. Google is your friend. It will broaden your mind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can we stop with the nut analogy? Masking is FAR more invasive and burdensome than a nut ban. They have nothing in common.

It doesn't even matter. Under this settlement which cements the earlier ruling in the same case, peer masking is a reasonable accommodation. End of story.

[Anonymous]

Absolutely not going to happen. Ever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

Nope. There are home based teaching options if you are that medically fragile.

+1
This is not at all reasonable to impose on the rest of the kids.

Ableism.

Just add an “ism” allegation when you don’t agree with something someone says and then you don’t actually have to think about any nuances!

This is really not a very effective rebuttal. Of course it's discriminatory to exclude the disabled child from participating in society.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t read all the comments, so maybe this has been discussed. I think it would be reasonable BUT it would open a whole can of worms for parents to ask for accommodations that require actions by other peers in school, which is something we just can’t do. School administrators are constantly having to deny reasonable requests by reasonable parents because they’d be opening themselves up to unreasonable requests from unreasonable parents. Over my years in special education I’ve had parents want accommodations requiring other students to sit with their children at lunch, to not sing Happy Birthday, to not speak a foreign language, to not bring foods the child is not allowed to school ( not allergy related), and so, so much more. And these are not parents you can explain things to. And this is not even mentioning the unreasonable parents who would be upset that their child had to mask.

Schools have to field requests for accommodations all the time, some are off the wall and some are very needed. There's a process for it. But you are legally wrong that schools can't require actions by other peers in school.

By your logic we should get rid of all disability laws cuz they open up a can of worms.

I can’t think of any other accomodation that requires every kid to wear something/do something.

Well it sounds like you are not a lawyer.

I am a lawyer and I am very interested to hear what accomodation requires other people to wear something they haven’t chosen on their bodies. Because if it can happen in schools it could happen in the workplace.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I simply don't get it. School-aged kids can mask. Teaching them community responsibility is a good thing. Teaching them to care about other students, their families and staff is a good thing. If a child has SN and cannot wear one, it's one thing but given how many viruses are going around right now, it makes sense. It's funny how the same parents screaming about learning loss when kids get sick are the same refusing masks and wanting accommodations for their kids when they are out sick. I don't get why people enjoy being sick. We've been so much healthier by masking, only eating outdoors, etc.

My kids got much sicker during the 2021-22 school year while masking than this year so far. I think in part because they’re not constantly touching their faces to adjust their masks or pull them down. Their mental health is better. My oldest in particular had a lot of negative feelings about school after a year of virtual in K and a year of masking in 1st grade, he particularly hated masking during PE. He’s finally having his first normal year of elementary school and now loves to go. My younger kid has some sensory issues (and an IEP) and can’t wear a mask unless it’s one of those ridiculously thin athletic masks (which is what we did to check a box when masking was required so that he wouldn’t continue to lose out on needed services). So for my kids, not masking is absolutely a healthier choice. I know I’m not alone in not wanting my kids to mask. Stop trying to push the narrative that all kids can mask without issue, it’s just not true.

Maybe your kids got sicker as they were doing things outside of school not masked. That makes no sense they were sicker while masking. It sounds like you are part of the problem and what example you set and teach in your home. Perhaps you should have gotten your kids better-fitting masks. If they are having mental health issues, did you get them a therapist and make changes in your home to fix the problems at home? Sounds like there is much more to this and empathy toward others and teaching kids how to live in a community isn't a priority.

Ever think of kids like mine who have had to continue in virtual school because of kids like yours and families like yours? Perhaps your kids would have been healthier if as a community those who could, stayed home sick and everyone masked. I wish I could live in a self-centered world like you but I don't have your privilege.

Please get your kid's mental health treatment given their challenges. Unmasking isn't going to fix those things. And, get the younger child a full neuropsych as sensory issues are not a diagnosis.

What unicorn diagnosis does your child have that is significant enough to require mandating an entire classroom of children and a teacher to wear a mask all day, every day, yet isn’t so limiting to preclude your child from being in class with 25 some odd kids of variable masking adherence who probably spent their weekend out at play place birthday parties and sleepovers and traveling?

My kids are too old for play dates but no, we stopped traveling, no sleep overs or going into others homes. It’s not the child but a parent. Children has aready lost one parent, isn’t that enough? Are you going to take the kids if another parent dies?

My kids mask due to choice. My kids go to virtual school by choice. Unlike you, they get it. They can go in person time they want. But, they know people like you will send their sick kids to school and not think twice and the, bringing home something can cause serious issues in our home.

Once again for people who do not understand how illness works. Often peak contagiousness is *before* symptoms occur and many lingering symptoms are not contagious. People can do their best not to send a sick kid to school … and illness will still spread. Schools will never be a sterile environment. You’re living in la la land. And yeah, my kids are doing indoor play dates, sleepovers, air travel, play places, etc. We’ve accepted the risk of illness because that is just life. You can (and probably should) opt out of things like this with a medically fragile kid. But if you send your child to school, you should know that like 95% of families are back to all this normal stuff. Are you suggesting that kids should now also be giving up activities outside of school that could bring germs into a classroom? Like should the entire world now revolve around your family because a sick kid* might end up at school.

*By sick I mean pre-symptoms, asymptomatic, or they could come down with symptoms mid-day they didn’t have when they left for school. Of course it’s selfish to send a fever-ish, clearly sick child to school. But viruses spread even without parents sending their blatantly sick kid to school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, if a student in your child’s class has cancer, you’re not willing to have your kid mask?

Nope. There are home based teaching options if you are that medically fragile.

+1
This is not at all reasonable to impose on the rest of the kids.

Ableism.

Just add an “ism” allegation when you don’t agree with something someone says and then you don’t actually have to think about any nuances!

This is really not a very effective rebuttal. Of course it's discriminatory to exclude the disabled child from participating in society.

A medically fragile child cannot be in a congregate setting with a classroom full of kids because of their health condition, not because they’re being excluded from “participating in society.” A severely autistic or intellectually delayed is not going to be able to be in a mainstream classroom either because of their disability. It’s not an “ism.” Masking every child in class will not stop viruses from spreading. Viruses including COVID still made their way through schools even with mask mandates. It’s a classroom with kids who may be harboring germs, not a hospital operating room.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we stop with the nut analogy? Masking is FAR more invasive and burdensome than a nut ban. They have nothing in common.

It doesn't even matter. Under this settlement which cements the earlier ruling in the same case, peer masking is a reasonable accommodation. End of story.

Did you read the court decision. It’s not end of story. The court itself pointed out contradictory studies as to the effectiveness of masking and other accommodations the schools could consider like improved ventilation. This is more like the prologue than “the end.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I simply don't get it. School-aged kids can mask. Teaching them community responsibility is a good thing. Teaching them to care about other students, their families and staff is a good thing. If a child has SN and cannot wear one, it's one thing but given how many viruses are going around right now, it makes sense. It's funny how the same parents screaming about learning loss when kids get sick are the same refusing masks and wanting accommodations for their kids when they are out sick. I don't get why people enjoy being sick. We've been so much healthier by masking, only eating outdoors, etc.

And by "healthier" do you mean an overwhelming surge of RSV and the flu, so much so that hospitals told families not to bring their kids in?

[Anonymous]

You guys are more into arguing the age old game of simply masking or not. Something was said months ago and it came across as friendly and considerate for everyone. It's really not as big of a deal as you like to think it is.