APS Lucy Calkins- how does this happen?

[Anonymous]

And now that we are also talking about writing, perhaps we should consider whether K kids are being taught appropriate letter formation. Hint- nope. It would be most effective to teach cursive first, but we’ve completely abandoned cursive.

That should be it’s own thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just phonics. All kids benefit from a content-rich ELA curriculum. Read The Knowledge Gap or any article by Natalie Wexler.

This is why actual teachers are saying this is more complex than it looks. ALL kids will do better when they have relevant background knowledge to activate and apply to the text. Experiences, common knowledge, etc. So the curriculum has to reflect all kids cultural backgrounds appropriately which is why it needs to be diverse but of course this is another reason kids growing up in poverty tend not to do well: they lack books and exposure to these experiences and common knowledge ideas that give them that background knowledge which is a huge activator of understanding and attaching meaning to a text. Students in poverty also tend to be Black or Hispanic, and they are also least represented in a curriculum, reading or otherwise. They then don’t see themselves in the books and disengage and become harder to get back on track. Many teachers are white; they lack a true understanding of how to teach students who aren’t white and pinpoint Black and Hispanic students as behavior problems or having special needs. They get less reading instruction. It is really, REALLY multiplayers and is not as simple as “Lucy sucks and all teachers who use it suck.” You could change reading curriculum and it wouldn’t matter if you didn’t address the other stuff too.

Natalie Wexler addresses this in her book which you clearly haven’t read. There are two components to reading comprehension: (a) decoding which is phonics and (b) knowledge. You need both for reading comprehension. Schools need to have a knowledge based curriculum to address gaps in background knowledge. Curriculums such as Wit and Wisdom and Core Knowledge focus on developing background knowledge. You need a curriculum to address background knowledge. Otherwise kids may be learning about let’s say the solar system every year because their first grade teacher decided to teach it, then their second grade teacher, then third etc. So by the end of elementary school they would have had 4 years where they learned about the solar system but let’s say zero years learning about ancient Egypt.

I literally said all that and more on the last page and in this comment. I am an actual literacy teacher, not someone who just read a Wexler book.

Not PP, but... you said that kids lack background knowledge and this is a big contributor to literacy issues. You did not, however, offer any suggestions to fix it. Curricula like Core Knowledge and Wit & Wisdom do just that.

No they don’t. I said you could switch curriculum which may address some but real change would require a systemic overhaul, not just curriculum. Do not be foolish enough to believe any one curriculum itself will address systemic inequities

You’re right!! Just because curriculum change can’t fix ALL systemic inequities, we shouldn’t try to fix SOME.

You’re a fool, and a big reason why things will never get better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm homeschooling due to the poor state of FCPS ELA instruction.

Just curious, for your kids who are DL at the public schools what does DL writing instruction look like?

My daughter is in 5th and our current writing assignment is being done done in stages. It has been 2 weeks of back and forth. We have just finished up our 3rd revision to the rough draft and are moving today into proofreading. Only now are we moving from pencil and paper to typing it. We have separate Grammer lessons, but with my daughter in 5th we are really focusing on semicolon use for this exercise.

How does this writing process work for DL? I'm trying to wrap my head around this. Do teachers add notes into the turned in document? For me, at home, I make so many corrections in red ink. I don't tell my daughter the answers, but circle the issues...use question marks, wavy lines, star important ideas and such. Are kids meeting with teachers one on one and getting feedback on their writing? Seems quite difficult to so these hand offs online.

You should go to Amazon and purchase a copy of The Writing Revolution. It will really help!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm homeschooling due to the poor state of FCPS ELA instruction.

Just curious, for your kids who are DL at the public schools what does DL writing instruction look like?

My daughter is in 5th and our current writing assignment is being done done in stages. It has been 2 weeks of back and forth. We have just finished up our 3rd revision to the rough draft and are moving today into proofreading. Only now are we moving from pencil and paper to typing it. We have separate Grammer lessons, but with my daughter in 5th we are really focusing on semicolon use for this exercise.

How does this writing process work for DL? I'm trying to wrap my head around this. Do teachers add notes into the turned in document? For me, at home, I make so many corrections in red ink. I don't tell my daughter the answers, but circle the issues...use question marks, wavy lines, star important ideas and such. Are kids meeting with teachers one on one and getting feedback on their writing? Seems quite difficult to so these hand offs online.

You should go to Amazon and purchase a copy of The Writing Revolution. It will really help!

My 5th grader is working on one piece with his class and they are doing a 5 paragraph story. It seems as though they are working on a paragraph a week but they started by outlining the entire story.

I noticed that there was a lot of errors in grammar and punctuation. I printed out the story and went over the corrections but typed them in myself. I think it would be soul crushing to do it at 10..on an ipad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just phonics. All kids benefit from a content-rich ELA curriculum. Read The Knowledge Gap or any article by Natalie Wexler.

This is why actual teachers are saying this is more complex than it looks. ALL kids will do better when they have relevant background knowledge to activate and apply to the text. Experiences, common knowledge, etc. So the curriculum has to reflect all kids cultural backgrounds appropriately which is why it needs to be diverse but of course this is another reason kids growing up in poverty tend not to do well: they lack books and exposure to these experiences and common knowledge ideas that give them that background knowledge which is a huge activator of understanding and attaching meaning to a text. Students in poverty also tend to be Black or Hispanic, and they are also least represented in a curriculum, reading or otherwise. They then don’t see themselves in the books and disengage and become harder to get back on track. Many teachers are white; they lack a true understanding of how to teach students who aren’t white and pinpoint Black and Hispanic students as behavior problems or having special needs. They get less reading instruction. It is really, REALLY multiplayers and is not as simple as “Lucy sucks and all teachers who use it suck.” You could change reading curriculum and it wouldn’t matter if you didn’t address the other stuff too.

Natalie Wexler addresses this in her book which you clearly haven’t read. There are two components to reading comprehension: (a) decoding which is phonics and (b) knowledge. You need both for reading comprehension. Schools need to have a knowledge based curriculum to address gaps in background knowledge. Curriculums such as Wit and Wisdom and Core Knowledge focus on developing background knowledge. You need a curriculum to address background knowledge. Otherwise kids may be learning about let’s say the solar system every year because their first grade teacher decided to teach it, then their second grade teacher, then third etc. So by the end of elementary school they would have had 4 years where they learned about the solar system but let’s say zero years learning about ancient Egypt.

I literally said all that and more on the last page and in this comment. I am an actual literacy teacher, not someone who just read a Wexler book.

Not PP, but... you said that kids lack background knowledge and this is a big contributor to literacy issues. You did not, however, offer any suggestions to fix it. Curricula like Core Knowledge and Wit & Wisdom do just that.

No they don’t. I said you could switch curriculum which may address some but real change would require a systemic overhaul, not just curriculum. Do not be foolish enough to believe any one curriculum itself will address systemic inequities

You’re right!! Just because curriculum change can’t fix ALL systemic inequities, we shouldn’t try to fix SOME.

You’re a fool, and a big reason why things will never get better.

We need to work on teaching you how to read I guess. At no point have I said we should not be using a better curriculum for reading. Not once. Nor has anyone else. Nobody in this thread has actually advocated for sticking with Calkins.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm homeschooling due to the poor state of FCPS ELA instruction.

Just curious, for your kids who are DL at the public schools what does DL writing instruction look like?

My daughter is in 5th and our current writing assignment is being done done in stages. It has been 2 weeks of back and forth. We have just finished up our 3rd revision to the rough draft and are moving today into proofreading. Only now are we moving from pencil and paper to typing it. We have separate Grammer lessons, but with my daughter in 5th we are really focusing on semicolon use for this exercise.

How does this writing process work for DL? I'm trying to wrap my head around this. Do teachers add notes into the turned in document? For me, at home, I make so many corrections in red ink. I don't tell my daughter the answers, but circle the issues...use question marks, wavy lines, star important ideas and such. Are kids meeting with teachers one on one and getting feedback on their writing? Seems quite difficult to so these hand offs online.

You should go to Amazon and purchase a copy of The Writing Revolution. It will really help!

My 5th grader is working on one piece with his class and they are doing a 5 paragraph story. It seems as though they are working on a paragraph a week but they started by outlining the entire story.

I noticed that there was a lot of errors in grammar and punctuation. I printed out the story and went over the corrections but typed them in myself. I think it would be soul crushing to do it at 10..on an ipad.

Losing family members is soul crushing. Losing a pet. Getting a disease. Witnessing abuse. Typing on an iPad is not soul crushing.

[Anonymous]

And now that we are also talking about writing, perhaps we should consider whether K kids are being taught appropriate letter formation. Hint- nope. It would be most effective to teach cursive first, but we’ve completely abandoned cursive.

That should be it’s own thread.

According to the VA SOLs, cursive is supposed to be taught in 2nd grade.
BTW, it should be "its," not "it's." As in "its own thread."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not just phonics. All kids benefit from a content-rich ELA curriculum. Read The Knowledge Gap or any article by Natalie Wexler.

This is why actual teachers are saying this is more complex than it looks. ALL kids will do better when they have relevant background knowledge to activate and apply to the text. Experiences, common knowledge, etc. So the curriculum has to reflect all kids cultural backgrounds appropriately which is why it needs to be diverse but of course this is another reason kids growing up in poverty tend not to do well: they lack books and exposure to these experiences and common knowledge ideas that give them that background knowledge which is a huge activator of understanding and attaching meaning to a text. Students in poverty also tend to be Black or Hispanic, and they are also least represented in a curriculum, reading or otherwise. They then don’t see themselves in the books and disengage and become harder to get back on track. Many teachers are white; they lack a true understanding of how to teach students who aren’t white and pinpoint Black and Hispanic students as behavior problems or having special needs. They get less reading instruction. It is really, REALLY multiplayers and is not as simple as “Lucy sucks and all teachers who use it suck.” You could change reading curriculum and it wouldn’t matter if you didn’t address the other stuff too.

Natalie Wexler addresses this in her book which you clearly haven’t read. There are two components to reading comprehension: (a) decoding which is phonics and (b) knowledge. You need both for reading comprehension. Schools need to have a knowledge based curriculum to address gaps in background knowledge. Curriculums such as Wit and Wisdom and Core Knowledge focus on developing background knowledge. You need a curriculum to address background knowledge. Otherwise kids may be learning about let’s say the solar system every year because their first grade teacher decided to teach it, then their second grade teacher, then third etc. So by the end of elementary school they would have had 4 years where they learned about the solar system but let’s say zero years learning about ancient Egypt.

I literally said all that and more on the last page and in this comment. I am an actual literacy teacher, not someone who just read a Wexler book.

Not PP, but... you said that kids lack background knowledge and this is a big contributor to literacy issues. You did not, however, offer any suggestions to fix it. Curricula like Core Knowledge and Wit & Wisdom do just that.

No they don’t. I said you could switch curriculum which may address some but real change would require a systemic overhaul, not just curriculum. Do not be foolish enough to believe any one curriculum itself will address systemic inequities

You’re right!! Just because curriculum change can’t fix ALL systemic inequities, we shouldn’t try to fix SOME.

You’re a fool, and a big reason why things will never get better.

We need to work on teaching you how to read I guess. At no point have I said we should not be using a better curriculum for reading. Not once. Nor has anyone else. Nobody in this thread has actually advocated for sticking with Calkins.

Go back and read through the posts. There are people that think Lucy Calkins is good.

And, while you’re at it, go ahead and read what I wrote. Did I say curriculum change will solve everything? No. Will it be a step in the right direction? Yes.

You’re the one arguing that it won’t solve ALL systemic inequities. Of course it won’t. Come on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

And now that we are also talking about writing, perhaps we should consider whether K kids are being taught appropriate letter formation. Hint- nope. It would be most effective to teach cursive first, but we’ve completely abandoned cursive.

That should be it’s own thread.

According to the VA SOLs, cursive is supposed to be taught in 2nd grade.
BTW, it should be "its," not "it's." As in "its own thread."

I noticed this also, but wasn’t going to be a d*ck about it (like you), since my phone frequently autocorrects to “it’s” when it shouldn’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm homeschooling due to the poor state of FCPS ELA instruction.

Just curious, for your kids who are DL at the public schools what does DL writing instruction look like?

My daughter is in 5th and our current writing assignment is being done done in stages. It has been 2 weeks of back and forth. We have just finished up our 3rd revision to the rough draft and are moving today into proofreading. Only now are we moving from pencil and paper to typing it. We have separate Grammer lessons, but with my daughter in 5th we are really focusing on semicolon use for this exercise.

How does this writing process work for DL? I'm trying to wrap my head around this. Do teachers add notes into the turned in document? For me, at home, I make so many corrections in red ink. I don't tell my daughter the answers, but circle the issues...use question marks, wavy lines, star important ideas and such. Are kids meeting with teachers one on one and getting feedback on their writing? Seems quite difficult to so these hand offs online.

You should go to Amazon and purchase a copy of The Writing Revolution. It will really help!

My 5th grader is working on one piece with his class and they are doing a 5 paragraph story. It seems as though they are working on a paragraph a week but they started by outlining the entire story.

I noticed that there was a lot of errors in grammar and punctuation. I printed out the story and went over the corrections but typed them in myself. I think it would be soul crushing to do it at 10..on an ipad.

Losing family members is soul crushing. Losing a pet. Getting a disease. Witnessing abuse. Typing on an iPad is not soul crushing.

Wow. I've lived through all that and also think I can use hyperbole. Said child lost two pets and has a chronic illness. Be nice.

[Anonymous]

Lucy Calkins has ruined so many youngsters reading classes for years!
https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/teachers-college-to-dissolve-lucy-calkins-reading-and-writing-project/2023/09

Finally, the tide is turning. Wake up FCPS!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lucy Calkins has ruined so many youngsters reading classes for years!
https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/teachers-college-to-dissolve-lucy-calkins-reading-and-writing-project/2023/09

Finally, the tide is turning. Wake up FCPS!

I haven't had a child go through FCPS yet. I'm curious to know to what extent teachers in FCPS continue to use Calkin's curriculum or ideas from it? Or is everyone on board with phonics now?

I know teachers/curricula (sometimes?) emphasize teaching sight words, which is different and less controversial from the whole-word "method".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lucy Calkins has ruined so many youngsters reading classes for years!
https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/teachers-college-to-dissolve-lucy-calkins-reading-and-writing-project/2023/09

Finally, the tide is turning. Wake up FCPS!

I haven't had a child go through FCPS yet. I'm curious to know to what extent teachers in FCPS continue to use Calkin's curriculum or ideas from it? Or is everyone on board with phonics now?

I know teachers/curricula (sometimes?) emphasize teaching sight words, which is different and less controversial from the whole-word "method".

This is an old thread that should be in the other forum. FCPS never used Lucy Calkins for reading but did/does use it for writing. In the past year or two, FCPS has changed from their previous reading program (that was a hodgepodge of balanced literacy including three cuing but not Lucy Calkins) to a new phonics based reading curriculum (still a hodgepodge but by all accounts actually phonics based). With the closure of Lucy Calkins, writing will probably change but not for this school year, I don't imagine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lucy Calkins has ruined so many youngsters reading classes for years!
https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/teachers-college-to-dissolve-lucy-calkins-reading-and-writing-project/2023/09

Finally, the tide is turning. Wake up FCPS!

How many hours did you spending trying to find a controversial post to revive?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lucy Calkins has ruined so many youngsters reading classes for years!
https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/teachers-college-to-dissolve-lucy-calkins-reading-and-writing-project/2023/09

Finally, the tide is turning. Wake up FCPS!

I haven't had a child go through FCPS yet. I'm curious to know to what extent teachers in FCPS continue to use Calkin's curriculum or ideas from it? Or is everyone on board with phonics now?

I know teachers/curricula (sometimes?) emphasize teaching sight words, which is different and less controversial from the whole-word "method".

This is an old thread that should be in the other forum. FCPS never used Lucy Calkins for reading but did/does use it for writing. In the past year or two, FCPS has changed from their previous reading program (that was a hodgepodge of balanced literacy including three cuing but not Lucy Calkins) to a new phonics based reading curriculum (still a hodgepodge but by all accounts actually phonics based). With the closure of Lucy Calkins, writing will probably change but not for this school year, I don't imagine.

Thanks. What does it mean to say that writing uses Lucy Calkins? That concerns me. How can FCPS be using something so widely discredited?