On the chopping block: AAP Centers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Not if LLIV was provided in all base schools - no centers at all. Everyone can get what they need at their own community school, with no need to bus anyone anywhere else. I bet that most people would be completely behind this idea, and I can't imagine why anyone would object. Besides, I can't really feel too bad for anyone who is upset at the possible loss of centers. Many of us never wanted center schools to begin with; they were thrust upon us without any of the AAP parents feeling bad about it at all.

How many centers were recently formed in the face of opposition? I thought most were fairly well established. I know of Westbriar. Are there others?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

PP poster again, and I really want to know, what should happen to my ES Center based kids? Are you really saying you want them to have to switch schools twice in 4 years? How would you feel is someone was advocating jerking your kid around like that?

Seriously? You chose to place your child in a center. No one forced you. If they have to go back to their base school - like all the other kids - why is that somehow unacceptable to you? Sheesh.

Yes it bothers me. Changing schools is hard for kids. ALL THE OTHER KIDS are not being asked to change schools twice in 4 years and be separated from their friends twice, as everyone heads back to a different base school. That's different from having kids stay at their base school from the beginning of AAP. You may not recognize it (but I suspect if you're honest you'd be livid if that happen to you child), but FCPS does. It's why things like boundary changes, AAP center openings and IB are phased in, with kids being allowed to stay at the school where they started.

Also, FWIW (and I realize you could care less) my DC is one of the kids who needs AAP. As in could not function in a Gen Ed classroom without having significant problems k-2. As in IQ of 150 and went to kindergarten reading chapter books-- but has ADHD. As in, spent the better part of k-2 in the principals office, but has not had a single disciplinary incident since starting AAP. Some kids really do NEED the program. We had no choice but to send him to a Center.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

PP poster again, and I really want to know, what should happen to my ES Center based kids? Are you really saying you want them to have to switch schools twice in 4 years? How would you feel is someone was advocating jerking your kid around like that?

Seriously? You chose to place your child in a center. No one forced you. If they have to go back to their base school - like all the other kids - why is that somehow unacceptable to you? Sheesh.

Yes it bothers me. Changing schools is hard for kids. ALL THE OTHER KIDS are not being asked to change schools twice in 4 years and be separated from their friends twice, as everyone heads back to a different base school. That's different from having kids stay at their base school from the beginning of AAP. You may not recognize it (but I suspect if you're honest you'd be livid if that happen to you child), but FCPS does. It's why things like boundary changes, AAP center openings and IB are phased in, with kids being allowed to stay at the school where they started.

Also, FWIW (and I realize you could care less) my DC is one of the kids who needs AAP. As in could not function in a Gen Ed classroom without having significant problems k-2. As in IQ of 150 and went to kindergarten reading chapter books-- but has ADHD. As in, spent the better part of k-2 in the principals office, but has not had a single disciplinary incident since starting AAP. Some kids really do NEED the program. We had no choice but to send him to a Center.

I think the anti-AAP posters are OK with the exceptionally bright children getting services but not the borderline kids. At least that's what some claimed here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Maybe though they could pilot it with one of the schools that dcum says is nothing but problems...perhaps Louise Archer.

Turn that school into a 3-6 AAP only magnet and reassign all the other kids to neighboring schools and see how it goes.

LA gen ed/anti AAP parent posting here, what say you? Could you get behind such an idea?

I don't know to whom you're addressing this. Once again, there are many people posting here who want centers gone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Not if LLIV was provided in all base schools - no centers at all. Everyone can get what they need at their own community school, with no need to bus anyone anywhere else. I bet that most people would be completely behind this idea, and I can't imagine why anyone would object. Besides, I can't really feel too bad for anyone who is upset at the possible loss of centers. Many of us never wanted center schools to begin with; they were thrust upon us without any of the AAP parents feeling bad about it at all.

Except they wouldn't..except perhaps in the McLean area, and maybe Vienna.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You are correct, it's not fair. If some kids are given the option to switch schools, then all kids should be given this same option. Either everyone should benefit, or no one. And that's the reality of a public school system.

Actually, it is fair. Every child is given the same opportunity to qualify for center-based Level IV services based on one of two different test scores. That's a fact. The whole purpose of the process is to identify some range of the top scorers. It's also a fact that that means the majority of children will not meet the threshold for identification and will not be selected for Level IV services. That doesn't make it unfair. It's just the nature of the process, which is to identify the top range of students. The process then goes even further by allowing parents or teachers to refer children who they believe should be considered even though they didn't make the test score cut-offs. Level IV AAP students are not given the option to switch schools just because they don't like the color of the walls or the playground equipment at their base school; they're given the opportunity to go to a center to an AAP center because that is how FCPS meets the rmandates of Virginia law that requires each school system to identify some top range of gifted students and to provide services that help them reach their potential. Given the size and diversity of the school system, I think FCPS does a pretty good job meeting that legal obligation.

Regarding the bolded, above - yes, FCPS is mandated by the state to provide gifted services. They are not, in any way, shape, or form, mandated to provide special center schools for identified students. Arlington Co. - also mandated by the state to provide gifted services - does so within the walls of each assigned school. LLIV should be provided at every base school and centers should be a thing of the past.

The problem here is logistics. This only works if a base school has 25-30 AAP qualified kids. What about the schools where only 3-4 kids qualify each year? Or even 12-15? I can imagine the griping about AAP kids using all the resources if there is an AAP class of 9 kids, which would result in 4 very overcrowded Gen Ed Classrooms. Or if there are (as happened in our LLIV school) 38 qualified kids. You end up with 2 classrooms of 16 kids and 4 Gen Ed classrooms of 35 under the VA staffing policy. And while some kids can principal place, I have never seen anything uglier or more divisive for the school community than our LLIV school had to principal place 16 kids into said classroom and parents were pitted against each other to have their child chosen. You can imagine the "Larla was only chosen because her mom is the PTA principal" comments. And 3 years later there are still some formerly best buddies whose parents will not talk to each other.

So, before you say LLIV everywhere, be honest, are you okay with you child being in a huge class because the AAP class is very small? Do you really want the politics of principal placement! (Because it's a lot more personal than having an unseen committee make selections and when someone else's child is chosen by an administrator you know over yours.

Believe it or not, AAP Centers exist for a reason. And a huge one is trying to even out class size.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Maybe though they could pilot it with one of the schools that dcum says is nothing but problems...perhaps Louise Archer.

Turn that school into a 3-6 AAP only magnet and reassign all the other kids to neighboring schools and see how it goes.

LA gen ed/anti AAP parent posting here, what say you? Could you get behind such an idea?

I don't know to whom you're addressing this. Once again, there are many people posting here who want centers gone.

You can still answer the question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

PPs in this thread with Gen Ed kids have said that all Gen Ed parents are unhappy with with being at a Center school. So they should be fine with leaving. And that they would welcome redistricting if it meant getting rid of AAP kids. (But I imagine they meant they would be happy If OTHER PEOPLES KIDS were redistricted, not theirs). So how about it Gen Ed parents: you're okay with AAP kids being sent to different schools. You think it's fine to make up the difference by having other kids redistricted to make up the difference. You've talked the talk. Can you walk the walk? Are you also oaky with letting your school become all AAP, and having your kids redistricted?

Also, in response to PPs above, base schools would still need an AART. The play a big role in screening 2nd graders, and do the pull outs of Level I-III kids, and things like Young scholars. In our school, the AART's only interaction with LLIV kids is to do an hour a week in 5th & 6th grades with kids who need differentiation in math above standard compacted math. Maybe it is different in other schools?

Wait a minute. We're "ok with AAP kids being sent to different schools"? Oh, you mean THEIR OWN SCHOOLS? The whole point so many of us are trying to make is that every student - whether Gen Ed or AAP - should attend their own base school. Schools should be returned to their communities and centers should be a thing of the past. LLIV should be put in place at every elementary school. What about this do you not understand?

Who came up with the idea to have "all AAP schools"? Certainly not me.

[Anonymous]

Actually, it is fair. Every child is given the same opportunity to qualify for center-based Level IV services based on one of two different test scores. That's a fact. The whole purpose of the process is to identify some range of the top scorers. It's also a fact that that means the majority of children will not meet the threshold for identification and will not be selected for Level IV services. That doesn't make it unfair. It's just the nature of the process, which is to identify the top range of students. The process then goes even further by allowing parents or teachers to refer children who they believe should be considered even though they didn't make the test score cut-offs. Level IV AAP students are not given the option to switch schools just because they don't like the color of the walls or the playground equipment at their base school; they're given the opportunity to go to a center to an AAP center because that is how FCPS meets the rmandates of Virginia law that requires each school system to identify some top range of gifted students and to provide services that help them reach their potential. Given the size and diversity of the school system, I think FCPS does a pretty good job meeting that legal obligation.

Regarding the bolded, above - yes, FCPS is mandated by the state to provide gifted services. They are not, in any way, shape, or form, mandated to provide special center schools for identified students. Arlington Co. - also mandated by the state to provide gifted services - does so within the walls of each assigned school. LLIV should be provided at every base school and centers should be a thing of the past.

Arlington County is much more homogenous than Fairfax County. What works in one will not necessarily work in another. Our FCPS base school has a LLIV program, but the school can't fill even half a class with Level IV-eligible students. Our center school combines kids from three different base schools (plus the center itself) to make up just one or two classes per grade. That is why center schools exist. And that is why LLIV does not work in all schools, even if it does in Arlington County.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

PP poster again, and I really want to know, what should happen to my ES Center based kids? Are you really saying you want them to have to switch schools twice in 4 years? How would you feel is someone was advocating jerking your kid around like that?

Seriously? You chose to place your child in a center. No one forced you. If they have to go back to their base school - like all the other kids - why is that somehow unacceptable to you? Sheesh.

Yes it bothers me. Changing schools is hard for kids. ALL THE OTHER KIDS are not being asked to change schools twice in 4 years and be separated from their friends twice, as everyone heads back to a different base school. That's different from having kids stay at their base school from the beginning of AAP. You may not recognize it (but I suspect if you're honest you'd be livid if that happen to you child), but FCPS does. It's why things like boundary changes, AAP center openings and IB are phased in, with kids being allowed to stay at the school where they started.

Also, FWIW (and I realize you could care less) my DC is one of the kids who needs AAP. As in could not function in a Gen Ed classroom without having significant problems k-2. As in IQ of 150 and went to kindergarten reading chapter books-- but has ADHD. As in, spent the better part of k-2 in the principals office, but has not had a single disciplinary incident since starting AAP. Some kids really do NEED the program. We had no choice but to send him to a Center.

I think the anti-AAP posters are OK with the exceptionally bright children getting services but not the borderline kids. At least that's what some claimed here.

And how do they know who the kids are that need the program and who is borderline?

They don't see or know the test scores. They don't see the gbrs of other kids, or the ieps for twice exceptional kids. They might assume that pps kid who is a behavior problem has no need for AAP because they "volunteer in the classroom" and only view him as a troublemaker.

They are basing their opinions on emotions, and for many judging what they perceive to be the needs of kids who got in who they don't think belong and comparing those kids to their own who did not get in. But they only have opinions to base it on and not all the other details, including test scores and teacher assessments, that the AART, teachers and committee have to review.

They don't know who "needs it" and who is just average. They don't have any objective data and only have their emotions to make that charge.

But obviously the distri t thinks these kids "need" this service, by whatever mostly objective and very extensive cut off they are using.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Maybe though they could pilot it with one of the schools that dcum says flier in this thread who have is nothing but problems...perhaps Louise Archer.

Turn that school into a 3-6 AAP only magnet and reassign all the other kids to neighboring schools and see how it goes.

LA gen ed/anti AAP parent posting here, what say you? Could you get behind such an idea?

AAP parent, and I like that DC goes to school with a mix of kids. She doesn't need all AAP peers (although she does need enough for at least 2 classes, which almost no base schools have). Also, this seems like you are setting up a TJ situation, with parents griping about kids having access to an elite super school and get busing there. But, there are certainly GE parents earlier in this thread who said they would welcome redistricting if it meant their kids didn't have to go to the same school as AAP kids. So presumably, they would nOT mind if there kids were sent to a different school so the local Center could become all AAP.

PPs -- you raise good points.

I like the idea of a pilot "all AAP" school.

I seem to recall Greenbriar West did a survey of parents prior to the Poplar Tree change. Maybe survey the Louise Archer parents and ask for their feedback?

If PPs are as unhappy with having their kids with AAP kids as they say, they should jump at the chance to send their kids somewhere else. Problem solved (I suspect not. I'm sure GE parents would hate this solution too).

To my knowledge, no one has said they are unhappy with having AAP kids at their school. The problem arises when AAP kids become the majority, such as at several center schools, and the GE kids are now the minority, going through years with the same peers. It's interesting that AAP parents cry foul when their kids don't have a "peer group," but it's perfectly ok in their book for the GE kids to be stuck with the same classmates year after year.

Having LLIV in every base school would ensure there is not a huge block of AAP kids at one school (centers). They would be dispersed among all the base schools. I'm not sure why some of you are trying to make this so difficult. It's a much simpler solution than the current one of having multiple schools feed into centers, and providing busing from all of those schools (for free, no less).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

PP poster again, and I really want to know, what should happen to my ES Center based kids? Are you really saying you want them to have to switch schools twice in 4 years? How would you feel is someone was advocating jerking your kid around like that?

Seriously? You chose to place your child in a center. No one forced you. If they have to go back to their base school - like all the other kids - why is that somehow unacceptable to you? Sheesh.

Yes it bothers me. Changing schools is hard for kids. ALL THE OTHER KIDS are not being asked to change schools twice in 4 years and be separated from their friends twice, as everyone heads back to a different base school. That's different from having kids stay at their base school from the beginning of AAP. You may not recognize it (but I suspect if you're honest you'd be livid if that happen to you child), but FCPS does. It's why things like boundary changes, AAP center openings and IB are phased in, with kids being allowed to stay at the school where they started.

Also, FWIW (and I realize you could care less) my DC is one of the kids who needs AAP. As in could not function in a Gen Ed classroom without having significant problems k-2. As in IQ of 150 and went to kindergarten reading chapter books-- but has ADHD. As in, spent the better part of k-2 in the principals office, but has not had a single disciplinary incident since starting AAP. Some kids really do NEED the program. We had no choice but to send him to a Center.

I think the anti-AAP posters are OK with the exceptionally bright children getting services but not the borderline kids. At least that's what some claimed here.

They probably are. But it's why I take such offense to the "sheesh... you chose this so tough if your kid changes schools again just before 6th grade." Because I don't feel like I chose anything. I feel like my kid has a lot of potential, but needs specials services that the school is obligated to provide (AAP and a 504). That this is how the county says to do it, so that's what we did And, FWIW, as a very bright boy who hates sports and video games and reads everything and has ADHD, and is socially awkward, these transitions suck for him. I wish people would have some compassion for that, instead of saying he (an 11 year old!!!) is getting what he (or I as the bad parent who got him the services he deserves) needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

Maybe though they could pilot it with one of the schools that dcum says is nothing but problems...perhaps Louise Archer.

Turn that school into a 3-6 AAP only magnet and reassign all the other kids to neighboring schools and see how it goes.

LA gen ed/anti AAP parent posting here, what say you? Could you get behind such an idea?

I don't know to whom you're addressing this. Once again, there are many people posting here who want centers gone.

The LA poster specifically. Duh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, I just troll, too....

when I fought like hell this past year to get the school board to change a decision re: our school. Wrote multiple letters, showed up at meetings, etc. And believe it or not, they did actually change their original position based on our input.

Thanks for playing this game.

I absolutely believe they did. But not because you posed anonymously on DCUM. Because you became actively involved IRL. There's a huge difference.

Not the PP, but isn't that what every single one of us is doing here (including you) - venting our frustrations on an anonymous message board? As another PP said, why shouldn't we come here vent AND be involved "in real life" in changing policies? It's so ridiculous to call someone a troll simply because you disagree with their opinion.

As the mom of two GE students who attend a center school, you'd better believe I'm also going to post on this forum whenever I feel like it. I think AAP parents pay a lot of lip service to the whole "we're all one big happy family/school" mantra, but when it comes to the GE parents discussing their experiences at center schools, the AAP parents love to shoot them down with moronic statements like, "Why are you here? It's kind of creepy for a non-AAP parent to be "trolling" or posting here". Kind of exemplifies the whole AAP parent mentality.

But I don't see the AAP parents consistently demonize the GE parents as we're often characterized as being driven, misdirected, self-serving. You don't see that?

GE parents aren't the ones insisting on special schools, programs, and busing for their kids. They don't act as if a public school system is there for one purpose only - to focus on the education of a select sub-group of kids. Why should GE parents be demonized? If anything, their kids aren't getting half the attention and resources that AAP kids are getting. And if your children were in this situation, you'd be speaking up too.

What resources, besides busing, are AAP kids getting? The AART spends most of their time preparing 2nd grade packets and doing pull outs with Level I-III kids. The AAP kids often have significantly larger class sizes, especially in Centers (DCs 4th grade class was 34 kids) and the classes are taught by a single teacher. They don't go on extra field trips or get extras in the classroom, like their own laptop or tablet. Laptop carts are shared by an entire grade's team. Academic extracurriculars in our school are PTA sponsored and open to all (and lots of GE kids participate). The teachers get some extra training, but AAP is a special Ed program, and all special Ed teachers get this. So, please tell me, what resources is my AAP DC getting from the school that your Gen Ed DC, or a Special Ed DC is not?

The bolded, above, is just so ludicrous there are no words. At one time, perhaps GT was considered a "special ed" program. Today? Absolutely no way. Why do teachers need special training to teach utterly mainstream kids?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Just because parents choose to be cordial doesn't mean the school situation is healthy

Exactly. Most of the parents saying their school is just fine, has no problems with AAP/GE, etc. are, in fact, AAP parents. Of course they don't see the problems! And, as PP says, parents are generally going to be cordial and polite in person. You're probably never going to hear anything negative from a parent at your school if they feel what they have to say is going to be received negatively. That's why it was very interesting to read the comments on the FCPS message board, when they opened it up for discussion. Many parents were upset over centers and the way AAP is administered, and spoke freely in those comments - because it was anonymous.

I think the FCPS' User Voice suggestion of assigning some neighborhood schools to be all AAP is a good suggestion. There are some parts of the county where schools are located in close proximity to one another. Just take entire schools in various locations across the county and make them all AAP. There would be no need for Advanced Academic Resource Teachers in the base schools, either.

I don't think that is a bad idea.

HOWEVER there are going to be many EXTREMELY unhappy base school parents who are pleased with their school and happy to be able to have, for example, one kid in GE and a sibling in AAP, who are going to be furious when they are going to get reassigned to a different school so there school can be turned into a center only school.

I would bet money that there are far more people who would be upset by this and that there are many more people who would prefer the status quo over such an idea.

That is a can of worms fcps does not want to open.

PPs in this thread with Gen Ed kids have said that all Gen Ed parents are unhappy with with being at a Center school. So they should be fine with leaving. And that they would welcome redistricting if it meant getting rid of AAP kids. (But I imagine they meant they would be happy If OTHER PEOPLES KIDS were redistricted, not theirs). So how about it Gen Ed parents: you're okay with AAP kids being sent to different schools. You think it's fine to make up the difference by having other kids redistricted to make up the difference. You've talked the talk. Can you walk the walk? Are you also oaky with letting your school become all AAP, and having your kids redistricted?

Also, in response to PPs above, base schools would still need an AART. The play a big role in screening 2nd graders, and do the pull outs of Level I-III kids, and things like Young scholars. In our school, the AART's only interaction with LLIV kids is to do an hour a week in 5th & 6th grades with kids who need differentiation in math above standard compacted math. Maybe it is different in other schools?

Wait a minute. We're "ok with AAP kids being sent to different schools"? Oh, you mean THEIR OWN SCHOOLS? The whole point so many of us are trying to make is that every student - whether Gen Ed or AAP - should attend their own base school. Schools should be returned to their communities and centers should be a thing of the past. LLIV should be put in place at every elementary school. What about this do you not understand?

Who came up with the idea to have "all AAP schools"? Certainly not me.

So you're fine if your child is in a class of 34-35 while my AAP kid only has 10 in theirs? Because it's not like FCPS has the money to come up with an extra teacher per grade or make the staffing formula more generous.