Top private (Sidwell, GDS) versus top public (JKLM) for early years: what are the differences?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:More/better/earlier arts, science, PE/outdoor time, foreign language. No standardized testing or grading, lots of writing, kid sets the level of challenge with small enough classes that teachers can provide real support. Continuity of "specials" teachers. More curricular freedom, which has lots of implications -- e.g. pace can change if a particular class needs more or less time on a unit, teachers are empowered and encouraged to be lifelong learners themselves, there's space for more ambitious projects. Also a fair amount of emphasis on and experiences designed to make kids comfortable presenting their ideas in public. A sense that education is about discovery and rather than transmission/reception/retention of what's already known.

Bingo! We chose private over JKLM even though we have to make many sacrifices (vacations, new cars, etc.).

good for you, but that does not give you moral superiority.

No testing or grading in private? Are you talking about waldorf?Our private just had the wrap, and erbs are in a few weeks. And everything is graded.

I have children in KLM and private schools and there isn't much of a difference in what they learn. Just the frills.

PP, why do you have a DS or DD in private then? Thanks for sharing!

Oldest switched to private in 4th because we panicked about MS. We will keep our younger ones in public through 5th because we don't see much of an educational difference and we have a sibling pref so we are less panicked.

[Anonymous]

I am the "off the grid" Homeschooling poster, and PP describes it perfectly (although I feel like it's a pretty common term?)

the funny thing is, we're at one of the highly coveted schools EOTP that gets a lot of love, and I think they do their best to insulate the kids from the "pressure cooker" but I'm still feeling it and don't like many aspects of the teacher:student ratio or the access to outdoor time and generally feel like there isn't enough of a sense of fostering what my kids find interesting. Yes,they all have to learn their ABCs at some point, but my oldest kid in particular is already starting to feel shame and internalizing his inability to be the "noarmalized" learner that teachers love in their classes.

Is there school in DC, private or public alike, that will allow him to follow his interests and allow him ample outdoor time to do the dreaming that this kid needs that doesn't also cost $40K/year and/or mean he's only going to school with incredibly wealthy children and all that implies?

[Anonymous]

PP, what school are you at? What about CM?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am the "off the grid" Homeschooling poster, and PP describes it perfectly (although I feel like it's a pretty common term?)

the funny thing is, we're at one of the highly coveted schools EOTP that gets a lot of love, and I think they do their best to insulate the kids from the "pressure cooker" but I'm still feeling it and don't like many aspects of the teacher:student ratio or the access to outdoor time and generally feel like there isn't enough of a sense of fostering what my kids find interesting. Yes,they all have to learn their ABCs at some point, but my oldest kid in particular is already starting to feel shame and internalizing his inability to be the "noarmalized" learner that teachers love in their classes.

Is there school in DC, private or public alike, that will allow him to follow his interests and allow him ample outdoor time to do the dreaming that this kid needs that doesn't also cost $40K/year and/or mean he's only going to school with incredibly wealthy children and all that implies?

Can't tell what grade you're thinking about, so these skew older.

Sandy Spring Friends in MD might be worth looking at -- logistically impossible for us and, while not 40K, still 30K, so maybe not realistic. Couldn't get my head around Waldorf, but I've known a couple of kids who were happy at Washington Waldorf in Bethesda.

In DC, one of my friends has a kid who is happy and unstressed at School without Walls. Another sent three kids through SWW pre-Rhee and their education sounded a lot like mine (and certainly included lots of mad scientist in the basement-type activity!) but that friend warned me off Walls, saying things had changed and I wouldn't like it. Other friend's kid is there now-- so post-Rhee. Which means I've gotten really mixed signals (and the two friends involved are both academic-y guys who understand/share my values and concerns) but enough positive feedback to think it's worth checking out, especially if choice is limited to DC proper.

And if you're seriously considering home-schooling (and therefore willing to forego cohort to a significant extent), I think both Stanford and GW have online HS -- MS even, in GW's case. Depending on kid/curriculum, that might leave time to explore and certainly allow time- and place-shifting (work when you're most productive, seize the day when it's beautiful out, read in the park instead of at your desk).

Good luck and, if you find what your're looking for, let people know!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am the "off the grid" Homeschooling poster, and PP describes it perfectly (although I feel like it's a pretty common term?)

the funny thing is, we're at one of the highly coveted schools EOTP that gets a lot of love, and I think they do their best to insulate the kids from the "pressure cooker" but I'm still feeling it and don't like many aspects of the teacher:student ratio or the access to outdoor time and generally feel like there isn't enough of a sense of fostering what my kids find interesting. Yes,they all have to learn their ABCs at some point, but my oldest kid in particular is already starting to feel shame and internalizing his inability to be the "noarmalized" learner that teachers love in their classes.

Is there school in DC, private or public alike, that will allow him to follow his interests and allow him ample outdoor time to do the dreaming that this kid needs that doesn't also cost $40K/year and/or mean he's only going to school with incredibly wealthy children and all that implies?

Can't tell what grade you're thinking about, so these skew older.

Sandy Spring Friends in MD might be worth looking at -- logistically impossible for us and, while not 40K, still 30K, so maybe not realistic. Couldn't get my head around Waldorf, but I've known a couple of kids who were happy at Washington Waldorf in Bethesda.

In DC, one of my friends has a kid who is happy and unstressed at School without Walls. Another sent three kids through SWW pre-Rhee and their education sounded a lot like mine (and certainly included lots of mad scientist in the basement-type activity!) but that friend warned me off Walls, saying things had changed and I wouldn't like it. Other friend's kid is there now-- so post-Rhee. Which means I've gotten really mixed signals (and the two friends involved are both academic-y guys who understand/share my values and concerns) but enough positive feedback to think it's worth checking out, especially if choice is limited to DC proper.

And if you're seriously considering home-schooling (and therefore willing to forego cohort to a significant extent), I think both Stanford and GW have online HS -- MS even, in GW's case. Depending on kid/curriculum, that might leave time to explore and certainly allow time- and place-shifting (work when you're most productive, seize the day when it's beautiful out, read in the park instead of at your desk).

Good luck and, if you find what your're looking for, let people know!

just out of curiosity, do you work? EOTP "not off the grid according to everyone" poster here. We both have jobs so for us I don't really see home schooling as a possibility. But even if I quit my job, to be quite frank, I would only feel comfortable home schooling until a certain age - just because I am very liberal arts and never got anywhere near Calculus, almost failed Geometry, etc. Do the Stanford courses provide enough info for parents who cannot teach their kids for the kids to teach themselves? We would have home schooled in the early years if we felt we could have afforded to quit my job. I would have loved to have done it.

But, the much maligned or underestimated summer medical courses at Georgetown University that my one kid wants to take are not something we could create in our house, especially the access to human cadavers part.......... These courses are for older kids - high school kids - and provide six college credits, so they are hard core..... We kind of felt like we were home schooling to a degree in the early years just because the academics at the school were not that solid so we needed to supplement. We did CTY. Both working with kids in public does allow us to save the money to kind of do expeditionary learning in the summer on our road trips, which we adore - but again that is mostly about American History and other subjects I feel really comfortable with. When we looked at the DC k-12 home schooling option we thought combining school and us would be better, but Stanford sounds pretty impressive.

Please let us know what you do and how it works out!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I think you can go off the grid here by being in an EOTP charter, where not everyone graduating is going to even try to go Ivy or go home. I think you can use the money for travel and camps that are about subjects that interest them (and are NOT in DC). Girls are/will be Venturers, boys we want to become Eagle scouts which will help college applications and can be done anywhere. Having other communities helps kids keep their perspective - we also have church community. CW says colleges are looking for authentic lopsided applicants, that has been my experience as an alumni interviewer, so open the world wide enough and most kids become interested/passionate about something by high school (which is different than finding a "hook" for college). We have one kid who likes computers, one set on becoming a doctor who goes to crazy camps in the summer or takes unfortunately expensive college classes, another on the way to finding a passion, and one who is still too young but seems very much of a performer. Private would be easier with that one, but we have time to figure it out - maybe Ellington? Our kids are friends with the smart kids at their school, who do not live in the same areas or come from the same backgrounds. We have tons of books in our house, try to eat dinner as a family and talk. We get magazines that follow their interests. I think you can find that kind of cohort here for your kids, maybe with us wackadoos who have decided not to go private on financial aid, and to keep our kids internally motivated for as long as we can so they can have a shot at starting to figure out what they are interested. When I have a kid in 11th grade I may be singing a different tune, but we are fairly confident that our kids will get into decent colleges from where they are, even though they and their friends will definitely be the outliers in their graduating class, and we are very confident that they are getting a broader education by living in a wider world.

We did not like what we saw of the private school pressure cooker here, but could not move far because of our jobs, so we have tried to create an environment like what we had as kids. It is very hard. The computer gamer programmer has friends who have left but they still play (it helps that they are all obsessed with the same game and can play virtually with each other while skype allows them to see and talk at the same time on a server they created with my husband). There is no neighborhood where the younger kids can just wander off and come home for supper, but there are almost always kids in our house from school (the metro makes them fairly independent), and I don't really know what kind of "hanging out" they are doing but they are having fun. I think you can create an environment that fosters genuine intellectual curiosity, and if you are not at a pressure cooker your kids have more time to actively pursue interests and find a passion.

Time is an issue. It is hard for us to watch even our youngest have make trade offs because of homework we think excessive. We don't remember this. Although this crazy medical kid may keep more of us here for more of the summer this time, we usually spend the summers with a few week long camps (going to Goshen matters) and wandering, and so far it has worked out. We do have one kid who puts too much pressure on himself, but at least there is genuine intellectual inquiry there in addition to an obsession with getting high grades. The kid is wired that way but he is not contagious and can laugh at himself. None of them are going to try to play 3 varsity sports and do a ton of meaningless extra curriculars and then stay up all night doing homework. We feel secure that with good grades they will get into a college where they will get a good education, and are not focusing so much on rankings or names, and we are fairly sure that they will also feel like kids "in a candy store"). I think the reading and the talking is essential, and because of computers our kids can find out more about what interests them on their own, independently. They can also virtually "hang" with their friends and do,

We like their friends and none are going down a wrong road - we want them to make their own way with their friends, many of whom are now going in different directions in terms of interests, but the interests are there, and we never want our kids to feel that there is only one road... Because it is not true. We do not believe that going to Harvard is critical if you become well educated and are prepared academically so you can do well in college, although the one kid definitely wants Harvard Yale or Princeton. We hope to get most to come out of college debt free - would definitely prefer some merit scholarships to lesser universities because we did have too many kids. Have also considered separating at the critical time and paying out of state tuition senior year so UVA in state tuition is a possibility. We think we can save enough so if more than one kid wants to go to an Ivy where they cannot get merit scholarships, we would be ok. We will expect them to work over summers and such. We are fairly frugal - old cars, no I phones, no HBO, clothes etc. Easier in a school where most kids are not from wealthy families. Big fans of target, ebay auctions for computer tinkerers, high quality church sales WOTP, public libraries and pools. As "off the grid" as we can be in DC. We think Whitman and maybe even Wilson would also be pressure cookers.

Definitely off the track of the original question but off the grid is hard but possible, and we think it is important.

Wait, do you mean you or your husband would move with your senior to NoVA, leaving the rest of the family in DC, in the hope of qualifying as a VA in-state resident for college tuition?

[Anonymous]

the UVA trick wouldn't be worth it. competition is incredibly stiff. though UVA has several very good state schools, still seems like a strange tactic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am the "off the grid" Homeschooling poster, and PP describes it perfectly (although I feel like it's a pretty common term?)

the funny thing is, we're at one of the highly coveted schools EOTP that gets a lot of love, and I think they do their best to insulate the kids from the "pressure cooker" but I'm still feeling it and don't like many aspects of the teacher:student ratio or the access to outdoor time and generally feel like there isn't enough of a sense of fostering what my kids find interesting. Yes,they all have to learn their ABCs at some point, but my oldest kid in particular is already starting to feel shame and internalizing his inability to be the "noarmalized" learner that teachers love in their classes.

Is there school in DC, private or public alike, that will allow him to follow his interests and allow him ample outdoor time to do the dreaming that this kid needs that doesn't also cost $40K/year and/or mean he's only going to school with incredibly wealthy children and all that implies?

Can't tell what grade you're thinking about, so these skew older.

Sandy Spring Friends in MD might be worth looking at -- logistically impossible for us and, while not 40K, still 30K, so maybe not realistic. Couldn't get my head around Waldorf, but I've known a couple of kids who were happy at Washington Waldorf in Bethesda.

In DC, one of my friends has a kid who is happy and unstressed at School without Walls. Another sent three kids through SWW pre-Rhee and their education sounded a lot like mine (and certainly included lots of mad scientist in the basement-type activity!) but that friend warned me off Walls, saying things had changed and I wouldn't like it. Other friend's kid is there now-- so post-Rhee. Which means I've gotten really mixed signals (and the two friends involved are both academic-y guys who understand/share my values and concerns) but enough positive feedback to think it's worth checking out, especially if choice is limited to DC proper.

And if you're seriously considering home-schooling (and therefore willing to forego cohort to a significant extent), I think both Stanford and GW have online HS -- MS even, in GW's case. Depending on kid/curriculum, that might leave time to explore and certainly allow time- and place-shifting (work when you're most productive, seize the day when it's beautiful out, read in the park instead of at your desk).

Good luck and, if you find what your're looking for, let people know!

just out of curiosity, do you work? EOTP "not off the grid according to everyone" poster here. We both have jobs so for us I don't really see home schooling as a possibility. But even if I quit my job, to be quite frank, I would only feel comfortable home schooling until a certain age - just because I am very liberal arts and never got anywhere near Calculus, almost failed Geometry, etc. Do the Stanford courses provide enough info for parents who cannot teach their kids for the kids to teach themselves? We would have home schooled in the early years if we felt we could have afforded to quit my job. I would have loved to have done it.

But, the much maligned or underestimated summer medical courses at Georgetown University that my one kid wants to take are not something we could create in our house, especially the access to human cadavers part.......... These courses are for older kids - high school kids - and provide six college credits, so they are hard core..... We kind of felt like we were home schooling to a degree in the early years just because the academics at the school were not that solid so we needed to supplement. We did CTY. Both working with kids in public does allow us to save the money to kind of do expeditionary learning in the summer on our road trips, which we adore - but again that is mostly about American History and other subjects I feel really comfortable with. When we looked at the DC k-12 home schooling option we thought combining school and us would be better, but Stanford sounds pretty impressive.

Please let us know what you do and how it works out!

Hi PPs - "off the grid" here. I'm currently managing a small business out of the home. It adds to the bottom line, is very flexible, and while it helps, it definitely wouldn't cover private school tuition for two on top of our other expenses - we could swing it but it would be at the cost of retirement/college savings for sure. I worked for a big corp for 15 years, allowing us to build a nest egg and pay for law school and that is now starting to show it's benefits and has allowed me to leave that stressful life behind. (I pumped breast milk in the car and missed the sweet infant years -- although I'm not sure I'm cut out for that anyway, so don't cry for me Argentina...) For all intents, I'm a SAHM today: pick up from school, do a lot of volunteering for school and other orgs.

I feel pretty sure I could implement an education for my kids that suits their needs far better than the school they currently attend - but they are young, probably younger than yours so I find this advice helpful. And, in many ways, this is a great city to home school in! (BTW just to cover bases we're not religious and that's no component of this desire in any way - truly.) Plus, the idea of renting an RV and taking a cross-country educational trip is just so very appealing. But to your comments pp, I'm not the best at the things they'll eventually need instruction in (see spelling and grammar in this post!) This is part of the problem, I'm not sure that 1. I'm cut out to home school, I clearly spend WAY too much time on my computer while my kids entertain themselves in the next room, 2. It's the dynamic we'd be introducing into our relationship that makes me very weary - mom as teacher? and 3. what about the social aspect? Home school kids are WEIRD.

My oldest needs to hang off trees and dream - dream a lot - and once he learns to read at a prolific level (which is a little slow in coming) I think I'll be hard pressed to keep him out of a book because he ADORES a tale. He's a story teller, that's where he belongs. I'd love to travel and do month-long units and pick a single topic that HE wants to learn about and really dig into it and cover math and all of the other aspects in that vein, but my particular capacity for spending long days with an 8 year old -- mmmmm -- not the best. My youngest is the "normalized" learner that teachers dream about - but is also very pensive and keeps too much close-to-the chest. Hard to draw out what's actually kicking around in there - and I'm not sure I'm the best person to do that, less sure about that than I am helping my oldest.

I just honestly, and legitimately want to raise happy humans and I'm torn about how to best do that. Perhaps I'm over-thinking it, but I don't think it's any more ridiculous OPs question than Private vs. JKLM, so here we are.

[Anonymous]

Sorry, what is EOTP? And IMO? (Yes, I am a foreigner

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, what is EOTP? And IMO? (Yes, I am a foreigner

Ha - "East of the Park" (and if you don't know what you're new to this board) not just foreign and "In my opinion"

[Anonymous]

So, basically, very few people can or did answer what are the differences. The post now is like "I reaffirm my choice" and about judging and stereotyping other choices, instead of saying a, b, c...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, what is EOTP? And IMO? (Yes, I am a foreigner

Ha - "East of the Park" (and if you don't know what you're new to this board) not just foreign and "In my opinion"

Yes, I am. Please elaborate (does it mean NE and SE?) What about IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, basically, very few people can or did answer what are the differences. The post now is like "I reaffirm my choice" and about judging and stereotyping other choices, instead of saying a, b, c...

Huh. That's not where I feel like this has ended at all. I feel like people have very clearly identified the differences - a) specials/non-traditional education b) testing c) free time, and yeah, there's judgement (as there always will be with DCUM) but I've actually enjoyed the various perspectives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, what is EOTP? And IMO? (Yes, I am a foreigner

Ha - "East of the Park" (and if you don't know what you're new to this board) not just foreign and "In my opinion"

Yes, I am. Please elaborate (does it mean NE and SE?) What about IMO.

EOTP means "east of the park" - rock creek park. Any school that baiscally isn't "JKLM" - which stands for the schools WEST of the park, which are mostly high-income, expensive neighborhoods.

IMO means "In my opinion"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry, what is EOTP? And IMO? (Yes, I am a foreigner

Ha - "East of the Park" (and if you don't know what you're new to this board) not just foreign and "In my opinion"

Yes, I am. Please elaborate (does it mean NE and SE?) What about IMO.

EOTP means "east of the park" - rock creek park. Any school that baiscally isn't "JKLM" - which stands for the schools WEST of the park, which are mostly high-income, expensive neighborhoods.

IMO means "In my opinion"

Thanks!