Compacted Math- FYI

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

My kid plays video games a few hours a day, some days more. And, yet they are in advanced math and we had supplemented. It is not one or the other and can be both. We make sure homework, music and sports are done first. We are not wealthy and never paid tutors. Workbooks were fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

My kid plays video games a few hours a day, some days more. And, yet they are in advanced math and we had supplemented. It is not one or the other and can be both. We make sure homework, music and sports are done first. We are not wealthy and never paid tutors. Workbooks were fine.

Golf claps. That you would think to do work books is in and of itself an exception; many families trust the school to provide guidance if supplemental work is needed. Many families - like none - always ensure that assigned homework are done. Our kids get straight As. We’d never think to do extra given how hard our children work in school - and that teachers would tell us if they weren’t high achievers: and this is the problem. Those in the know know that’s not how it works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

Your all-or-nothing thinking really is not going to help your kid. Really? Your kid is going to take math in the “regular” track and get AP calc senior year, and this is a failure that will mean he or she will never get into a strong college program? Get a grip. This is not the end of the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

Your all-or-nothing thinking really is not going to help your kid. Really? Your kid is going to take math in the “regular” track and get AP calc senior year, and this is a failure that will mean he or she will never get into a strong college program? Get a grip. This is not the end of the world.

Is your kid "regular track"? Of course not. So stop it with your ludicrous sanctimony.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

Your all-or-nothing thinking really is not going to help your kid. Really? Your kid is going to take math in the “regular” track and get AP calc senior year, and this is a failure that will mean he or she will never get into a strong college program? Get a grip. This is not the end of the world.

Is your kid "regular track"? Of course not. So stop it with your ludicrous sanctimony.

Yes, my kid is, or at least I presume so based on this thread. Mine is in the 85th MAP percentile so will not be in compacted next year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

My question to you though is whether you believe that your kids MAP-M result is due to inequality. It sounds to me like your kid is doing fine but it’s just not showing up in the tests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

My kid plays video games a few hours a day, some days more. And, yet they are in advanced math and we had supplemented. It is not one or the other and can be both. We make sure homework, music and sports are done first. We are not wealthy and never paid tutors. Workbooks were fine.

Your smugness sucks.

We don't permit video games or TV during the week, and minimal during the weekends. We review the kids' homework and of course, all class requirements are done before the kids get free time during the day. My oldest - in 4th - got straight As in compacted math all year and glowing feedback from his teacher. He just received a special award at a recent school event - for math. And yet, my hardworking, straight A son is only 70th percentile and apparently not fit to move to 5/6 math. What in the actual fukk is that about? At no point in any conversation were we advised he wasn't on track. At no point in any conversation with the teacher were we told to get him enrichment - a question I directly asked. Here I have you, a parent telling me about how much video time your children enjoy, wagging your finger about supplementing.

If this is not a sign that MCPS is failing, I don't know what is. Hardworking middle class families like mine are taking the ques from teachers but apparently they want us to fail and grades and feedback don't mean anything . What a joke. Clearly, if you are rich and in the know the system works for you. If not, you're screwed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

My question to you though is whether you believe that your kids MAP-M result is due to inequality. It sounds to me like your kid is doing fine but it’s just not showing up in the tests.

What is it to "show up in the tests"? Is this special code referring to something a parent who isn't clued in to anything but work hard, get good grades, apply feedback from teachers is expected to understand?

[Anonymous]

Look, people, including kids, who put in extra work even if they are already high achieving tend to excel more than others. You see it in sports (like the kid who takes extra lessons, or is out practicing the sport even outside of practice), music (more practice, the better you are), and of course academics. People who are tip top in their field, sport, instrument, etc have typically put in hours and hours. So I’m not sure why people are surprised that some families put in extra time on schoolwork, and I don’t see why some think it’s a bad thing. If you want to be better, and at the top, you need to work for it! Some will work hard and not get there, but most certainly you don’t get there if you don’t work hard. That’s life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

My kid plays video games a few hours a day, some days more. And, yet they are in advanced math and we had supplemented. It is not one or the other and can be both. We make sure homework, music and sports are done first. We are not wealthy and never paid tutors. Workbooks were fine.

Your smugness sucks.

We don't permit video games or TV during the week, and minimal during the weekends. We review the kids' homework and of course, all class requirements are done before the kids get free time during the day. My oldest - in 4th - got straight As in compacted math all year and glowing feedback from his teacher. He just received a special award at a recent school event - for math. And yet, my hardworking, straight A son is only 70th percentile and apparently not fit to move to 5/6 math. What in the actual fukk is that about? At no point in any conversation were we advised he wasn't on track. At no point in any conversation with the teacher were we told to get him enrichment - a question I directly asked. Here I have you, a parent telling me about how much video time your children enjoy, wagging your finger about supplementing.

If this is not a sign that MCPS is failing, I don't know what is. Hardworking middle class families like mine are taking the ques from teachers but apparently they want us to fail and grades and feedback don't mean anything . What a joke. Clearly, if you are rich and in the know the system works for you. If not, you're screwed.

I'm just curious what your HHI is to pretend you are middle class. You are completely smug in your post to brag about all you did. Your kid didn't do great in MAP. Big deal. You can supplement and allow video games. That is your choice. You are in compacted math. There is no enrichment beyond compacted math. Welcome to MCPS. If you want enrichment, you supplement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

Your all-or-nothing thinking really is not going to help your kid. Really? Your kid is going to take math in the “regular” track and get AP calc senior year, and this is a failure that will mean he or she will never get into a strong college program? Get a grip. This is not the end of the world.

Is your kid "regular track"? Of course not. So stop it with your ludicrous sanctimony.

Yes, my kid is, or at least I presume so based on this thread. Mine is in the 85th MAP percentile so will not be in compacted next year.

They aren't going to kick your kid out of compacted math. It may impact which math they take in middle school and they may only be allowed AIM/pre algebra instead of Algebra but they will be fine taking Algebra in 7th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

Its not outrageous if a parent takes the time to help their child. MCPS offered free tutoring through Tutor Me, Saturday school and a host of other options including high school students volunteering their time. It was widely advertised. If you choose not to take advantage of what is available then that is on you. Dollar Tree has workbooks for a dollar. Lots of free online resources as well. Our kids should've to be held bak because you cannot bother working with your child. If you paid attention even pre-covid you'd know that MCPS seriously lacks in ES curriculum. We had to work heavily on the basics and math facts as they didn't teach that. They also didn't teach spelling, reading or many other things. You either have to have a really smart kid who can figure it out on their own or you have to supplement or your kids can fall behind. This has nothing to do with DL. You just didn't see it as there is little to no homework in ES and very few worksheets and other stuff gets sent home and you just rely on teachers saying your kids are doing great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look, people, including kids, who put in extra work even if they are already high achieving tend to excel more than others. You see it in sports (like the kid who takes extra lessons, or is out practicing the sport even outside of practice), music (more practice, the better you are), and of course academics. People who are tip top in their field, sport, instrument, etc have typically put in hours and hours. So I’m not sure why people are surprised that some families put in extra time on schoolwork, and I don’t see why some think it’s a bad thing. If you want to be better, and at the top, you need to work for it! Some will work hard and not get there, but most certainly you don’t get there if you don’t work hard. That’s life.

This is exactly right. I think a lot about Kobe Bryant and his “mamba mentality”. The guy was just extreme in his commitment to excellence. He didn’t just show up to practice, he had a work ethic that was beyond comprehension. There is no one that can say that this extra work he put in was somehow unfair to anyone else. Its instead viewed as a favorable trait.
https://www.businessinsider.com/kobe-bryant-insane-work-ethic-2013-8

I agree that I cannot understand how kids putting extra work to improve themselves, even if it’s parent motivated, is a bad thing for society. Maybe it’s a bad thing for those kids/families if they are getting pushed too hard, but that’s an entirely different issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1 A lot of folks don't get it, because it is what we grew up with, but the whole system of standardized testing was designed to keep people out of elite institutions. It might seem innocuous to give analogies about sailboats, but think about it for a minute.

I think you're conflating math the language portions of standardized testing.

No, PP. Please read up on the inherent inequities of standardized testing which include all topics. As others have noted, to succeed in getting the highest scores, particularly in this year, kids supplement classroom teaching through tutoring and/or parental instruction and/or special programs to enhance their scores. In addition, there are clearly parents, who know the drill; they know to prep because they know that these tests essentially cement a track for students from which many opportunities will be determined or denied. Not all parents have this insight or are as savvy. They don’t know the system.

Kids in lower SES groups are disadvantaged in this system. And in this year, when so many kids were doing DL at home while a parent had to work simultaneously or - as many kids in my DC’s Title I elementary school - were left in the care of an older sibling, sometimes not much older than the student (middle school or high school) these kids were especially left behind. Now we have the county suddenly raising the bar mid flight for kids who given the hard work and graded they put in, are earning As but may not have done as well on the MAP because they didn’t have the advantages of a parent or other resources to fill the gaps that math 4/5 didn’t cover in class. It’s outrageous. Sure, you want to start 3rd graders with a 90th threshold, then start that next year when - hopefully - kids will have a chance to regain any lost ground. The only people who support this nonsense are those who feel superior by excluding kids; it’s an ego boost. If a kid is getting As in 4/5 and thriving, they earn a spot in a 5/6 class. Period.

I’m sorry, but this is ridiculous. Let me introduce a relevant example of situations I am familiar with.

Kid A: Parents strictly enforce screen time limits, with no screen time allowed on weekdays. Purchased Beast Academy workbooks and require kid to complete an extra problem set each week. Parents check homework every day. In compacted math.

Kid B: Parents allow kid to play Minecraft 1-2 hours a day. No one checks on completion of homework. Not in compacted math.

Kid A is Black and parents are middle class. Kid B is white and parents are wealthy. Keeping in mind that these are real people that I know, I would love for you to explain to me how Kid A’s Black parents are committing inequality against Kid B. That extra work is producing results. Particularly with math, outside of the true geniuses, the kids that put in the work get the results and the standardized tests are a measure of the work that is put in. It is not inequality.

I think it's great for whoever wants to put in extra work outside school in math. It seems like the parents have a lot to do with it; and when we generalize, which I think we have to in this situation, a lot of the kids who aren't doing the extra work aren't doing it because their parents are poor and struggling. How many kids of their own volition would rather do Khan Academy? It's mostly parental push. Plus, shouldn't the school teach the accelerated math? Taking the course should be enough, right?

Not to mention, my kids (and DH and I) are like Kid A but we’ve been taking our queues for how hard to push from teachers who consistently told me DS was doing great in compacted math. DC got As and special shout outs for doing great in math. I took them at their word and yet my child’s MAP score isn’t 85 / 90th percentile. Now hearing that DC will be shut out of a track that will mean they are now essentially never going to make it in a science/math program in college. Wow, if only someone had said that despite all of the accolades from teachers my child was actually underachieving and can’t move to compacted math 5/6.

This is not right and not acceptable. I know I’m not alone. And I’m so sick of the smugness on this thread. It’s exactly why this pathetic system perpetuates. Some of you get off on it.

Your all-or-nothing thinking really is not going to help your kid. Really? Your kid is going to take math in the “regular” track and get AP calc senior year, and this is a failure that will mean he or she will never get into a strong college program? Get a grip. This is not the end of the world.

Is your kid "regular track"? Of course not. So stop it with your ludicrous sanctimony.

Yes, my kid is, or at least I presume so based on this thread. Mine is in the 85th MAP percentile so will not be in compacted next year.

Hey but with 85% they got a good shot at the MS magnet lottery!