Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
So we’ve established this is about your needs and your needs alone.
Guess who else needs to worry about childcare on teacher work days?
Teachers.
Yet somehow they aren’t here screaming. Maybe it’s because they see that students are also served by well-prepared instruction, which only happens when teachers get a chance to prepare.
Your way, which appears to take even more from overburdened teachers, doesn’t benefit anybody in the end.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
Okay. Now I know you’re trolling. This is so ridiculously convoluted and absurd that it has to be for one purpose: trying to upset me.
Here’s the thing: I work with teenagers. I don’t get worked up or upset by childish behavior.
Trolling over?
Not two posts ago, you wanted to know how to work cooperatively, and happily give up federal holidays. I have given you a suggestion: approach the board, advocate to move the days. That’s what parents have been doing, which is why there’s a proposal to replace two federal holidays next year. But now a practical solution means you’re being trolled?
Nah, that’s not the trolling. It’s the twisting of my words and the allegations of being entitled for thinking I deserve the occasional holiday. And guess what? I do!
I get it. You are baiting teachers. You’re just up against one who doesn’t care. My job involves working with over a hundred teenagers a day. I’ve seen it all, so your attitude doesn’t upset me. You’ve decided that some random teacher on DCUM is responsible for your frustrations and you behaved accordingly.
39 days between August and June sure feels more than “occasional”. Or are you the non-Fairfax teacher?
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
So we’ve established this is about your needs and your needs alone.
Guess who else needs to worry about childcare on teacher work days?
Teachers.
Yet somehow they aren’t here screaming. Maybe it’s because they see that students are also served by well-prepared instruction, which only happens when teachers get a chance to prepare.
Your way, which appears to take even more from overburdened teachers, doesn’t benefit anybody in the end.
My needs? No. My child is super supervised on days off and doesn’t participate in the FARMS program. I’m sure children benefit from well prepare prepared instruction, I’m sure that does not outweigh the loss of getting their meals that day while that preparation takes place.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
School days aren't expanding. Just the number of days that students are actually in class should expand. 195 days is 195 days.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
Yes, this is definitely a troll we are dealing with. I’m no longer responding as this person is not willing or capable of having a fair discussion.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
Yes, this is definitely a troll we are dealing with. I’m no longer responding as this person is not willing or capable of having a fair discussion.
Bye! Can’t wait to see your proposal to the board for teachers to happily do their planning time on the holidays! You’ll be making a real contribution to your students learning.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
Okay. Now I know you’re trolling. This is so ridiculously convoluted and absurd that it has to be for one purpose: trying to upset me.
Here’s the thing: I work with teenagers. I don’t get worked up or upset by childish behavior.
Trolling over?
Not two posts ago, you wanted to know how to work cooperatively, and happily give up federal holidays. I have given you a suggestion: approach the board, advocate to move the days. That’s what parents have been doing, which is why there’s a proposal to replace two federal holidays next year. But now a practical solution means you’re being trolled?
Nah, that’s not the trolling. It’s the twisting of my words and the allegations of being entitled for thinking I deserve the occasional holiday. And guess what? I do!
I get it. You are baiting teachers. You’re just up against one who doesn’t care. My job involves working with over a hundred teenagers a day. I’ve seen it all, so your attitude doesn’t upset me. You’ve decided that some random teacher on DCUM is responsible for your frustrations and you behaved accordingly.
39 days between August and June sure feels more than “occasional”. Or are you the non-Fairfax teacher?
41 this year.. due to the extra closures for voting.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
Okay. Now I know you’re trolling. This is so ridiculously convoluted and absurd that it has to be for one purpose: trying to upset me.
Here’s the thing: I work with teenagers. I don’t get worked up or upset by childish behavior.
Trolling over?
Not two posts ago, you wanted to know how to work cooperatively, and happily give up federal holidays. I have given you a suggestion: approach the board, advocate to move the days. That’s what parents have been doing, which is why there’s a proposal to replace two federal holidays next year. But now a practical solution means you’re being trolled?
Nah, that’s not the trolling. It’s the twisting of my words and the allegations of being entitled for thinking I deserve the occasional holiday. And guess what? I do!
I get it. You are baiting teachers. You’re just up against one who doesn’t care. My job involves working with over a hundred teenagers a day. I’ve seen it all, so your attitude doesn’t upset me. You’ve decided that some random teacher on DCUM is responsible for your frustrations and you behaved accordingly.
39 days between August and June sure feels more than “occasional”. Or are you the non-Fairfax teacher?
41 this year.. due to the extra closures for voting.
Just to make sure: are we blaming those on teachers?
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
Okay. Now I know you’re trolling. This is so ridiculously convoluted and absurd that it has to be for one purpose: trying to upset me.
Here’s the thing: I work with teenagers. I don’t get worked up or upset by childish behavior.
Trolling over?
Not two posts ago, you wanted to know how to work cooperatively, and happily give up federal holidays. I have given you a suggestion: approach the board, advocate to move the days. That’s what parents have been doing, which is why there’s a proposal to replace two federal holidays next year. But now a practical solution means you’re being trolled?
Nah, that’s not the trolling. It’s the twisting of my words and the allegations of being entitled for thinking I deserve the occasional holiday. And guess what? I do!
I get it. You are baiting teachers. You’re just up against one who doesn’t care. My job involves working with over a hundred teenagers a day. I’ve seen it all, so your attitude doesn’t upset me. You’ve decided that some random teacher on DCUM is responsible for your frustrations and you behaved accordingly.
39 days between August and June sure feels more than “occasional”. Or are you the non-Fairfax teacher?
41 this year.. due to the extra closures for voting.
Just to make sure: are we blaming those on teachers?
No, just suggesting that they get more than the “occasional” holiday that the one poster who may or may not even be from Fairfax says they deserve.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Are these common in north east us school systems?
No. In my home school district (suburban NY) they start in September, end one week after FCPS, have a winter break and a holiday break, and have 2 PD days. FCPS is unreal.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Are these common in north east us school systems?
No. In my home school district (suburban NY) they start in September, end one week after FCPS, have a winter break and a holiday break, and have 2 PD days. FCPS is unreal.
Teachers get paid better too.
Just counted the days off from my NE school calendar for this year. They have 36 days off. All are student and teacher holidays except for two days where only students are off. They are closed 2 days for Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kipur, Diwali, Lunar New Year, both Eids, all the federal holidays, a full week for Presidents Week, 11 days for Spring Break… pretty close to FCPS.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
School days aren't expanding. Just the number of days that students are actually in class should expand. 195 days is 195 days.
Except you are proving my point because the school year has to be 180 days.
Anonymous wrote:What I struggle to understand is the number of parents on this board who routinely imply (or even outright declare) that teachers are somehow less deserving of respect than other professionals.
I cannot imagine teaching children that any profession—surgeon, sanitation worker, nurse, architect, attorney, grocery clerk, EMT, detective, engineer, teacher, pharmacy tech, salesperson, librarian, soldier, president, athletic trainer, mechanic, mail carrier, and so on—is inherently more or less worthy of respect and/or dignity. A functioning, well-oiled society depends on the talents and contributions of all of us. Every role matters and every person fulfilling those roles deserves respect.
It is genuinely baffling to see parents here react with hostility and hatred when teachers simply assert that they too deserve to be treated with respect. It is mind-boggling to watch people compare teachers’ responsibilities to their own as though the goal is to prove superiority rather than to understand the complexity of a profession they cannot understand. It is disheartening to see teachers denigrated so casually while other professions are praised, as though respect is a finite resource.
Additionally, the idea that education is a “part‑time job” is not just inaccurate; it’s willfully ignorant.
If we want children to grow into adults who value community, collaboration, and shared responsibility, we should model that by recognizing the worth/value of every profession. We must stop modeling vitriol and denigration of any person who contributes to society, regardless of what their role may be. Not one single profession or person is more worthy or important than any other.
Just think:
-- Your child dreams of being a police officer, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how awful and violent police officers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an attorney, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how dishonest and conniving attorneys are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being an electrician, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how uneducated electricians are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a doctor, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how cold and selfish doctors are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
-- Your child dreams of being a teacher, but he/she constantly hears you talk about how whiny and entitled teachers are. How would that make your child feel about the disrespect you will show them if they choose to enter that profession?
--
So many parents on this board need to grow up and leave their "mean girl" mentality in the past. Be an adult and be a better role model for your kids; they deserve better.
When the majority of these roles think of “respect and dignity” they are not asking for it at anyones expense.
If a sanitation worker said we need to miss nine collections every year to train, it’s not likely people would support that. It’s not a lack of respect to say we need hospitals staffed on Christmas. When people say the number of days of school missed for training and planning is too high and it is not a good use of taxpayer resources , that is similarly not disrespectful.
It is disrespectful because you’re not listening to the teachers who say they need the days. You’re discrediting their professional opinions and needs.
Disagreeing is not the same as not listening. I understand wanting more days to plan/train/catch up. I disagree it is the public interest to close school more often. That is not a disrespectful position.
There are ways to do teacher training days without closing school more often, like putting them on federal holidays as is done for indigenous peoples day. That is rarely perceived by teachers as a more “respectful” suggestion.
I’m a teacher. I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes. Absolutely. I am so absurdly overloaded that I’ll take anything at this point to get my head above water.
But I have to disagree with you regarding the “listening” comment. I am rarely listened to on this site. People often disagree with me about my lived experiences, believing their assumptions about my working conditions are more accurate than my reality. If I try to explain something calmly and clearly, I’m told to stop whining. That’s what we mean by not listening, and that’s the most common way teachers are treated here.
Ok, if not Federal Holidays you feel you deserve what about some of the religious holidays? Surely you agree that the number of teachers observing both Eid and Rosh Hashanah is likely very limited?
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience. If you can only feel “listened to” when people agree with you, yes, you will struggle here.
I think you just provided an example of “not listening.”
I already said I’d happily give up federal holidays. Seriously. I’ll go in on Thanksgiving if it means I can get some planned grading/planning time. I can still be home by 4 to eat with the family. And yes, I’ll give up religious holidays, too. That’s how desperate I am to get some time at work. I wish I were kidding, but I’m not. So clearly I am ready and willing to work with you to fix the calendar.
Yet you read it differently and then told me what I already know: teacher planning time is a burden on families.
This is, unfortunately, what the teacher experience is like on this site. I wish we could have a conversation that didn’t start with the assumption that teachers are asking for perks at the expense of the public or our students.
I read it differently, because what you said is you deserve federal holidays off. That is another way of saying you believe you are “entitled” to federal holidays off. It is my perspective that the public interest takes precedence over “deserving” federal holidays.
And once again, you proved my point. You ignored the main point, focused on what you wanted to hear from an “entitled” teacher, and attacked.
Yes, I think we deserve federal holidays. And I also said that yes, I’ll happily give them up. Both can be true.
I’m willing to work together here. Increasingly, it’s obvious your place isn’t one of cooperation.
Again, you’re not being attacked. Your own words are being questioned. People can disagree about the best use of resources. But if disagreeing with you is the same as “attacking” “disrespecting” or “not listening” then there’s no use for you here. You have not shown that there is a greater public good being served by additional planning days off, all you have shown is that you cannot stand people who think differently than you do.
Oh, I’m most definitely being attacked. Possibly even trolled.
I wrote:
“I’ll happily give up every federal holiday if it means I can get some paid work time to do work. Is it the right option? No, probably not. We deserve holidays just like workers in other professions. But would I accept it? Yes.”
You won at the start of this. I said I’d give up federal holidays. But that wasn’t enough. You needed me to say I don’t DESERVE holidays.
And I’m not going to do that for you.
Most reading this will likely see the thread as a good example of how teachers are treated. Thank you.
No, you’re making things up. You don’t need to say you don’t deserve them— but by stipulating that you do deserve them, and that “other professions” get them, you are showing that it is you who who are “not listening”.
Or prove me wrong, get with the board and get all of the teacher workday move to other holidays. That will sure show me how cooperative and unentitled you are.
… said the man wanting free to parents school camps and daycare on holidays paid for by tax money.
Nope, says the parent who wants my kid in school for regular five day weeks, with a long enough summer vacation for meaningful camp and travel experience. The schedule is wasteful, both of parent resources and children’s time. It does not justify it’s negative attributes. But nowhere did I say there should be paid for camp.
What you said was:
Every day school is closed, the families of the children schools are intended to serve spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on childcare. Children go unsupervised. Children go without meals. Believing that the public is better served by limiting the number of days off doesn’t mean people don’t listen. It means they believe some things take higher priority in the public good than your experience.
Which is ridiculous. Basically you are arguing that instead of parents paying for camps you want schools to be open all the time like that doesn’t cost more money as well. It does just yiu want other people to pay for it not just you and your ex wife.
It doesn’t cost dramatically more to have school open than it does to have a teacher workday, except in food costs for children, who otherwise can’t afford meals.
The cost of parents for childcare is significantly higher, and comes directly out of the households in which the children live.
Five day weeks should be the default, planning should be layered with federal holidays, and other mandatory breaks, and public institutions should not recognize religious holidays. Schools are a public service, and exist to serve children. Why that is controversial is beyond me.
Definitely a troll suddenly federal holidays are ok and we should all work on Christmas.
Yes parents pay for camps and everyone pays for school. If you expand the number of school days without paying teachers and school staff more you are expanding solely on the backs of school employees.
Someone is always paying you aren’t aware enough to see beyond just the price of camp you are paying
School days aren't expanding. Just the number of days that students are actually in class should expand. 195 days is 195 days.
Except you are proving my point because the school year has to be 180 days.
I think the disconnect comes from the fact some posters don’t see the need for planning time. In their minds, teachers should only be paid for the time they are directly in front of students. It comes from the same mindset that sees education as childcare.
Seeing education as education would appreciate the fact that teachers need time to prepare effective, successful lessons.
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