Compared Against Peers - T20 Admissions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the NYC privates and boarding schools have pull with admissions but the DC privates have very little with the top universities.

For our Big3 school the "line in the sand" for Duke is about a 3.9. I know several kids with a 3.8, legacy parents who were TOP donors at the high school who did not get into Duke over the past 2 years.
It's not something the high school can push through.

There are different lines in the sand because top universities recalculate GPA. This means a 3.9 isn’t really a 3.9 if there is not advanced classes. This is becoming a huge issue for top students who took hard classes and didn’t realize they were better situated and for those with 4.0 who really were not looked at favorable to colleges as they didn’t have enough advanced classes. It may be better to have to pay for private counselor to understand all this stuff. It is complicated.

At my kids' school most of the top kids have taken difficult classes. Maybe not to a person but there is a strong correlation between top GPAs and top classes.
These schools (the Big3) are almost 3 schools in one: the superstars, the hard worker/strong students who aren't superstars and the laggers/slackers.
The superstars who have GPAs above 3.85 or so (many above 3.9) generally take hard classes. The same thing that motivates a kid to do well all the hard general classes motivates them to take challenging electives.
Again, not to a person but in general.

I've seen all the admissions data for our school and the acceptances really mirror GPA and unfortunately, most of the top 20 universities don't take kids below a 3.80 or even 3.9 (and some of us didn't even know there was a cohort of kids at our school that had grades that high...lol). But they exist and they do well with admissions. Legacy will get a dip down maybe 0.1 or 0.2 from the non-legacy kids. But it's nothing like Duke taking a 3.5 instead of a 3.9.

Many above a 3.9? Aren’t you the same crowd whining about grade deflation in private schools? Looks pretty inflated to me.

Above 3.9 translates roughly into top 10 percent kids at Big 3 Privates.

yes, it depends on the school and the year. Top 10% is usually above a 3.9. Sometimes as low as a 3.85, sometimes as high as a 3.95. Grades have a been a bit inflated for seniors over the past 3 years due to the Covid (remote) grading. The first class back to all routine grading is the class of 2025 (current juniors).

Oh there you are again the crazy Big 3 mom obsessing over other kid’s grades. The schools don’t share this info… you are just cobbling it together. Just stop.

What? This is directly from SCOIR reporting for the school. So, the schools do share that information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Without getting into detail. My child should not have been discouraged and we can leave it at that. We too looked at SCOIR. There is also no communication about how these school discussions will go. I am not sure how the school will handle conversations about rigor. I am not sure about anything. We are hoping everything works out but so many rumors. My kid is hoping it all works out and that is what we are going with currently.

I am just curious what “rumors” you are hearing-my kid keeps a low profile and doesn’t discuss this at school so I’m not sure what the overall vibe is right now.

SCOIR is helpful to a certain extent-but it doesn’t give any info on rigor, legacy, athletic recruit, minority status etc so very difficult to chance yourself based on this alone. Some say their schools remove all the “hooked” students too from SCOIR and I don’t know if our school does that. So many things they could have explained to parents and failed to do so!

Our Big 3 SCOIR data definitely does NOT take out hooked kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:IMO brokering typically happens for waitlists and deferrals.

It’s in the CCO interest to get everyone placed at a place that is appropriate for them….

“The appropriate thing for them “i statement is the lingo that bothers parents. Let the grades/scores and essays and teacher recommendations decide. Suddenly someone who doesn’t know your kid is brokering the next four years of your life. Something about this feels wrong.

[Anonymous]

Potomac school represents they do not rank students. This would include ranking a student against another on a call.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IMO brokering typically happens for waitlists and deferrals.

It’s in the CCO interest to get everyone placed at a place that is appropriate for them….

“The appropriate thing for them “i statement is the lingo that bothers parents. Let the grades/scores and essays and teacher recommendations decide. Suddenly someone who doesn’t know your kid is brokering the next four years of your life. Something about this feels wrong.

Big donors will be automatically favored. This is how the whole country runs..why should a school CCO be any different!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the NYC privates and boarding schools have pull with admissions but the DC privates have very little with the top universities.

For our Big3 school the "line in the sand" for Duke is about a 3.9. I know several kids with a 3.8, legacy parents who were TOP donors at the high school who did not get into Duke over the past 2 years.
It's not something the high school can push through.

There are different lines in the sand because top universities recalculate GPA. This means a 3.9 isn’t really a 3.9 if there is not advanced classes. This is becoming a huge issue for top students who took hard classes and didn’t realize they were better situated and for those with 4.0 who really were not looked at favorable to colleges as they didn’t have enough advanced classes. It may be better to have to pay for private counselor to understand all this stuff. It is complicated.

At my kids' school most of the top kids have taken difficult classes. Maybe not to a person but there is a strong correlation between top GPAs and top classes.
These schools (the Big3) are almost 3 schools in one: the superstars, the hard worker/strong students who aren't superstars and the laggers/slackers.
The superstars who have GPAs above 3.85 or so (many above 3.9) generally take hard classes. The same thing that motivates a kid to do well all the hard general classes motivates them to take challenging electives.
Again, not to a person but in general.

I've seen all the admissions data for our school and the acceptances really mirror GPA and unfortunately, most of the top 20 universities don't take kids below a 3.80 or even 3.9 (and some of us didn't even know there was a cohort of kids at our school that had grades that high...lol). But they exist and they do well with admissions. Legacy will get a dip down maybe 0.1 or 0.2 from the non-legacy kids. But it's nothing like Duke taking a 3.5 instead of a 3.9.

Many above a 3.9? Aren’t you the same crowd whining about grade deflation in private schools? Looks pretty inflated to me.

Above 3.9 translates roughly into top 10 percent kids at Big 3 Privates.

yes, it depends on the school and the year. Top 10% is usually above a 3.9. Sometimes as low as a 3.85, sometimes as high as a 3.95. Grades have a been a bit inflated for seniors over the past 3 years due to the Covid (remote) grading. The first class back to all routine grading is the class of 2025 (current juniors).

Oh there you are again the crazy Big 3 mom obsessing over other kid’s grades. The schools don’t share this info… you are just cobbling it together. Just stop.

no--they have the top 20% society and every year it's easy to figure out what the GPA cut-off is if you have a senior and your kids knows seniors, etc. Last year it was about 3.91.

Nice kid you have there, worrying about everyone else's grades ... and then she reports them to you? Yuck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the NYC privates and boarding schools have pull with admissions but the DC privates have very little with the top universities.

For our Big3 school the "line in the sand" for Duke is about a 3.9. I know several kids with a 3.8, legacy parents who were TOP donors at the high school who did not get into Duke over the past 2 years.
It's not something the high school can push through.

There are different lines in the sand because top universities recalculate GPA. This means a 3.9 isn’t really a 3.9 if there is not advanced classes. This is becoming a huge issue for top students who took hard classes and didn’t realize they were better situated and for those with 4.0 who really were not looked at favorable to colleges as they didn’t have enough advanced classes. It may be better to have to pay for private counselor to understand all this stuff. It is complicated.

At my kids' school most of the top kids have taken difficult classes. Maybe not to a person but there is a strong correlation between top GPAs and top classes.
These schools (the Big3) are almost 3 schools in one: the superstars, the hard worker/strong students who aren't superstars and the laggers/slackers.
The superstars who have GPAs above 3.85 or so (many above 3.9) generally take hard classes. The same thing that motivates a kid to do well all the hard general classes motivates them to take challenging electives.
Again, not to a person but in general.

I've seen all the admissions data for our school and the acceptances really mirror GPA and unfortunately, most of the top 20 universities don't take kids below a 3.80 or even 3.9 (and some of us didn't even know there was a cohort of kids at our school that had grades that high...lol). But they exist and they do well with admissions. Legacy will get a dip down maybe 0.1 or 0.2 from the non-legacy kids. But it's nothing like Duke taking a 3.5 instead of a 3.9.

Many above a 3.9? Aren’t you the same crowd whining about grade deflation in private schools? Looks pretty inflated to me.

Above 3.9 translates roughly into top 10 percent kids at Big 3 Privates.

yes, it depends on the school and the year. Top 10% is usually above a 3.9. Sometimes as low as a 3.85, sometimes as high as a 3.95. Grades have a been a bit inflated for seniors over the past 3 years due to the Covid (remote) grading. The first class back to all routine grading is the class of 2025 (current juniors).

Oh there you are again the crazy Big 3 mom obsessing over other kid’s grades. The schools don’t share this info… you are just cobbling it together. Just stop.

no--they have the top 20% society and every year it's easy to figure out what the GPA cut-off is if you have a senior and your kids knows seniors, etc. Last year it was about 3.91.

Nice kid you have there, worrying about everyone else's grades ... and then she reports them to you? Yuck.

for the love of Pete, my kid was a sophomore last year and knew the cut-off. It was told to her aby about 10 different kids.
it was told to me by about 5 different moms on the sports sidelines, etc.
I'm sorry you and your kid don't have friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the NYC privates and boarding schools have pull with admissions but the DC privates have very little with the top universities.

For our Big3 school the "line in the sand" for Duke is about a 3.9. I know several kids with a 3.8, legacy parents who were TOP donors at the high school who did not get into Duke over the past 2 years.
It's not something the high school can push through.

There are different lines in the sand because top universities recalculate GPA. This means a 3.9 isn’t really a 3.9 if there is not advanced classes. This is becoming a huge issue for top students who took hard classes and didn’t realize they were better situated and for those with 4.0 who really were not looked at favorable to colleges as they didn’t have enough advanced classes. It may be better to have to pay for private counselor to understand all this stuff. It is complicated.

At my kids' school most of the top kids have taken difficult classes. Maybe not to a person but there is a strong correlation between top GPAs and top classes.
These schools (the Big3) are almost 3 schools in one: the superstars, the hard worker/strong students who aren't superstars and the laggers/slackers.
The superstars who have GPAs above 3.85 or so (many above 3.9) generally take hard classes. The same thing that motivates a kid to do well all the hard general classes motivates them to take challenging electives.
Again, not to a person but in general.

I've seen all the admissions data for our school and the acceptances really mirror GPA and unfortunately, most of the top 20 universities don't take kids below a 3.80 or even 3.9 (and some of us didn't even know there was a cohort of kids at our school that had grades that high...lol). But they exist and they do well with admissions. Legacy will get a dip down maybe 0.1 or 0.2 from the non-legacy kids. But it's nothing like Duke taking a 3.5 instead of a 3.9.

Many above a 3.9? Aren’t you the same crowd whining about grade deflation in private schools? Looks pretty inflated to me.

Above 3.9 translates roughly into top 10 percent kids at Big 3 Privates.

yes, it depends on the school and the year. Top 10% is usually above a 3.9. Sometimes as low as a 3.85, sometimes as high as a 3.95. Grades have a been a bit inflated for seniors over the past 3 years due to the Covid (remote) grading. The first class back to all routine grading is the class of 2025 (current juniors).

Oh there you are again the crazy Big 3 mom obsessing over other kid’s grades. The schools don’t share this info… you are just cobbling it together. Just stop.

no--they have the top 20% society and every year it's easy to figure out what the GPA cut-off is if you have a senior and your kids knows seniors, etc. Last year it was about 3.91.

Nice kid you have there, worrying about everyone else's grades ... and then she reports them to you? Yuck.

for the love of Pete, my kid was a sophomore last year and knew the cut-off. It was told to her aby about 10 different kids.
it was told to me by about 5 different moms on the sports sidelines, etc.
I'm sorry you and your kid don't have friends.

Which school is this? Is this weighted or unweighted ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the NYC privates and boarding schools have pull with admissions but the DC privates have very little with the top universities.

For our Big3 school the "line in the sand" for Duke is about a 3.9. I know several kids with a 3.8, legacy parents who were TOP donors at the high school who did not get into Duke over the past 2 years.
It's not something the high school can push through.

There are different lines in the sand because top universities recalculate GPA. This means a 3.9 isn’t really a 3.9 if there is not advanced classes. This is becoming a huge issue for top students who took hard classes and didn’t realize they were better situated and for those with 4.0 who really were not looked at favorable to colleges as they didn’t have enough advanced classes. It may be better to have to pay for private counselor to understand all this stuff. It is complicated.

At my kids' school most of the top kids have taken difficult classes. Maybe not to a person but there is a strong correlation between top GPAs and top classes.
These schools (the Big3) are almost 3 schools in one: the superstars, the hard worker/strong students who aren't superstars and the laggers/slackers.
The superstars who have GPAs above 3.85 or so (many above 3.9) generally take hard classes. The same thing that motivates a kid to do well all the hard general classes motivates them to take challenging electives.
Again, not to a person but in general.

I've seen all the admissions data for our school and the acceptances really mirror GPA and unfortunately, most of the top 20 universities don't take kids below a 3.80 or even 3.9 (and some of us didn't even know there was a cohort of kids at our school that had grades that high...lol). But they exist and they do well with admissions. Legacy will get a dip down maybe 0.1 or 0.2 from the non-legacy kids. But it's nothing like Duke taking a 3.5 instead of a 3.9.

Many above a 3.9? Aren’t you the same crowd whining about grade deflation in private schools? Looks pretty inflated to me.

Above 3.9 translates roughly into top 10 percent kids at Big 3 Privates.

yes, it depends on the school and the year. Top 10% is usually above a 3.9. Sometimes as low as a 3.85, sometimes as high as a 3.95. Grades have a been a bit inflated for seniors over the past 3 years due to the Covid (remote) grading. The first class back to all routine grading is the class of 2025 (current juniors).

Oh there you are again the crazy Big 3 mom obsessing over other kid’s grades. The schools don’t share this info… you are just cobbling it together. Just stop.

no--they have the top 20% society and every year it's easy to figure out what the GPA cut-off is if you have a senior and your kids knows seniors, etc. Last year it was about 3.91.

Nice kid you have there, worrying about everyone else's grades ... and then she reports them to you? Yuck.

NP here. You should not be surprised how bad certain moms push their kids.

[Anonymous]

The bottom line is that the first comparison of students is made at the school level and the counselors are there to help the AO direct traffic. The good counselors will want to place every student in the class as high as possible per their individual preferences. This should happen with or without hooks or other parental status with the school. It should also be done in a more helpful and transparent way given how murky the colleges make the process at a baseline. Some schools are definitely better at this than others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They definitely compare kids from one school. I was looking through the SCIOR data for my kid's school and I think it's best for everyone when the academic outliers ED successfully.

In several recent years an academic superstar (4.0 or a hair below) has run the table during regular decision and basically shut everyone else out. The schools don't have quotas per say but an exceptionally strong kid can seemingly hurt the chances of the 3.8s or low 3.9s.

Especially true if non-White and non-Asian…

yep. One top 3.98 kid can literally take every top spot in RD. From all the Ivies to Duke and Rice and Hopkins. All in one fell swoop. And they can shut out the entire rest of the class with their lower 3.9s in the process.
Ask me how I know.

Yup happened at my kids school last year. Did not completely shut out other kids but one kid got in 5-6 Ivys in RD

[Anonymous]

We have a lot of Donald Trumps on the boards here:

Any competition Larla wins is fair and rewards excellence, but anyone who gets a prize my kid doesn’t get is unfair and the criteria is biased against Larla and should be abolished.

Just once I would like to see someone post “My kid didn’t get admitted to ELITE U and they’ve made the right call, he wasn’t really ready for it.”

[Anonymous]

If the AO isn’t comparing your kid to students taking the exact same courses at the exact same high school, who then should they be compared to?

What’s the operating theory here?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the AO isn’t comparing your kid to students taking the exact same courses at the exact same high school, who then should they be compared to?

What’s the operating theory here?

Magical idea! What about an objective measure of your kid that can be compared not just to the kids in their cohort at their school, but just as easily against ALL cohorts at ALL schools.

Oh wait ...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They definitely compare kids from one school. I was looking through the SCIOR data for my kid's school and I think it's best for everyone when the academic outliers ED successfully.

In several recent years an academic superstar (4.0 or a hair below) has run the table during regular decision and basically shut everyone else out. The schools don't have quotas per say but an exceptionally strong kid can seemingly hurt the chances of the 3.8s or low 3.9s.

Especially true if non-White and non-Asian…

yep. One top 3.98 kid can literally take every top spot in RD. From all the Ivies to Duke and Rice and Hopkins. All in one fell swoop. And they can shut out the entire rest of the class with their lower 3.9s in the process.
Ask me how I know.

Yup happened at my kids school last year. Did not completely shut out other kids but one kid got in 5-6 Ivys in RD

I agree. One or two stars who don't ED successfully can shut out remaining strong kids. The only hope these kids have is for yield protection logic to kick in.