10+ AP classes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

1&2 are definitely not useless exams- they’re harder than the C exams for crying out loud!

No, they are not. The pass rate is lower, but that has to do in part with who is taking the class, not the difficulty of the test. Calculus-based physics is not easier than algebra-based physics.

The C exam is about computation. It’s how the B exam was before they made the 1&2 more conceptual. 1 is about understanding concepts, Mechanics is about finding an equation quick enough

Also there’s very very light amounts of calculus on most of the exams. You’re barely computing an integral and only need the derivative to move from velocity to acceleration- hardly a robust calculus physics course

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mine took 2 freshman year (comp sci principals and AP gov) and is signed up for 4 his sophomore year (Econ, U.S. hist, physics, comp sci java). He’s planning on taking at least five more but it might be more like 8 more. (Two more Gov, 2-3 more science, calculus, at least one English, AP art history, and maybe something like psych or human geography as an elective).
Physics is weirdly like three different tests now, which is not how it was when I took it a million years ago.
He’s not doing this to pad his resume or anything — he’s just looking for classes that might be interesting and that his friends are taking.

Many schools just have kids take regular physics/honors physics rather than AP Physics 1&2. Then once in calculus you move to AP Physics C (Mechanics then E&M). 1&2 are pointless AP courses, just like AP HUG. If you actually need physics for the future, you need C. So I guess that is how many get to 12-15 courses. WH, Hug, Physics 1&2, etc. courses that do not really count for college credit. Same material can be learned in a regular course, perhaps more as the teacher does NOT have to teach to an AP test

1&2 are definitely not useless exams- they’re harder than the C exams for crying out loud! 2 has content that E&M is entirely missing, and 1 is, in my perspective, the best physics exam, because it is fully conceptual and asks realistic tough questions that you’d be asked in a college physics Exam. The C exams are plug and chug and just affirmations that you can open the exam book cover and glare over the equations.

Sigh. 1&2 are not harder than C, except in the sense that they test for regurgitating incantations in English not math, because they don't actually define and explain the phenomena logically, so they are hard for people like high school students and also professional physicists who don't understand what the goofy questions are trying to ask.

1&2 are taken (obviously) by far less capable student (often freshmen) than students who take C, and the curriculum is poor, so the pass rate is lower.

Can you talk about the issue professional physicists have with the exam? You’re speaking to a physics grad, so I’m interested in where you get this perception. I got many more physics 1 style questions than C in my first year- it’s cool that students can do calculus (and eigenvalues for baby quantum), but plug and chug is not what a physics exam should be. I’ve never seen a physics 1 question that’s difficult to understand- difficult to set up without the easy calculus way, maybe, but never difficult to grasp. Most 1&2 students are juniors, not freshman.

Professional physicist here .

Calculus is fundamental to physics which essentially is how things change over time or how they depend on other things.

If we compare Physics 1 with C Mechanics, the algebra based version, is more of a plug and chug and it relies more on memorization. The calculus based class will give a more complete picture and explain how things flow from each other.

For example all mechanics is derived from Newtonian principles, but in Algebra 1 you can’t really use equations of motions because often they involve solving differential equations. Instead you’ll have to rely on conservation laws, and a lot of other tricks without knowing the why and how.

Calculus physics also builds a better intuition for relationships and phenomena. There’s a reason why Algebra physics is not accepted as a physics degree requirement at any university.

[Anonymous]

It depends what those APs are. Physics, Chemistry, Calculus, English, History are not the same as Human Geography, Psychology, computer science principles, which don’t matter for anything.

It’s not the number that matters, it’s the content of the class. If a student interested in STEM majors is taking all AP in math, sciences and computing( that’s 7 APs), they’d be in good shape to be accepted at a top program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mine took 2 freshman year (comp sci principals and AP gov) and is signed up for 4 his sophomore year (Econ, U.S. hist, physics, comp sci java). He’s planning on taking at least five more but it might be more like 8 more. (Two more Gov, 2-3 more science, calculus, at least one English, AP art history, and maybe something like psych or human geography as an elective).
Physics is weirdly like three different tests now, which is not how it was when I took it a million years ago.
He’s not doing this to pad his resume or anything — he’s just looking for classes that might be interesting and that his friends are taking.

Many schools just have kids take regular physics/honors physics rather than AP Physics 1&2. Then once in calculus you move to AP Physics C (Mechanics then E&M). 1&2 are pointless AP courses, just like AP HUG. If you actually need physics for the future, you need C. So I guess that is how many get to 12-15 courses. WH, Hug, Physics 1&2, etc. courses that do not really count for college credit. Same material can be learned in a regular course, perhaps more as the teacher does NOT have to teach to an AP test

1&2 are definitely not useless exams- they’re harder than the C exams for crying out loud! 2 has content that E&M is entirely missing, and 1 is, in my perspective, the best physics exam, because it is fully conceptual and asks realistic tough questions that you’d be asked in a college physics Exam. The C exams are plug and chug and just affirmations that you can open the exam book cover and glare over the equations.

Sigh. 1&2 are not harder than C, except in the sense that they test for regurgitating incantations in English not math, because they don't actually define and explain the phenomena logically, so they are hard for people like high school students and also professional physicists who don't understand what the goofy questions are trying to ask.

1&2 are taken (obviously) by far less capable student (often freshmen) than students who take C, and the curriculum is poor, so the pass rate is lower.

Can you talk about the issue professional physicists have with the exam? You’re speaking to a physics grad, so I’m interested in where you get this perception. I got many more physics 1 style questions than C in my first year- it’s cool that students can do calculus (and eigenvalues for baby quantum), but plug and chug is not what a physics exam should be. I’ve never seen a physics 1 question that’s difficult to understand- difficult to set up without the easy calculus way, maybe, but never difficult to grasp. Most 1&2 students are juniors, not freshman.

Professional physicist here .

Calculus is fundamental to physics which essentially is how things change over time or how they depend on other things.

If we compare Physics 1 with C Mechanics, the algebra based version, is more of a plug and chug and it relies more on memorization. The calculus based class will give a more complete picture and explain how things flow from each other.

For example all mechanics is derived from Newtonian principles, but in Algebra 1 you can’t really use equations of motions because often they involve solving differential equations. Instead you’ll have to rely on conservation laws, and a lot of other tricks without knowing the why and how.

Calculus physics also builds a better intuition for relationships and phenomena. There’s a reason why Algebra physics is not accepted as a physics degree requirement at any university.

Agreed, but have you checked out the calculus exam- there’s no differential equations in the curriculum? The calculus needed is for slope in the frq section, occasionally an imperfect spring, and mostly to go from V(x)= 8x^2-12x to V’(x)—-> A(x). I like calculus based physics, and it’s great at the undergraduate level, but there’s no high school E&M kids reading out of Griffiths- most are still relying on hand skills over vector calculus. Both exams are pretty much on the same foot, but C has always been the more computation heavy-here’s 3 tension forces on a block, solve them for me- than physics 1.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It depends what those APs are. Physics, Chemistry, Calculus, English, History are not the same as Human Geography, Psychology, computer science principles, which don’t matter for anything.

It’s not the number that matters, it’s the content of the class. If a student interested in STEM majors is taking all AP in math, sciences and computing( that’s 7 APs), they’d be in good shape to be accepted at a top program.

THIS is the KEY

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mine took 2 freshman year (comp sci principals and AP gov) and is signed up for 4 his sophomore year (Econ, U.S. hist, physics, comp sci java). He’s planning on taking at least five more but it might be more like 8 more. (Two more Gov, 2-3 more science, calculus, at least one English, AP art history, and maybe something like psych or human geography as an elective).
Physics is weirdly like three different tests now, which is not how it was when I took it a million years ago.
He’s not doing this to pad his resume or anything — he’s just looking for classes that might be interesting and that his friends are taking.

Many schools just have kids take regular physics/honors physics rather than AP Physics 1&2. Then once in calculus you move to AP Physics C (Mechanics then E&M). 1&2 are pointless AP courses, just like AP HUG. If you actually need physics for the future, you need C. So I guess that is how many get to 12-15 courses. WH, Hug, Physics 1&2, etc. courses that do not really count for college credit. Same material can be learned in a regular course, perhaps more as the teacher does NOT have to teach to an AP test

1&2 are definitely not useless exams- they’re harder than the C exams for crying out loud! 2 has content that E&M is entirely missing, and 1 is, in my perspective, the best physics exam, because it is fully conceptual and asks realistic tough questions that you’d be asked in a college physics Exam. The C exams are plug and chug and just affirmations that you can open the exam book cover and glare over the equations.

Sigh. 1&2 are not harder than C, except in the sense that they test for regurgitating incantations in English not math, because they don't actually define and explain the phenomena logically, so they are hard for people like high school students and also professional physicists who don't understand what the goofy questions are trying to ask.

1&2 are taken (obviously) by far less capable student (often freshmen) than students who take C, and the curriculum is poor, so the pass rate is lower.

Can you talk about the issue professional physicists have with the exam? You’re speaking to a physics grad, so I’m interested in where you get this perception. I got many more physics 1 style questions than C in my first year- it’s cool that students can do calculus (and eigenvalues for baby quantum), but plug and chug is not what a physics exam should be. I’ve never seen a physics 1 question that’s difficult to understand- difficult to set up without the easy calculus way, maybe, but never difficult to grasp. Most 1&2 students are juniors, not freshman.

Professional physicist here .

Calculus is fundamental to physics which essentially is how things change over time or how they depend on other things.

If we compare Physics 1 with C Mechanics, the algebra based version, is more of a plug and chug and it relies more on memorization. The calculus based class will give a more complete picture and explain how things flow from each other.

For example all mechanics is derived from Newtonian principles, but in Algebra 1 you can’t really use equations of motions because often they involve solving differential equations. Instead you’ll have to rely on conservation laws, and a lot of other tricks without knowing the why and how.

Calculus physics also builds a better intuition for relationships and phenomena. There’s a reason why Algebra physics is not accepted as a physics degree requirement at any university.

Agreed, but have you checked out the calculus exam- there’s no differential equations in the curriculum? The calculus needed is for slope in the frq section, occasionally an imperfect spring, and mostly to go from V(x)= 8x^2-12x to V’(x)—-> A(x). I like calculus based physics, and it’s great at the undergraduate level, but there’s no high school E&M kids reading out of Griffiths- most are still relying on hand skills over vector calculus. Both exams are pretty much on the same foot, but C has always been the more computation heavy-here’s 3 tension forces on a block, solve them for me- than physics 1.

To add on, it’d be my dream for students to learn vector calc to do physics before high school. I think it would massively aid in stopping the attrition in intro courses. Most E&M students had never seen the content from my undergrads Intro E&M class and many people washed out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:College admissions evaluate your DC based on how they stack up to other kids at your school based on information the college counselors provide about the curriculum at the school. At DC’s school, no one is allowed to take AP anything freshman year, they must take a religion course every year (which eats up a spot that might get filled with an AP class elsewhere), and you cannot take an AP STEM class without having first taken the regular/honors version. Colleges know this about DC’s school so they read their transcript with those parameters in mind. Additionally, it’s important to remember that many top schools do not take AP scores as credits toward a major. The best you can hope for is that you could avoid a large intro level course.

And ask yourself if you think your kid who took AP whatever as a freshman in HS has retained the material well enough to apply that in a higher level class at university four years later. A lot of those APs are simply about inflating grades, egos, and not about truly higher level education. Some schools don’t even require students to take the AP test.

Why wouldn’t they require them to take the AP test? That is ridiculous.

All the privates here require it or they dont list it as AP on the transcript. Why? Well a parent asked at orientation: because the top colleges want to see AP scores, even moreso in the test optional environment. This was fall 2023 9th grade and transfer parent orientation. This school has about 1/3 or more go to T30s

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:College admissions evaluate your DC based on how they stack up to other kids at your school based on information the college counselors provide about the curriculum at the school. At DC’s school, no one is allowed to take AP anything freshman year, they must take a religion course every year (which eats up a spot that might get filled with an AP class elsewhere), and you cannot take an AP STEM class without having first taken the regular/honors version. Colleges know this about DC’s school so they read their transcript with those parameters in mind. Additionally, it’s important to remember that many top schools do not take AP scores as credits toward a major. The best you can hope for is that you could avoid a large intro level course.

And ask yourself if you think your kid who took AP whatever as a freshman in HS has retained the material well enough to apply that in a higher level class at university four years later. A lot of those APs are simply about inflating grades, egos, and not about truly higher level education. Some schools don’t even require students to take the AP test.

Why wouldn’t they require them to take the AP test? That is ridiculous.

All the privates here require it or they dont list it as AP on the transcript. Why? Well a parent asked at orientation: because the top colleges want to see AP scores, even moreso in the test optional environment. This was fall 2023 9th grade and transfer parent orientation. This school has about 1/3 or more go to T30s

If a student can get 5s on various Ap exams, they should be seen as clearly intelligent and worth admitting. Ap exams should’ve replaced the SAT long ago- people talk about equity, but it’s shuffling a different part of the applicant pool, not getting rid of people

[Anonymous]

^oops you said why wouldNT. Who knows.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mine took 2 freshman year (comp sci principals and AP gov) and is signed up for 4 his sophomore year (Econ, U.S. hist, physics, comp sci java). He’s planning on taking at least five more but it might be more like 8 more. (Two more Gov, 2-3 more science, calculus, at least one English, AP art history, and maybe something like psych or human geography as an elective).
Physics is weirdly like three different tests now, which is not how it was when I took it a million years ago.
He’s not doing this to pad his resume or anything — he’s just looking for classes that might be interesting and that his friends are taking.

Many schools just have kids take regular physics/honors physics rather than AP Physics 1&2. Then once in calculus you move to AP Physics C (Mechanics then E&M). 1&2 are pointless AP courses, just like AP HUG. If you actually need physics for the future, you need C. So I guess that is how many get to 12-15 courses. WH, Hug, Physics 1&2, etc. courses that do not really count for college credit. Same material can be learned in a regular course, perhaps more as the teacher does NOT have to teach to an AP test

1&2 are definitely not useless exams- they’re harder than the C exams for crying out loud! 2 has content that E&M is entirely missing, and 1 is, in my perspective, the best physics exam, because it is fully conceptual and asks realistic tough questions that you’d be asked in a college physics Exam. The C exams are plug and chug and just affirmations that you can open the exam book cover and glare over the equations.

Sigh. 1&2 are not harder than C, except in the sense that they test for regurgitating incantations in English not math, because they don't actually define and explain the phenomena logically, so they are hard for people like high school students and also professional physicists who don't understand what the goofy questions are trying to ask.

1&2 are taken (obviously) by far less capable student (often freshmen) than students who take C, and the curriculum is poor, so the pass rate is lower.

+1

Hence my original point that they are not College level courses really. If you need Phsyics at the college level, most likely you need Calc based physics. So taking Regular/Honors Physics and then moving directly to C (mech and or E&M) is what will get you college credit and the knowledge you need to move to more advanced courses in college STEM. Very few people can use algebra based physics for college credit (and that is what regular/honors physics is at most schools, just without the "teaching to an AP test" requirement).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people are reporting that their kids are taking 10+, 15, and even 20 AP classes. How is this possible? I am looking at my rising 9th grader's schedule and I don't see how you can pack more than about 10 AP classes? They can only take 1 AP class in 9th grade and you can't take, say, AP Biology, from the getgo.

If you read this the college threads, it's clear the parents are fueling this insanity by putting such an overwhelming emphasis on college. And parents on here seem more focused on college admission, rather than anything that comes after.

College is just a 4-year stop in a hopefully very long life. I'm more focused on setting my kid up for what comes after college rather than getting into a selective one with an impressive logo. If they only can get to an impressive logo college by being on a treadmill where they are overwhelming their schedule with APs, competitive sports and extracurriculars and service jobs they will arrive in a state of anxiety. Their will learn that their life is about impressing people and striving/chasing for the next "impressive goal". They'll assume achieving their high goals equates to happiness and will wonder when they get there why they aren't happy. Why they still feel anxiety and depression and constantly compare themselves to their equally high strung peers.

If it seems crazy to you for a kid fit in 10 APs between sophamore and senior years it is because it is crazy and shouldn't happen outside of some exceptional cases where the kid is very gifted and would not be challenged by regular level classes. But instead we have an arms race of crazed parents leading their kids into a crazed cycle of anxiety and comparison. And I've already seen parents on this thread reply with the may ways their kids have fit in 10-15 APs. Sigh.

Here is the thing... For some kids those classes are not hard at all. I've been a parent for a while now and many times I have met parents complaining how hard some class is while other parents say their kids are barely studying and getting 100%... Some parents complain that everything is watered down and too easy and others complain that kids are studying more than ever and need a tutor for every class. These are kids taking classes together.

Some middle schoolers could take 2-3 AP exams each summer. Now you will say - summer is for fun, they are not supposed to... but some of them want to, and can do it without some insane level of effort.

+1

Find the level right for your kid. For some, it is all the difficult classes then ivies and it still is not risking their mental well being—in fact they thrive

I don't know about the intense ramp up as kid driven. The kids we know who were doing extra APs etc were all driven by parents (magnet school).

In the private schools near us, AP entrance is mostly by teachers who do the approval. But when 1/3 graduate with 10+ that can be considered “normal “. Not parent driven for most, just the normal top tracks for the top cohorts, with the topmost finishing BC calc in 11th and AP physC or Chem(for a few, both) by the end of 11th. No parent pushing, just part of the accepted top path.
What has been fascinating is to learn this path is not common outside of top US high schools yet is very very common for international students from India and china. The US curriculum for tippy-top US students is very common abroad

+1
I had 4 years of chemistry (including 3 years of organic chemistry) in HS. In my country, you needed this if you wanted to study medicine, which is a 6 year long BS degree. And people here act like AP chemistry is some kind phd level qualifying exam.

Kids here can do high level sports and run clubs and volunteer and have job and all that on top of all academics precisely because academics are not that demanding.

And yet here you are in our country, right? I assume if you thought your country’s education system was so great you would raise your kids there.

If we could take our jobs there we probably would. In any case, we did not come here for the AP classes, that's for sure.

Your birth country doesn't have doctors?

Funny you should ask. They do have doctors, and the kids might as well go study there. Very solid rank internationally (better than GWU, UMD, Georgetown), and basically free. But do I want my kid living abroad for 6 years.

Well you said "if we could take our jobs there", so from your college description it appears you and your partner are in medicine. So if the country is "so great at education" and all, why haven't you returned there to be practicing doctors?

Ironically, many who grow up in these intensely focused academic situations (India/China) have the ultimate goal of coming to the USA for college and beyond and don't want to return. So it makes you wonder how great this education system is that pushes so much

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people are reporting that their kids are taking 10+, 15, and even 20 AP classes. How is this possible? I am looking at my rising 9th grader's schedule and I don't see how you can pack more than about 10 AP classes? They can only take 1 AP class in 9th grade and you can't take, say, AP Biology, from the getgo.

If you read this the college threads, it's clear the parents are fueling this insanity by putting such an overwhelming emphasis on college. And parents on here seem more focused on college admission, rather than anything that comes after.

College is just a 4-year stop in a hopefully very long life. I'm more focused on setting my kid up for what comes after college rather than getting into a selective one with an impressive logo. If they only can get to an impressive logo college by being on a treadmill where they are overwhelming their schedule with APs, competitive sports and extracurriculars and service jobs they will arrive in a state of anxiety. Their will learn that their life is about impressing people and striving/chasing for the next "impressive goal". They'll assume achieving their high goals equates to happiness and will wonder when they get there why they aren't happy. Why they still feel anxiety and depression and constantly compare themselves to their equally high strung peers.

If it seems crazy to you for a kid fit in 10 APs between sophamore and senior years it is because it is crazy and shouldn't happen outside of some exceptional cases where the kid is very gifted and would not be challenged by regular level classes. But instead we have an arms race of crazed parents leading their kids into a crazed cycle of anxiety and comparison. And I've already seen parents on this thread reply with the may ways their kids have fit in 10-15 APs. Sigh.

Here is the thing... For some kids those classes are not hard at all. I've been a parent for a while now and many times I have met parents complaining how hard some class is while other parents say their kids are barely studying and getting 100%... Some parents complain that everything is watered down and too easy and others complain that kids are studying more than ever and need a tutor for every class. These are kids taking classes together.

Some middle schoolers could take 2-3 AP exams each summer. Now you will say - summer is for fun, they are not supposed to... but some of them want to, and can do it without some insane level of effort.

+1

Find the level right for your kid. For some, it is all the difficult classes then ivies and it still is not risking their mental well being—in fact they thrive

I don't know about the intense ramp up as kid driven. The kids we know who were doing extra APs etc were all driven by parents (magnet school).

In the private schools near us, AP entrance is mostly by teachers who do the approval. But when 1/3 graduate with 10+ that can be considered “normal “. Not parent driven for most, just the normal top tracks for the top cohorts, with the topmost finishing BC calc in 11th and AP physC or Chem(for a few, both) by the end of 11th. No parent pushing, just part of the accepted top path.
What has been fascinating is to learn this path is not common outside of top US high schools yet is very very common for international students from India and china. The US curriculum for tippy-top US students is very common abroad

+1
I had 4 years of chemistry (including 3 years of organic chemistry) in HS. In my country, you needed this if you wanted to study medicine, which is a 6 year long BS degree. And people here act like AP chemistry is some kind phd level qualifying exam.

Kids here can do high level sports and run clubs and volunteer and have job and all that on top of all academics precisely because academics are not that demanding.

What country?

What happens if someone in your country if they decide to pursue in a career in medicine, but they are already 14 years old and out missed the first year of chemistry?

Do your doctors also take 4 years of Biology class in high school?

Yes, typically 4 years of biology as well. It's a little more complicated because you don't choose courses in HS but you choose the type of HS when you start (humanities oriented vs. science oriented). Most HSs are for trades, though.

In any case, there is an entrance exam for medicine - biology and chemistry. You need to do well on these tests to be accepted. What you had in high school is not critical by itself (e.g. you can theoretically get in from humanities HS or even from a 4 year trade school - not sure) but you are unlikely to do well on the exam if you didn't have chemistry and biology for four years.

And you honestly think that is the best path for future doctors and teens?!?!?! To be academically tracked by age 12/13 ? to not be able to switch? And to be under so much pressure as a 12 yo+?

IMO I'd prefer kids enjoy learning and be able to be well rounded. Band, orchestra, photography, theater, along with solid English, FL, History, Psychology and the STEM courses. College is the time to focus/narrow path, not at age 12. I'd also like a "late bloomer" to be able to find there way to something other than trades or humanity if they so desire at age 15/18.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people are reporting that their kids are taking 10+, 15, and even 20 AP classes. How is this possible? I am looking at my rising 9th grader's schedule and I don't see how you can pack more than about 10 AP classes? They can only take 1 AP class in 9th grade and you can't take, say, AP Biology, from the getgo.

If you read this the college threads, it's clear the parents are fueling this insanity by putting such an overwhelming emphasis on college. And parents on here seem more focused on college admission, rather than anything that comes after.

College is just a 4-year stop in a hopefully very long life. I'm more focused on setting my kid up for what comes after college rather than getting into a selective one with an impressive logo. If they only can get to an impressive logo college by being on a treadmill where they are overwhelming their schedule with APs, competitive sports and extracurriculars and service jobs they will arrive in a state of anxiety. Their will learn that their life is about impressing people and striving/chasing for the next "impressive goal". They'll assume achieving their high goals equates to happiness and will wonder when they get there why they aren't happy. Why they still feel anxiety and depression and constantly compare themselves to their equally high strung peers.

If it seems crazy to you for a kid fit in 10 APs between sophamore and senior years it is because it is crazy and shouldn't happen outside of some exceptional cases where the kid is very gifted and would not be challenged by regular level classes. But instead we have an arms race of crazed parents leading their kids into a crazed cycle of anxiety and comparison. And I've already seen parents on this thread reply with the may ways their kids have fit in 10-15 APs. Sigh.

Here is the thing... For some kids those classes are not hard at all. I've been a parent for a while now and many times I have met parents complaining how hard some class is while other parents say their kids are barely studying and getting 100%... Some parents complain that everything is watered down and too easy and others complain that kids are studying more than ever and need a tutor for every class. These are kids taking classes together.

Some middle schoolers could take 2-3 AP exams each summer. Now you will say - summer is for fun, they are not supposed to... but some of them want to, and can do it without some insane level of effort.

+1

Find the level right for your kid. For some, it is all the difficult classes then ivies and it still is not risking their mental well being—in fact they thrive

I don't know about the intense ramp up as kid driven. The kids we know who were doing extra APs etc were all driven by parents (magnet school).

In the private schools near us, AP entrance is mostly by teachers who do the approval. But when 1/3 graduate with 10+ that can be considered “normal “. Not parent driven for most, just the normal top tracks for the top cohorts, with the topmost finishing BC calc in 11th and AP physC or Chem(for a few, both) by the end of 11th. No parent pushing, just part of the accepted top path.
What has been fascinating is to learn this path is not common outside of top US high schools yet is very very common for international students from India and china. The US curriculum for tippy-top US students is very common abroad

+1
I had 4 years of chemistry (including 3 years of organic chemistry) in HS. In my country, you needed this if you wanted to study medicine, which is a 6 year long BS degree. And people here act like AP chemistry is some kind phd level qualifying exam.

Kids here can do high level sports and run clubs and volunteer and have job and all that on top of all academics precisely because academics are not that demanding.

And yet here you are in our country, right? I assume if you thought your country’s education system was so great you would raise your kids there.

If we could take our jobs there we probably would. In any case, we did not come here for the AP classes, that's for sure.

Your birth country doesn't have doctors?

Funny you should ask. They do have doctors, and the kids might as well go study there. Very solid rank internationally (better than GWU, UMD, Georgetown), and basically free. But do I want my kid living abroad for 6 years.

Well you said "if we could take our jobs there", so from your college description it appears you and your partner are in medicine. So if the country is "so great at education" and all, why haven't you returned there to be practicing doctors?

Ironically, many who grow up in these intensely focused academic situations (India/China) have the ultimate goal of coming to the USA for college and beyond and don't want to return.]So it makes you wonder how great this education system is that pushes so much

Doctors in the US make something like 50x what doctors in our home country make. Does it all make sense to you now?

Attraction of the US is in jobs/money, not in high quality education. Which also exists, at high levels, but not typically at HS and lower levels. I mean, like TJ, Stay etc, but those are exceptions. There is nothing ironic in doing high level academics somewhere from an early age and then reap the financial payoff in the US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DC took 19. Freshman Year-1, Sophomore Year-4, Junior Year-7, Senior Year-7. He enjoyed it.

Interesting. My student only has 5 class periods.. while it’s trimesters and many classes run one or two trimesters, AP are always all three trimesters. So no way could a student amass that many AP classes

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Anonymous wrote:Some people are reporting that their kids are taking 10+, 15, and even 20 AP classes. How is this possible? I am looking at my rising 9th grader's schedule and I don't see how you can pack more than about 10 AP classes? They can only take 1 AP class in 9th grade and you can't take, say, AP Biology, from the getgo.

If you read this the college threads, it's clear the parents are fueling this insanity by putting such an overwhelming emphasis on college. And parents on here seem more focused on college admission, rather than anything that comes after.

College is just a 4-year stop in a hopefully very long life. I'm more focused on setting my kid up for what comes after college rather than getting into a selective one with an impressive logo. If they only can get to an impressive logo college by being on a treadmill where they are overwhelming their schedule with APs, competitive sports and extracurriculars and service jobs they will arrive in a state of anxiety. Their will learn that their life is about impressing people and striving/chasing for the next "impressive goal". They'll assume achieving their high goals equates to happiness and will wonder when they get there why they aren't happy. Why they still feel anxiety and depression and constantly compare themselves to their equally high strung peers.

If it seems crazy to you for a kid fit in 10 APs between sophamore and senior years it is because it is crazy and shouldn't happen outside of some exceptional cases where the kid is very gifted and would not be challenged by regular level classes. But instead we have an arms race of crazed parents leading their kids into a crazed cycle of anxiety and comparison. And I've already seen parents on this thread reply with the may ways their kids have fit in 10-15 APs. Sigh.

Here is the thing... For some kids those classes are not hard at all. I've been a parent for a while now and many times I have met parents complaining how hard some class is while other parents say their kids are barely studying and getting 100%... Some parents complain that everything is watered down and too easy and others complain that kids are studying more than ever and need a tutor for every class. These are kids taking classes together.

Some middle schoolers could take 2-3 AP exams each summer. Now you will say - summer is for fun, they are not supposed to... but some of them want to, and can do it without some insane level of effort.

+1

Find the level right for your kid. For some, it is all the difficult classes then ivies and it still is not risking their mental well being—in fact they thrive

I don't know about the intense ramp up as kid driven. The kids we know who were doing extra APs etc were all driven by parents (magnet school).

In the private schools near us, AP entrance is mostly by teachers who do the approval. But when 1/3 graduate with 10+ that can be considered “normal “. Not parent driven for most, just the normal top tracks for the top cohorts, with the topmost finishing BC calc in 11th and AP physC or Chem(for a few, both) by the end of 11th. No parent pushing, just part of the accepted top path.
What has been fascinating is to learn this path is not common outside of top US high schools yet is very very common for international students from India and china. The US curriculum for tippy-top US students is very common abroad

+1
I had 4 years of chemistry (including 3 years of organic chemistry) in HS. In my country, you needed this if you wanted to study medicine, which is a 6 year long BS degree. And people here act like AP chemistry is some kind phd level qualifying exam.

Kids here can do high level sports and run clubs and volunteer and have job and all that on top of all academics precisely because academics are not that demanding.

What country?

What happens if someone in your country if they decide to pursue in a career in medicine, but they are already 14 years old and out missed the first year of chemistry?

Do your doctors also take 4 years of Biology class in high school?

Yes, typically 4 years of biology as well. It's a little more complicated because you don't choose courses in HS but you choose the type of HS when you start (humanities oriented vs. science oriented). Most HSs are for trades, though.

In any case, there is an entrance exam for medicine - biology and chemistry. You need to do well on these tests to be accepted. What you had in high school is not critical by itself (e.g. you can theoretically get in from humanities HS or even from a 4 year trade school - not sure) but you are unlikely to do well on the exam if you didn't have chemistry and biology for four years.

And you honestly think that is the best path for future doctors and teens?!?!?! To be academically tracked by age 12/13 ? to not be able to switch? And to be under so much pressure as a 12 yo+?

IMO I'd prefer kids enjoy learning and be able to be well rounded. Band, orchestra, photography, theater, along with solid English, FL, History, Psychology and the STEM courses. College is the time to focus/narrow path, not at age 12. I'd also like a "late bloomer" to be able to find there way to something other than trades or humanity if they so desire at age 15/18.

Yes. The pressure is not much, honestly. By that age it's clearly who will and who won't benefit from a rigorous program. Me and my friends never felt very stressed academically at the most rigorous program. I mean, it wasn't easy, but nothing outrageous. And we didn't have to volunteer and run clubs and play sports and all that nonsense so that we can impress someone reading our 50 page long applications. It was clear what you need to learn to get to college you want and that was it. You finish HS (senior year is like very other year), then take entrance exams in 2-3 days and that's it. This unpredictable maze of obscure requirements is infinitely more stressful.