Dinner party in Europe: Americans look older, more tired, are more unhealthy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m your typical American striver. When I visit European friends I feel uninspired and kind of depressed. They all live very basic lives and have no desire to achieve anything or better their existence. It’s like every single person is a dull government worker. Their counterparts here are high earning and working for impressive startups or world renown companies. The Europeans don’t seem to really aspire to do much or accomplish much and their GDP and lack of innovation is reflective of this mindset.

Wrong. The most competitive economies are in european countries.
atista.com/chart/30231/the-worlds-most-competitive-economies/#:~:text=Denmark%2C%20Ireland%20and%20Switzerland%20have,Development%20(IMD)%20on%20Tuesday.

[Anonymous]

Your link doesn't work. I found this:
https://www.visualcapitalist.com/cp/competitive-countries-rankings/
US ranks #2 in competitivity for countries with a population greater than 20 million.

Inferring from the other ratings, Taiwan would be #1 in this category, but it has a population of just 23 million.

That would put the US at #1 for countries with a population over 25 million.

I couldn't find the exact inputs, but I assume that the US gets dinged for not having universal health care and possibly low K-12 student achievement scores in these types of ratings.

[Anonymous]

As an aging Gen Xer who manages teams of American Zoomers, they are all either jacked/hot or obese. Very little middle ground.

International teams I work with have much more of a spectrum with a lot more average people.

[Anonymous]

Honestly I think it’s just genetics. I’m a Swede and live in America. Yesterday I had a doctor appt about my pms becoming worse, and after I left, the doctor (who was subbing for my regular) rang me up and said she just noticed on my chart that I was 48 (and she thought I was much younger) and my issues were likely peri menopausal. She said it didn’t even occur to her, because I looked so young. I’m European living in America, and apparently I still look young.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These were friends of friends who live in Europe. They were French, German, Portuguese, and Swedish. Most people were 55+. They were decently well-off but not rich. Many were already retired.

Throughout the whole night, nobody compulsively looked at their phones. The only phone use was to take pictures and play music.
Not a single person was overweight.
Everyone looked 10-20 years younger. And yes one of them smoked, they all drank, they all spent time in the sun.
Everyone was vibrant and happy.
Everyone had so much energy and positivity, much more than 30-40something Americans. Nobody was tired.
Nobody complained of ailments or back problems or excessive medications.

I asked how everyone lived so well and looked so great. They said it was because they had universal healthcare, less stress, great food, and didnt feel beaten down by work throughout their lives.

America is doing it wrong.

Did these Europeans live in the US at some point? I don’t know any European that would mention universal healthcare as a reason for their wellbeing UNLESS they live or lived in a place where that isn’t the case.

Visited, but not lived. The mutual American friends had left the US because of the healthcare system.

Also worth mentioning: they ate sweets, but not excessively. Nobody even mentioned anything about weight or dieting.
Also absent from any dinnertime discussion was work. I couldn’t tell you what everyone did or used to do for a living. Nobody talked about Covid, money, or other people’s expectations.
They also minimally discussed politics, only to make fun of Trump and the idea that Americans could elect him to serve office from jail or something like that, and they mentioned that their own governments weren’t perfect but nobody wanted a U.S.-type system.

There are things with their lifestyle that would appeal to the political left and right. As I said, the emphasis on health and well-being over work was the main reason why everyone was so energetic and healthy and happy. Healthcare, vacation time, and fewer work hours contribute to this. But the other thing was more family-oriented culture and less obsession with identity and gender. Women were happily feminine in their own way and men were happily masculine in their own way. Nobody was complaining about The Patriarchy or sexism, they also weren’t bigoted either, just normal and not in a bind about everything.

It’s a small representative size and yes I have traveled in Europe many times before, mostly before the pandemic. But this was an interesting case where multiple people, older people, from different countries shared their experiences “in the wild” not in a tourism setting. My takeaway is that American-style capitalism, private healthcare, high fructose corn syrup and processed foods, and stress are more detrimental to our health than anything else. This is a sick country and we are doing so much wrong that it’s a complete farce to say we’re the best.
That, and there’s this overall trend in raising age of retirement, especially the actual age where retirement is feasible for most people, and lowering life expectancy, it’s like the nest egg and golden years are all a scam to make you work harder and enjoy life less.

So you went to a party and suddenly have become an expert on cultural differences between countries? Why are you so focused on this? Take your own advice and chill out.

Yeah. I'm skeptical at Americans who left the US for healthcare reasons. For all the moaning and complaining about American health care, some of it deserved, anyone with a decent job has access to good healthcare, at a minimum, it will be as good as any national healthcare service in a EU country. And the national healthcares of Europe aren't without their problems. Whenever I hear "so and so left the US to avoid American health care" I think a purple haired NYT progressive who is making up excuses that have nothing to do with reality.

I’m dual canadian/American and plan to leave once I retire, for healthcare reasons. It happens.

[Anonymous]

Socialism…no thanks!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly I think it’s just genetics. I’m a Swede and live in America. Yesterday I had a doctor appt about my pms becoming worse, and after I left, the doctor (who was subbing for my regular) rang me up and said she just noticed on my chart that I was 48 (and she thought I was much younger) and my issues were likely peri menopausal. She said it didn’t even occur to her, because I looked so young. I’m European living in America, and apparently I still look young.

Blah blah

I’m a 53-year old American (ethnicity Irish-Sicilian). I had the same thing occur…and I’m not even in perimenopause yet.

My BP was 98/66. I exercise 6 days per week, olive skin, no wrinkles (naturally).

Fwiw, fair Northern Europeans usually age worse because of their lack of melanin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I lose weight effortlessly whenever I visit family there, and I sleep better. When I visit, I eat far more than I do when in the US, I eat later than when in the US, I drink more, and I exercise less. Yet I lose weight.

I am convinced that RoundUp or one of the other pesticides that we allow in the US that aren’t allowed in Europe is killing off our healthy gut bacteria.

I agree. The chemical lobby and our effed up political system that prioritizes profits allows forever chemicals, RoundUp (my dumbass neighbors still walk around their property with a backpack of this stuff frequently), and other chemicals to be used. U.S. women's breastmilk has much more of a chemical burden than European women's. Many of these chemicals and microplastics have an estrogenic effect, (obesogens) impacting weight, puberty, cancer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These were friends of friends who live in Europe. They were French, German, Portuguese, and Swedish. Most people were 55+. They were decently well-off but not rich. Many were already retired.

Throughout the whole night, nobody compulsively looked at their phones. The only phone use was to take pictures and play music.
Not a single person was overweight.
Everyone looked 10-20 years younger. And yes one of them smoked, they all drank, they all spent time in the sun.
Everyone was vibrant and happy.
Everyone had so much energy and positivity, much more than 30-40something Americans. Nobody was tired.
Nobody complained of ailments or back problems or excessive medications.

I asked how everyone lived so well and looked so great. They said it was because they had universal healthcare, less stress, great food, and didnt feel beaten down by work throughout their lives.

America is doing it wrong.

That explains why the US is the leader of the free world with the most powerful armed forces and the most dominant economy and the source of the most trusted currency in the world.

Sure, let Europe relax while we fight their wars and protect their freedoms.

LOL you sound five years old. Just like Trump.

[Anonymous]

Europeans are also relaxed from taking August off every year, plus two additional weeks during the year. Like sane, mentally healthy people should do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Cheerios in the states contain chemicals not permitted in Cheerios in Europe.

Which chemicals?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I lose weight effortlessly whenever I visit family there, and I sleep better. When I visit, I eat far more than I do when in the US, I eat later than when in the US, I drink more, and I exercise less. Yet I lose weight.

I am convinced that RoundUp or one of the other pesticides that we allow in the US that aren’t allowed in Europe is killing off our healthy gut bacteria.

Isn’t this also the “vacation effect” (less stress), plus walking more? I’m originally from Europe, live in DC and have been in France on vacation for last three weeks and I’m pretty sure I’ve gained some weight.

I exercise more in the US. I measure steps and calories and while I do walk more in Europe, it’s not by much. I bike commute regularly in the US (with hills) and I don’t do that at all when in Europe. So, I eat more, exercise less, yet lose weight.

As for stress, it’s visiting family, which has its own stress haha.

So you walk more, and bike less, when you go to Europe. This could easily be the difference in calorie burn since one of these exercises is weight bearing. Bike commuting hardly burns any calories, despite your "hills".

I always lose weight when I'm on vacation, go to conferences, etc, regardless of what city I travel to. It's because I am not confined to a desk for much of my day, I'm not stress eating, I sleep better, etc.

Why did you put hills in snarky quotes? Why do you need to assume I’m lying?

I am a regular and extensive biker and I live on the west coast. When I say hills, I mean west coast hill climbing hills. I know the precise elevation. I don’t mean DCs slightly elevated bridges. I arrive from my bike commute drenched in sweat and shower at work.

The fact is, I exercise more and longer in the US. Sorry that bothers you so much. I hate people who are so bound to US exceptionalism that they cannot see or admit how poisoned our food supply is, how cancerous pesticides are allowed that aren’t allowed elsewhere.

Here’s another fact you will try to disbelieve because America rah rah or whatever: pizza in the US makes me solidly ill. Idk whether it’s the cheese, the bread, or what. Even high-end, fancy wood burning stove pizza. But I can visit family in Italy and eat pizza every day and never once feel even a twinge of illness.

I am sure you are going to tell me that is “stress.”

Thank you for this post. I also wondered about the random quotes around the word hills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These were friends of friends who live in Europe. They were French, German, Portuguese, and Swedish. Most people were 55+. They were decently well-off but not rich. Many were already retired.

Throughout the whole night, nobody compulsively looked at their phones. The only phone use was to take pictures and play music.
Not a single person was overweight.
Everyone looked 10-20 years younger. And yes one of them smoked, they all drank, they all spent time in the sun.
Everyone was vibrant and happy.
Everyone had so much energy and positivity, much more than 30-40something Americans. Nobody was tired.
Nobody complained of ailments or back problems or excessive medications.

I asked how everyone lived so well and looked so great. They said it was because they had universal healthcare, less stress, great food, and didnt feel beaten down by work throughout their lives.

America is doing it wrong.

Did these Europeans live in the US at some point? I don’t know any European that would mention universal healthcare as a reason for their wellbeing UNLESS they live or lived in a place where that isn’t the case.

Visited, but not lived. The mutual American friends had left the US because of the healthcare system.

Also worth mentioning: they ate sweets, but not excessively. Nobody even mentioned anything about weight or dieting.
Also absent from any dinnertime discussion was work. I couldn’t tell you what everyone did or used to do for a living. Nobody talked about Covid, money, or other people’s expectations.
They also minimally discussed politics, only to make fun of Trump and the idea that Americans could elect him to serve office from jail or something like that, and they mentioned that their own governments weren’t perfect but nobody wanted a U.S.-type system.

There are things with their lifestyle that would appeal to the political left and right. As I said, the emphasis on health and well-being over work was the main reason why everyone was so energetic and healthy and happy. Healthcare, vacation time, and fewer work hours contribute to this. But the other thing was more family-oriented culture and less obsession with identity and gender. Women were happily feminine in their own way and men were happily masculine in their own way. Nobody was complaining about The Patriarchy or sexism, they also weren’t bigoted either, just normal and not in a bind about everything.

It’s a small representative size and yes I have traveled in Europe many times before, mostly before the pandemic. But this was an interesting case where multiple people, older people, from different countries shared their experiences “in the wild” not in a tourism setting. My takeaway is that American-style capitalism, private healthcare, high fructose corn syrup and processed foods, and stress are more detrimental to our health than anything else. This is a sick country and we are doing so much wrong that it’s a complete farce to say we’re the best.
That, and there’s this overall trend in raising age of retirement, especially the actual age where retirement is feasible for most people, and lowering life expectancy, it’s like the nest egg and golden years are all a scam to make you work harder and enjoy life less.

The work focus is also extreme in this area. In Colorado no one talks about work at dinner or socially. Come to think of it, they all look better than people here too.

CO is about mountain people. They talk about their outdoorsy mountain times. It's cool for about 10 min if you are not into it. I've been there. There was a sporty crowd that literally talked about their marathon training, daily runs and diff trails they take, and their dogs. It bored me to tears

You’ll have all the time in the world to sit in front of a computer, TV, or a tablet when you are 75 years old and can’t move well enough to run a marathon, go for a daily run, check out a trail, or be outside with your dog. By that point, you might regret actually being active when you could do so.

People in Colorado don't stop at 75. The grandparents all look great. Incredibly healthy lifestyle.

[Anonymous]

I am half European and visit every year. You can't underestimate the positive benefits of having a 4-week annual vacation, which most European countries have codified into law. Here we're lucky to get 2 weeks and are made to feel guilty if we take it or take it in a large block.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's because Americans actually work while Europeans are lazy bums constantly on vacation or only work 5 hours per day.

Look, if you like being medicore with a safety net, that's fine, go live in Europe. Their salaries SUCK. If you like working hard and earnings lots of money while being able to personally control a lot more of your money, then no where is better than America.

Food quality is very poor in the US. I'll give you that.

But this does wonders for mental health and appearance. I don't want to work hard, I want to have an easy life and look good. Life is too short.