Where do the kids who used to feed into the Ivy League go now?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don’t think Williams & Amherst belong in the “where Ivy rejects go category.” They have always been considered on par with even the best Ivies.

Not anymore they aren't.

Agree with the opinion that Williams & Amherst are no longer considered Ivy equivalents regarding prestige. Excellent academics, but the first impression often is that the student is highly intelligent but, for some reason, didn't get any offer from an Ivy League school. Silly, but that seems to be a common reaction today.

Wildly inaccurate. Same kids who apply to Dartmouth also apply to Williams. People are not applying to Penn and also Bowdoin.

I realize there are kids - mostly immigrant or first gen - who apply to all the ivies because the only thing they know or care about is saying “my kid got into an Ivy”.

But vast majority of people have a more educated view and care about where they’ll thrive and not that your mom’s great aunt who’s never heard of Pomona thinks.

+1

-1 legacies are just as invested in getting their kid into ivies.

They're just as invested in getting their DC into a good school. BUT as a PP said, they're too sophisticated to let their kids "shotgun" all the ivies. 1. It's a bad strategy and 2. There are many better schools than the "lower" ivies - why waste an application there when it may be easier to get into a better school?

[Anonymous]

^ should have when the odds are better of getting into a better school... they are ALL hard to get into.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Here's a really specific answer for OP, based on the 19-21-year0old children of friends, <--- ALL of whom graduated from an Ivy undergrad in the 80s:

Rice
Tufts
Wash U
UCLA
Vanderbilt
U. Chicago
Brown
Amherst
Lafayette

This list is in line with my experience. Also:

Williams
Bowdoin
Duke
NYU
BC
Georgetown
Colby
Davidson

+1

And Michigan.

Even in the 1970s, Michigan was a landing spot for Ivy rejects.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:What schools are accepting a high percentage of the population that used to feed the Ivy League back in the 90s? UMC, private prep-school or top suburban public, high SAT/ACT scores

So much has changed over the past 30 years. But what hasn't been mentioned much is what students want to major in these days. In the 90s, there were tons of bright kids majoring in subjects like English, History, and Political Science who went on to have successful careers.

That's not the case anymore. The smart kids today tend to want to study biology, engineering, computer science, economics, IT and other more difficult majors. 30 years ago they may have applied to Ivies, but these days schools like Rice, Harvey Mudd, Georgia Tech, CMU, Michigan, and Berkeley - not to mention MIT, Stanford, and CalTech - are getting the best and brightest. For students that are not quite as STEM focused, schools such as Vanderbilt, Duke, UCLA, Northwestern, and Georgetown are all getting very smart kids.

Also, given the cost of college these days, there are many really smart students in the honors programs at their state flagship schools. Many of those public schools are better than the Ivies anyway in the STEM majors.

It's a completely different landscape out there. As for the SLACs, I'm sure Williams, Amherst, Bowdoin, Pomona and a few others will continue to attract smart kids. But given the demographics of the US - the number of 18 year olds will steadily decline in the years ahead - and given the STEMy inclination of students today, I suspect SLACs below the top ten will soon have a hard time attracting bright kids.

Gatech, Mich, Berkeley, and UCLA are not getting the smartest kids. You can look at the test scores to clearly see that.

What test scores do you speak of in terms of Berkeley and UCLA since standardized tests are no longer required. The same goes for Caltech for the past few years.

I'm sure the test scores from 2019 for UCLA and Gatech wouldn't be that different than today. Don't be facetious. UCLAs 25th percentile was 1260 just a few years ago. Hardly the smartest students. And yes test scores tell you who.the smartest kids are.GPA surely doesn't .

But you said the smartest kids. The smartest students are calculated at the 75th percentile at all schools. In sheer numbers, the top publics will have as many, if not more, than most elite privates. Furthermore, SAT scores like the one you quoted from 2019, are at least 3 years out of date. Scores are up at most of the top schools on that time.

You're as strong as your weakest links.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Michigan scores 25/75 SAT 1340-1530

25% of the class averages above a 1530. With an entering freshman class of a proud 7,000, that’s approximately 1750 very high scoring students. They might not the highest average of “smartest” students, but they seem to have more of them than most of the elites.

Only 3,829 (54%) submitted SAT scores (you need to read the whole chart), so it is actually 957 students.
Of course, only 55% of Harvard admits submitted SAT scores, so with their 50th percentile about the same as Michigan's 75th, you have 451 students at Harvard in the same range.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Other than maybe Michigan, these are Ivy level schools whether DCUM wants to admit it or not”

You might want to do a little more research on Michigan if you think it can’t keep up with Emory & Tufts.

I've done my research and not impressed. Also Tufts was not mentioned by me at least.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Michigan scores 25/75 SAT 1340-1530

25% of the class averages above a 1530. With an entering freshman class of a proud 7,000, that’s approximately 1750 very high scoring students. They might not the highest average of “smartest” students, but they seem to have more of them than most of the elites.

Only 3,829 (54%) submitted SAT scores (you need to read the whole chart), so it is actually 957 students.
Of course, only 55% of Harvard admits submitted SAT scores, so with their 50th percentile about the same as Michigan's 75th, you have 451 students at Harvard in the same range.

I imagine the majority of the rest submitted comparable ACT scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ha Funny met a couple who were both Ivy, their kid went to James Madison but is in law school now (top 40-50ish law school)--won't name to protect identity.

I hope that kid has a huge trust waiting for them

[Anonymous]

Chicago, Emory, Duke, Vanderbilt and WUSTL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Michigan scores 25/75 SAT 1340-1530

25% of the class averages above a 1530. With an entering freshman class of a proud 7,000, that’s approximately 1750 very high scoring students. They might not the highest average of “smartest” students, but they seem to have more of them than most of the elites.

Only 3,829 (54%) submitted SAT scores (you need to read the whole chart), so it is actually 957 students.
Of course, only 55% of Harvard admits submitted SAT scores, so with their 50th percentile about the same as Michigan's 75th, you have 451 students at Harvard in the same range.

I imagine the majority of the rest submitted comparable ACT scores.

That’s equally true of both schools, though, so it works out the same: there are twice as many high-scoring students at Michigan.

[Anonymous]

the exact same places they used to go

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I went to a public college with low tuition and then a top 3 med school. At the time, I did not think undergrad mattered much. My opinion remains unchanged.

Why do you think anyone would GAF about your completely irrelevant opinion?

NP here. You seem to think we GAF about yours. We don't.

Yeah, I know not to post irrelevant, off-topic opinions.

We all need to be a lot better about reporting you. You’re a bad person and contribute no value.

LOL. I’m not a “bad person” for calling out someone’s off-topic post.

It was actually on topic, giving an example of getting a deal on tuition and not caring about a handful of elite colleges, which has been reinforced by many other posts.

Your inability to realize that and abrasive attitude are what make you a bad person.

“Bad person”? Are you five?

No, it was off-topic.

Here is the topic:
“ What schools are accepting a high percentage of the population that used to feed the Ivy League back in the 90s? ”

Nothing about the tuition or perceived value of attending an Ivy League. PP should go start a new thread to share their special opinion and you can +1 them all you want.

Your selective outrage at this one post is bizarre when I could point out a few dozen that are much more off topic in this thread alone. Your persistence in arguing about it makes this even more strange.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Students who apply to Penn are not applying to Williams or Swarthmore, either.

Dartmouth is an outlier among the ivies because it is more like a SLAC than any other ivy, so some students would consider Dartmouth and say Williams (although probably not many since the culture is so different).

Also, many kids from educated families at my kids’ mcps public HS applied to a swath of ivies without focus on fit/culture at each, and just waited to see where they got in.

How is Dartmouth, an R1 research university with half of its 13,500 students in graduate programs, like an SLAC?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Case Western
GA Tech
Vassar
Oberlin
Northwestern
Spelman
Howard
Purdue
Carnegie Mellon

No one is going to Oberlin. No one. And Howard is not even close to VA Tech. No one would trade down just for HB

You clearly do not know anyone who is Black. Anyone.

DP: pls drop the casual racism, and discuss the topic if you can.

We should all be reporting insulting comments like this. All of us who let belittling comments like this stay up have some responsibility for them.

+1

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Students who apply to Penn are not applying to Williams or Swarthmore, either.

Dartmouth is an outlier among the ivies because it is more like a SLAC than any other ivy, so some students would consider Dartmouth and say Williams (although probably not many since the culture is so different).

Also, many kids from educated families at my kids’ mcps public HS applied to a swath of ivies without focus on fit/culture at each, and just waited to see where they got in.

How is Dartmouth, an R1 research university with half of its 13,500 students in graduate programs, like an SLAC?

Dartmouth College does not have 13,500 students enrolled.

Dartmouth College has a total of about 6,761 students including both undergrads (4,556) and grad (2,205) students.