Can you be a native of America/United States of America if you are not Native American?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

OMG your reading comprehension is so poor and your knowledge of US history is apparently non-existent. The US didn't annex most territories by fighting wars. The country signed legal agreements with sovereign nations that believed they were negotiating in good faith. The Senate ratified the treaties and the President signed them. This isn't a "winners vs losers" issue. This is "the United States government is refusing to pay its legal debts and honor its promises" issue. If you are a citizen of the US, this is actually your problem.

Well, if the Indian nations thought they could make the US government do what they wanted, they would use their power (military, financial, etc.) to force it. But they can't, because they cannot win a war against the US.

Many went in with the French and lost and it then only became a matter of time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

OMG your reading comprehension is so poor and your knowledge of US history is apparently non-existent. The US didn't annex most territories by fighting wars. The country signed legal agreements with sovereign nations that believed they were negotiating in good faith. The Senate ratified the treaties and the President signed them. This isn't a "winners vs losers" issue. This is "the United States government is refusing to pay its legal debts and honor its promises" issue. If you are a citizen of the US, this is actually your problem.

Well, if the Indian nations thought they could make the US government do what they wanted, they would use their power (military, financial, etc.) to force it. But they can't, because they cannot win a war against the US.

Jokes on you, Supreme Court gave control of half of Oklahoma back to the tribes two years ago. OK's idiot governor is now trying to get the SC to overturn themselves because the tribes are doing everything they can to *@&( the state's @(!!^& up.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/19pdf/18-9526_9okb.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I live in an area with a large First Nations population and have many friends who are Native American.

And shocker, they’re not a monolith. Some use the term Indian, some Native, some Indigenous. Many of my friends would be uncomfortable with me describing myself as native since I’m of European descent. My H is of Aztec descent and he’d definitely have a strong opinion if I called myself native. So I don’t use the word in that way because it’s easy for me to not say the word in order for others to be more comfortable.

I just really don’t get why there are non-indigenous people who suddenly get butthurt over not being able to describe themselves as native. It’s just a word, who cares? Like how often are you going around telling people you’re native? It’s Like the whole thing with Lizzo, or the little mermaid. White dudes literally care nothing about a historical flute or a cartoon mermaid, or the word “native”, until someone who looks different enters that space, and now all of a sudden they feel something was stolen from them.

If letting another group of people use that word gives them a sense of identity and pride, why argue? It has literally zero impact on your life.

The irony here, of course, is that someone of Aztec heritage is not "native" to the US either.

[Anonymous]

What is this thread proposing? Like what is your point? Is it that everyone who was not here prior to the Jamestown Colony or whatever date when European settles showed up should up simply take a 23andme test and go to wherever their dna tells them their originally from? I don’t get all the handwringing and agonizing from the last few years. We have a fked up history. But so does every country in the world. I mean do we feel bad for the Babylonians who were conquered by Cyrus the Great in 539 BC? Should we ask if whoever is living where that battle took place to move somewhere else because they stole the land? Where does this end? Everything that identity politics touched seems to lead to increased Balkanization.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

[Anonymous]

For correct land acknowledgment, here is an excellent and useful starting point for knowing which stolen land you currently occupy:

https://www.npr.org/2022/10/10/1127837659/native-land-map-ancestral-tribal-lands-worldwide

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

And that's not childish?

SMH

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

Yea, no, I want to live in the USA with democracy and excellent economy, not 500 tribal government territories.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

Keep dreaming the impossible dream. They are never getting "their" land back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

Keep dreaming the impossible dream. They are never getting "their" land back.

Ok, then just pay for it—outright, or rent. The boundaries of many territories are clearly mapped and the tribal governments have been in continuous existence since the agreements were signed, so it’s not impossible to figure out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

Who is "we?" Well-off liberals?

OK, so we give the land back to the tribes. Then what? Do the rest of us live on it like renters or serfs? Do they have to collect the taxes and run the local governments?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My ancestors once owned most of Europe and then got pushed to the edge of the North Atlantic and dominated by England for 1500 years. I seek to know what they did wrong.

That’s probably irrelevant, but if you are a citizen of a country like the UK, which still has colonies, or the US, which is currently violating treaties with tribal governments, you are—as a current citizen of a democratic government—responsible for what *your* country is doing *now* and to address prior wrongs of the country you are a citizen of. You can’t inherit guilt but you do inherit the responsibilities of your country.

I think I have learned that rule number one in human history is don’t lose wars.

You didn't already know that?

I figured it out when I was 3 or 4 and dealing with siblings and classmates.

To the victor go the spoils. I guess people these days want to enjoy the spoils but just don't want the losers to feel bad about it. But, the former have no intention of ever giving up the spoils.

People like Americans and the Brits have the luxury of crying crocodile tears about what our ancestors did because we've typically been on the winning side of history.

Sure, some people will do self-flagellating land acknowledgments and other similar meaningless stuff. But, no, we're not giving American Indians our. That's not how the grown up world works.

So the 523 federally recognized tribes in the US are….not grown-ups? Very white supremacist of you.

The ones who want the colonizers to go home sound pretty childish.

Your viewing this through the wrong lens.

Land-back is not about the colonizers “going home.” It’s about the colonizers giving the land back to its rightful historical heirs - the indigenous peoples of the so-called US. That’s why we have collectively pivoted to Indigenous Peoples day.

Yea, no, I want to live in the USA with democracy and excellent economy, not 500 tribal government territories.

Why not? It works well in Afghanistan.