Swim Team Volunteering - it helps if you are nice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current gen are annoyed they can't pay people to do the work volunteers used to do. Hilarious how they want to outsource every aspect of their life...can't grill, gotta have food trucks. Can't time, need ot hire teenagers or off suty life guards. Heck they try to use on duty life guards as baby sitters.

Also, there is no need for 3 timers for 6 year olds swimming.

This, and I think it's one of the reasons kids sports in general are dying out. No one wants to be involved or make a commitment any more.

Just an observation from a non-swimmer parent...I swam growing up- wasn't particularly good, though placed in the top 5 in a few high school events- but even in our competitive summer swim league, we didn't have 3 timers per lane. You got one and you lived with the time they clocked for you. It's been fascinating reading these swim threads.

Did you have touch pads though? High schools when I grew up had a touch pad and one timer as a backup. Most summer pools rely solely on timers, and that's why there are 3.

No, our summer league pools didn’t have touch pads- they had ONE mom or dad holding a stop watch.

I don't know if rules have changed but I'm pretty sure at least two are currently required in order for the time to "count" for placing at A meets, individual standings, etc. Of course this is irrelevant for most 6 year olds, but some are really fast. You can't just randomly change the policies for the 6 and under heats because 1) you never know if a 6 year old will have a fast swim that needs to "count", and 2) the heats before and after will need 2-3 timers per lane anyway.

Swimming has always required a high level of parent commitment. I remember the signup posters at my pool growing up in the 80s and 90s (ah, the good old pre-Internet days). It takes a lot of people to run a swim meet and there are a lot of them in a short season. Honestly if you can't commit to helping out you shouldn't sign your kids up for summer swim. I know plenty of parents who don't because they are realistic about their time while working full time. There are plenty of other activities that don't require so much from parents.

I hear you and agree that if 3 timers are required, you can't go rogue and only have one. But, does anyone get a college scholarship from swimming summer league? Serious question as my kids are not on swim team (as you said, we could never do it due to being a two working parent family). Do the times/standings ever impact anything beyond the end of July?

Very interesting that you think that kids sports are only of value if you can get a college scholarship. But yes, you can.
https://www.mynvsl.com/hall-of-fame

"But yes, you can" what? Great, a handful of swimmers out of thousands got a small amount of $ from their summer swim league.

Are you the same poster who starts threads about how travel sports should only be for kids guaranteed to get a college scholarship (as if there’s any way to determine that ahead of time)? Maybe just stop posting on a sports forum because you are obviously clueless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Our swim team was like this too. Parents did not warm to us because be daughter showed up and could swim. She was a threat. Swimming is not my daughter’s main sport so I just kind of laughed.

LOL

You all laugh but I could totally see one of the moms on my kid’s team acting like this. I have kids the same age as her girls and I’m so thankful I have two boys so I don’t have to deal with it.

Most would love to get anther fast kid on their team. Even at the same age, it improves the relay.

I mean yeah this is how normal people think. But an ultra competitive mom sees it as a threat to her children’s top spot on the ladder.

This sounds like misogynist hot nonsense to me. Or jealousy on your part.

Found the threatened mom!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Three timers make the job easier for those that have to enter the times into the computer (which is a really tedious job)...you can then take the middle time.

Stop trying to explain things to people who just want to whine. It’s pointless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

Go ahead and share your league so people can join it and be happier with the rules. You completely missed the point. Your pool/team (these people you claim their persona is swim team) can’t change it. Your team rep can’t freaking change how many timers there are!!! Feel free to “express your new ideas” but please do it as feedback to the league, not your reps/volunteers at your pool. They can’t change league rules and you’re just whining then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

Go ahead and share your league so people can join it and be happier with the rules. You completely missed the point. Your pool/team (these people you claim their persona is swim team) can’t change it. Your team rep can’t freaking change how many timers there are!!! Feel free to “express your new ideas” but please do it as feedback to the league, not your reps/volunteers at your pool. They can’t change league rules and you’re just whining then.

For B meets you can absolutely split the jobs by half, our MCSL team does that for pretty much every job. B meets are often twice as long as A meets. Heck, if someone didn't renew their S&T and we need someone, it's fine for a B meet. Not much flexibility on A meets, though, you have to follow league rules or not participate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current gen are annoyed they can't pay people to do the work volunteers used to do. Hilarious how they want to outsource every aspect of their life...can't grill, gotta have food trucks. Can't time, need ot hire teenagers or off suty life guards. Heck they try to use on duty life guards as baby sitters.

Also, there is no need for 3 timers for 6 year olds swimming.

This, and I think it's one of the reasons kids sports in general are dying out. No one wants to be involved or make a commitment any more.

Just an observation from a non-swimmer parent...I swam growing up- wasn't particularly good, though placed in the top 5 in a few high school events- but even in our competitive summer swim league, we didn't have 3 timers per lane. You got one and you lived with the time they clocked for you. It's been fascinating reading these swim threads.

Did you have touch pads though? High schools when I grew up had a touch pad and one timer as a backup. Most summer pools rely solely on timers, and that's why there are 3.

No, our summer league pools didn’t have touch pads- they had ONE mom or dad holding a stop watch.

I don't know if rules have changed but I'm pretty sure at least two are currently required in order for the time to "count" for placing at A meets, individual standings, etc. Of course this is irrelevant for most 6 year olds, but some are really fast. You can't just randomly change the policies for the 6 and under heats because 1) you never know if a 6 year old will have a fast swim that needs to "count", and 2) the heats before and after will need 2-3 timers per lane anyway.

Swimming has always required a high level of parent commitment. I remember the signup posters at my pool growing up in the 80s and 90s (ah, the good old pre-Internet days). It takes a lot of people to run a swim meet and there are a lot of them in a short season. Honestly if you can't commit to helping out you shouldn't sign your kids up for summer swim. I know plenty of parents who don't because they are realistic about their time while working full time. There are plenty of other activities that don't require so much from parents.

I hear you and agree that if 3 timers are required, you can't go rogue and only have one. But, does anyone get a college scholarship from swimming summer league? Serious question as my kids are not on swim team (as you said, we could never do it due to being a two working parent family). Do the times/standings ever impact anything beyond the end of July?

No, they don’t, but parents in this area like to act like summer rec swim is the equivalent of the Olympics or something. I actually find the summer swim parents worse than my kid’s club parents. The kids that swim in college do so based on their results in club meets, not based on summer swim results. There are good club swimmers that swim for their summer teams, although on our summer team the top club kids seem to stop summer swim once they hit 13-14.

The problem is these leagues (and many of the teams) are run by parents who have year-round swimmers. All of the timing rules, stroke and turn, refereeing etc. benefit year round swimmers and those parents want to keep it that way.

How do ref and stroke and turn judges only benefit year round swimmers? In any sport there are refs. Stroke and turn are there to let kids know if they aren't doing a stroke properly. May kids start out in summer league, love swimming and go on to swim year round. Some kids may also swim in high school even if they don't do year round swim.

Apparently PP thinks they should relax the rules for summer swim. I can’t even. That’s like saying soccer rules are set up to benefit travel players and that refs should just rec soccer players use their hands. So ridiculous.

No... it's not like changing the rules so that players can use their hands. It's like acknowledging that while the MLS may have five refs on the field, it's actually OK to have just one ref do his best when a bunch of 10 year olds are playing soccer in the local rec league. And yeah, sometimes the one ref may miss an off-sides call. It's OK. It really is.
In fact - horror of horrors - I've even been to rec soccer games when an official ref didn't show up, and two parents, one from each team, just did their best to keep the game fair and moving along. It was fine.
Likewise, while super-official-college-bound-important year round swimmers may need three people timing them, perhaps it's OK if only one person times the summer league lanes and just does their best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

Go ahead and share your league so people can join it and be happier with the rules. You completely missed the point. Your pool/team (these people you claim their persona is swim team) can’t change it. Your team rep can’t freaking change how many timers there are!!! Feel free to “express your new ideas” but please do it as feedback to the league, not your reps/volunteers at your pool. They can’t change league rules and you’re just whining then.

For B meets you can absolutely split the jobs by half, our MCSL team does that for pretty much every job. B meets are often twice as long as A meets. Heck, if someone didn't renew their S&T and we need someone, it's fine for a B meet. Not much flexibility on A meets, though, you have to follow league rules or not participate.

I said they can’t change the number of timers. Please read. They can split shifts, but I’m addressing the prior post complaining they don’t need three timers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

Go ahead and share your league so people can join it and be happier with the rules. You completely missed the point. Your pool/team (these people you claim their persona is swim team) can’t change it. Your team rep can’t freaking change how many timers there are!!! Feel free to “express your new ideas” but please do it as feedback to the league, not your reps/volunteers at your pool. They can’t change league rules and you’re just whining then.

For B meets you can absolutely split the jobs by half, our MCSL team does that for pretty much every job. B meets are often twice as long as A meets. Heck, if someone didn't renew their S&T and we need someone, it's fine for a B meet. Not much flexibility on A meets, though, you have to follow league rules or not participate.

I said they can’t change the number of timers. Please read. They can split shifts, but I’m addressing the prior post complaining they don’t need three timers.

If reps don’t want to split timers into two, it’s generally because they’ve had problems getting enough volunteers, especially for the last shift of a B meet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:These posts are so weird. Everyone on our summer swim team is so nice.

Right? so unbelievable that someone might have a different experience than you. That never happens! Aren’t all pools and parents exactly the same?

[Anonymous]

My DC is only on the preteam this year so parent involvement is minimal, but I told DH I’m signing him up for manning the grill next year because that seems the most relaxed of the roles- it’s all husbands who have been instructed by their wives to volunteer and they have no personal agenda

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every year, little Larla joins swim team and mom or dad is outraged that they “aren’t run efficiently” and “three timers is ridiculous”. Please don’t join swim team then. It is a league rule almost everywhere. (Everywhere we have swam in the summer, chime in if you are in a league that doesn’t require it so these people can go there). Do not blame your reps, your pool, etc. it is not their choice. Unfortunately you can’t just decide it’s ridiculous and you’re not volunteering because you don’t think it’s necessary. Your pool has to follow the league rules or they will have no one to swim against.

We moved out to the exurbs and our league will accept times when there are only 2 timers per lane, the horror! 🙄 Meets aren’t always run efficiently, and volunteer slots aren’t apportioned appropriately. For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas. You will say feel free to step up and be a team rep, but the reality is your summer persona is based on your role with the swim team and you’ll never drop the rope. I enjoy club swim so much better than the ridiculous people that run summer swim. It’s populated by the parents of the kids that are 2nd tier club swimmers and they think this is their kid’s time to shine. Ok, rant over.

Go ahead and share your league so people can join it and be happier with the rules. You completely missed the point. Your pool/team (these people you claim their persona is swim team) can’t change it. Your team rep can’t freaking change how many timers there are!!! Feel free to “express your new ideas” but please do it as feedback to the league, not your reps/volunteers at your pool. They can’t change league rules and you’re just whining then.

For B meets you can absolutely split the jobs by half, our MCSL team does that for pretty much every job. B meets are often twice as long as A meets. Heck, if someone didn't renew their S&T and we need someone, it's fine for a B meet. Not much flexibility on A meets, though, you have to follow league rules or not participate.

I said they can’t change the number of timers. Please read. They can split shifts, but I’m addressing the prior post complaining they don’t need three timers.

Please read? The following was stated above:

"For example the large MCSL team we used to swim for wouldn’t split the meet in half for jobs like timing and clerk of course, even though we were large enough that people should only have had to volunteer for half the meet instead of the full 4-5 hours on Wednesdays, but there were always people like you with mentality of “it’s always been done this way damnit!” and an unwillingness to let others’ express ideas."

Take your own advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These posts are so weird. Everyone on our summer swim team is so nice.

Right? so unbelievable that someone might have a different experience than you. That never happens! Aren’t all pools and parents exactly the same?

My guess is that these posts are just a handful of entitled babies like you who think everyone should roll out the red carpet for them and change all the rules to suit whatever idiotic opinion you have, and that most pools are perfectly nice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current gen are annoyed they can't pay people to do the work volunteers used to do. Hilarious how they want to outsource every aspect of their life...can't grill, gotta have food trucks. Can't time, need ot hire teenagers or off suty life guards. Heck they try to use on duty life guards as baby sitters.

Also, there is no need for 3 timers for 6 year olds swimming.

This, and I think it's one of the reasons kids sports in general are dying out. No one wants to be involved or make a commitment any more.

Just an observation from a non-swimmer parent...I swam growing up- wasn't particularly good, though placed in the top 5 in a few high school events- but even in our competitive summer swim league, we didn't have 3 timers per lane. You got one and you lived with the time they clocked for you. It's been fascinating reading these swim threads.

Did you have touch pads though? High schools when I grew up had a touch pad and one timer as a backup. Most summer pools rely solely on timers, and that's why there are 3.

PP wasn’t just complaining about the number of timers. They also specifically mentioned stroke and turn as though those rules are somehow set up to benefit year round swimmers. I mean I guess they are in the sense that someone who swims more frequently is more likely to have legal strokes and turns. But to imply that those rules should somehow be relaxed so it’s more fair for summer only swimmers is ridiculous.

No, our summer league pools didn’t have touch pads- they had ONE mom or dad holding a stop watch.

I don't know if rules have changed but I'm pretty sure at least two are currently required in order for the time to "count" for placing at A meets, individual standings, etc. Of course this is irrelevant for most 6 year olds, but some are really fast. You can't just randomly change the policies for the 6 and under heats because 1) you never know if a 6 year old will have a fast swim that needs to "count", and 2) the heats before and after will need 2-3 timers per lane anyway.

Swimming has always required a high level of parent commitment. I remember the signup posters at my pool growing up in the 80s and 90s (ah, the good old pre-Internet days). It takes a lot of people to run a swim meet and there are a lot of them in a short season. Honestly if you can't commit to helping out you shouldn't sign your kids up for summer swim. I know plenty of parents who don't because they are realistic about their time while working full time. There are plenty of other activities that don't require so much from parents.

I hear you and agree that if 3 timers are required, you can't go rogue and only have one. But, does anyone get a college scholarship from swimming summer league? Serious question as my kids are not on swim team (as you said, we could never do it due to being a two working parent family). Do the times/standings ever impact anything beyond the end of July?

No, they don’t, but parents in this area like to act like summer rec swim is the equivalent of the Olympics or something. I actually find the summer swim parents worse than my kid’s club parents. The kids that swim in college do so based on their results in club meets, not based on summer swim results. There are good club swimmers that swim for their summer teams, although on our summer team the top club kids seem to stop summer swim once they hit 13-14.

The problem is these leagues (and many of the teams) are run by parents who have year-round swimmers. All of the timing rules, stroke and turn, refereeing etc. benefit year round swimmers and those parents want to keep it that way.

How do ref and stroke and turn judges only benefit year round swimmers? In any sport there are refs. Stroke and turn are there to let kids know if they aren't doing a stroke properly. May kids start out in summer league, love swimming and go on to swim year round. Some kids may also swim in high school even if they don't do year round swim.

Apparently PP thinks they should relax the rules for summer swim. I can’t even. That’s like saying soccer rules are set up to benefit travel players and that refs should just rec soccer players use their hands. So ridiculous.

No... it's not like changing the rules so that players can use their hands. It's like acknowledging that while the MLS may have five refs on the field, it's actually OK to have just one ref do his best when a bunch of 10 year olds are playing soccer in the local rec league. And yeah, sometimes the one ref may miss an off-sides call. It's OK. It really is.
In fact - horror of horrors - I've even been to rec soccer games when an official ref didn't show up, and two parents, one from each team, just did their best to keep the game fair and moving along. It was fine.
Likewise, while super-official-college-bound-important year round swimmers may need three people timing them, perhaps it's OK if only one person times the summer league lanes and just does their best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current gen are annoyed they can't pay people to do the work volunteers used to do. Hilarious how they want to outsource every aspect of their life...can't grill, gotta have food trucks. Can't time, need ot hire teenagers or off suty life guards. Heck they try to use on duty life guards as baby sitters.

Also, there is no need for 3 timers for 6 year olds swimming.

This, and I think it's one of the reasons kids sports in general are dying out. No one wants to be involved or make a commitment any more.

Just an observation from a non-swimmer parent...I swam growing up- wasn't particularly good, though placed in the top 5 in a few high school events- but even in our competitive summer swim league, we didn't have 3 timers per lane. You got one and you lived with the time they clocked for you. It's been fascinating reading these swim threads.

Did you have touch pads though? High schools when I grew up had a touch pad and one timer as a backup. Most summer pools rely solely on timers, and that's why there are 3.

PP wasn’t just complaining about the number of timers. They also specifically mentioned stroke and turn as though those rules are somehow set up to benefit year round swimmers. I mean I guess they are in the sense that someone who swims more frequently is more likely to have legal strokes and turns. But to imply that those rules should somehow be relaxed so it’s more fair for summer only swimmers is ridiculous.

No, our summer league pools didn’t have touch pads- they had ONE mom or dad holding a stop watch.

I don't know if rules have changed but I'm pretty sure at least two are currently required in order for the time to "count" for placing at A meets, individual standings, etc. Of course this is irrelevant for most 6 year olds, but some are really fast. You can't just randomly change the policies for the 6 and under heats because 1) you never know if a 6 year old will have a fast swim that needs to "count", and 2) the heats before and after will need 2-3 timers per lane anyway.

Swimming has always required a high level of parent commitment. I remember the signup posters at my pool growing up in the 80s and 90s (ah, the good old pre-Internet days). It takes a lot of people to run a swim meet and there are a lot of them in a short season. Honestly if you can't commit to helping out you shouldn't sign your kids up for summer swim. I know plenty of parents who don't because they are realistic about their time while working full time. There are plenty of other activities that don't require so much from parents.

I hear you and agree that if 3 timers are required, you can't go rogue and only have one. But, does anyone get a college scholarship from swimming summer league? Serious question as my kids are not on swim team (as you said, we could never do it due to being a two working parent family). Do the times/standings ever impact anything beyond the end of July?

No, they don’t, but parents in this area like to act like summer rec swim is the equivalent of the Olympics or something. I actually find the summer swim parents worse than my kid’s club parents. The kids that swim in college do so based on their results in club meets, not based on summer swim results. There are good club swimmers that swim for their summer teams, although on our summer team the top club kids seem to stop summer swim once they hit 13-14.

The problem is these leagues (and many of the teams) are run by parents who have year-round swimmers. All of the timing rules, stroke and turn, refereeing etc. benefit year round swimmers and those parents want to keep it that way.

How do ref and stroke and turn judges only benefit year round swimmers? In any sport there are refs. Stroke and turn are there to let kids know if they aren't doing a stroke properly. May kids start out in summer league, love swimming and go on to swim year round. Some kids may also swim in high school even if they don't do year round swim.

Apparently PP thinks they should relax the rules for summer swim. I can’t even. That’s like saying soccer rules are set up to benefit travel players and that refs should just rec soccer players use their hands. So ridiculous.

No... it's not like changing the rules so that players can use their hands. It's like acknowledging that while the MLS may have five refs on the field, it's actually OK to have just one ref do his best when a bunch of 10 year olds are playing soccer in the local rec league. And yeah, sometimes the one ref may miss an off-sides call. It's OK. It really is.
In fact - horror of horrors - I've even been to rec soccer games when an official ref didn't show up, and two parents, one from each team, just did their best to keep the game fair and moving along. It was fine.
Likewise, while super-official-college-bound-important year round swimmers may need three people timing them, perhaps it's OK if only one person times the summer league lanes and just does their best.

PP wasn’t just talking about the number of timers, they specifically mentioned stroke and turn too. As though the rules for legal strokes and turns should somehow be relaxed so it’s more fair to people who don’t spend as much time practicing their stroke technique. It’s a ridiculous idea.