Puppy Mill or Legit breeder?

[Anonymous]

My sister just got a new puppy. She got it from a woman who lives a ways out in Shanandoah valley. I didn't think much of it, but when she was telling me about the breeder, she mentioned that the woman has 4 litters of puppies at the moment. In excess of 20 puppies. I told her "Woah, that sounds like a puppy mill!" She was adamant that it was not, that because the woman only breeds each of her females 4 times, she's a responsible breeder.

I'm not a dog expert, but having 20+ puppies concurrently seems like something the true high end breeders would not do. Does this sound like a puppy mill to you?

[Anonymous]

It sounds high, but I would ask about other behavior. Did the breeder screen your sister at all, asking about what she wanted the dog for (show or pet)? Did she require spay/neuter for just a pet? Did she make her sign a contract that requires your sister to return the dog to her if, for some reason, she decides not to keep it? Did the breeder provide health histories?

I'd be much more interested in those types of facts than the number of puppies a breeder had at any one time.

[Anonymous]

Depends on the condition of the place and the type of dogs. Some dogs have bigger litters than others.

[Anonymous]

Same thing, OP. You can get a pure bred dog from a shelter for $20. Seriously. I would highly recommend it. Never give money to someone who claims to be a breeder. You are supporting this awful system where some lazy as* sits at home while the poor dog produces dogs for the lazy as*'s profit. No way. Not if you truly like dogs. If you are dillusional and think you are Paris Hilton, well I can't help you there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Same thing, OP. You can get a pure bred dog from a shelter for $20. Seriously. I would highly recommend it. Never give money to someone who claims to be a breeder. You are supporting this awful system where some lazy as* sits at home while the poor dog produces dogs for the lazy as*'s profit. No way. Not if you truly like dogs. If you are dillusional and think you are Paris Hilton, well I can't help you there.

it was her sister who got the dog, not the op.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Same thing, OP. You can get a pure bred dog from a shelter for $20. Seriously. I would highly recommend it. Never give money to someone who claims to be a breeder. You are supporting this awful system where some lazy as* sits at home while the poor dog produces dogs for the lazy as*'s profit. No way. Not if you truly like dogs. If you are dillusional and think you are Paris Hilton, well I can't help you there.

1. Your post makes not sense.
2. Not all breeders are evil.
3. Just because you had a bad experience or disagree with breeding does not make it the case for everyone.
4. What does Paris Hilton have to do with anything other then maybe you actually do envy her?

Signed, a non-breeder who got a great pup from a retired vet tech who loves her animals and breeds for fun and is very picky about who her dogs go to.

[Anonymous]

From what I've read, 20 puppies would be pretty suspect, unless the "breeder" employs a number of other people to help care for and socialize the puppies.

[Anonymous]

Breeders we have dealt with never had 20 pups on site. The ones we got pups from all showed in obedience and conformation.

Since most pups go to happy homes at 8 weeks there can be some overlap. Some 10-12 week pups might still be on-site from a prior litter.

Breeders give them individual attention and all were in the house so I would be really skeptical of the 20 pups.

[Anonymous]

Isn't there supposed to be a gap in litters? Can the mom spit them out rapid fire? How can that be good for her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Isn't there supposed to be a gap in litters? Can the mom spit them out rapid fire? How can that be good for her?

4 times over a lifetime could be every 2 years or so, which would be fine in most cases. Most dog people I know are pretty nuts. And the breeders I knew had up to six pet or show dogs at any given time. The odd part to me was that their houses were always immaculate, and never smelled like "dog." I can keep up with one dog quite easily, but I'd never have two. I can't imagine six.

But no, I don't know any breeders personally (and I know quite a few), who would breed all four bitches at once, if that was even possible. But who knows?

[Anonymous]

OP here. Yeah, not me getting a dog PP, so I wasn't supporting anybody. Pretty much everyone in my house is allergic.

My sister thinks the woman was really discerning in her placement of pups, but I'm not so sure. For example, my sister and her husband are both attorneys so their dogs are home alone 12 hours a day. They don't have a daily walker, either. Also live in a townhouse, and theirs doesn't have a back yard.

No biggy . . . it is what it is. I just thought the 20 puppies thing was a little odd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Yeah, not me getting a dog PP, so I wasn't supporting anybody. Pretty much everyone in my house is allergic.

My sister thinks the woman was really discerning in her placement of pups, but I'm not so sure. For example, my sister and her husband are both attorneys so their dogs are home alone 12 hours a day. They don't have a daily walker, either. Also live in a townhouse, and theirs doesn't have a back yard.

No biggy . . . it is what it is. I just thought the 20 puppies thing was a little odd.

Not cool.

[Anonymous]

Better the dog be home alone 12 hours/day and safe and sound than abused 12 hours/day, or spending 24 hours/day in a shelter w/o a no-kill policy.

[Anonymous]

Maybe she plans the litters to be welped around the same time so she cna have some freedom and not have to go through it all year long.

Are most of the liters already spoken for? We had to wait 2 years to get our dog and it was worth it.

[Anonymous]

Were the dogs all the same breed? If so, then she may just be breeding her females at the same time. If they were all different breeds then I would suspect puppy mill.