Reducing the academic load to play elite soccer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP courses are overrated. The big 3 private schools will eliminate all AP classes in 2020 I think.

Where I work, we have quite a few people who attended TJ and went onto Carnegie Mellon, UVa, Georgia Tech. I myself went to UVA. All of us have to report to the VP who studied communications @GMU and played D1 soccer there. The CFO was also a D1 soccer player @GMU and hired my boss. He went from a worker to director then VP in three years. The power of sports and networking is much more powerful than AP courses.

Because they are not showing competitive results vs public schools. APs are not meaningless at all. And if they are not hard, why duck them? And I'll circle back to you in 10 years to see how the network all works out/ There are those of us who can do both AP and soccer. Those who can do only AP are more likely to do well than those who can do only athletics. And the academic kids have a network too, though I can tell you none of it matters at places where you can earn real money.

There are higher percentage kids from Potomac private school attending Ivies and Stanford than public schools. That's the fact. Anyone can attend public schools. Private school is by invitation only. Because they are not showing competitive results vs public schools is laughable.

D1 athletes, in general, have better opportunities than the general student population and better paying job than students who have better academic credentials. For example, athletes are great at IT sales. After ten years, IT sale people make around 700K/yr while a STEM engineer makes at most 200k/yr. Not even close.

Athletes are great at IT sales. Oh absolutely. What amazing words of wisdom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You need better high school. It does not have to be four wasted educational years. You can take college level courses for credit in many high school and the credits are transferable. More importantly the material in interesting and challenging. Part of the value of AP and Honors course is they attract students who are more interested in engaging with the material so the course can move faster and be more intellectual.

It doesn't matter once a kid is in college. Just like the soccer doesn't matter after they quit playing either after HS or after college. AP just is not the pinnacle of life and once in college the impact of AP classes fades away very quickly.

All that matters is getting into the school. AP classes is one way, a mix of AP, Honors and sports is another way. Eventually, in both cases the kids will succeed or fail on their own.

We just have to agree to disagree. IMO more matters then getting into the school. Good luck to your player.

Agreed on all those counts. The "just getting in" mentality goes well beyond soccer and has seriously degraded the work force that I see; we see the same things out of law school graduates Annually, the quality declines just a bit more. And frankly I am surprised that people on these boards would think that a strategy that would almost certainly doom their child in soccer (I am in the DA so I can coast now) would somehow work in academics, where the talent pool is increasingly global and competition is forever. No, simply taking an AP course does not mean you are challenging yourself. And taking ten is not necessary to challenge oneself. But ducking AP or IB courses to play more soccer is certainly not challenging yourself academically at a level that is likely to yield long-term success in the classroom. Not everybody needs to be academically competitive or elite, but if you think your kid will somehow wing it for a few years while you enjoy their DA games, and then catch fire after graduating from college or get what they need from the alumni network, you are doing them a disservice.

What does any of that have to do with AP classes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to cut back on academics go ahead. No one should be surprised that that idea is unpopular on this board. I think that the demographic that has the resources to be playing high end youth sports is the same demographic that values education for the most part. These folks are trying to get their kids on track for college and grad school and professional careers with solid incomes that would enable some financial security. Pulling backs on academics is not going to sell in this demographic.

,

It's not selling in this demographic because nobody posting has a kid in the top 1% of the nation in their sport.

Any kid in a DA program is in the top percent of youth players in the US and are the ones who populate Division 1 schools along with their foreign counterparts. No one here is saying to cut Academics. Only that to play DA, it should be possible to not have to be as extreme academically. Also no one is advocating a professional soccer career. We are talking about how playing DA, and DA only, can actually help kids get in better schools as opposed to carrying a heavy academic load and not playing DA, and DA only. We are ONLY talking about DA here and it’s unique demands on its players. And we are ONLY talking about playing for a Division 1 school, not D2, not D3.

I agree with everything you’ve said here, but the OP probably was talking to at least some parents of boys (the equation is very different for girls) who are aiming to go pro out of HS. You almost certainly will have to sacrifice academics in that situation to a degree that would make most posters here very uncomfortable, like taking online classes for a year or two, transferring to schools like the Calverton school so you can spend more time training with DCU, moving overseas for better clubs, etc. There are scores of kids doing this each year from DAs around the country, including several from the local ones. I know families who were nervous to go down this path whose kids are now playing in MLS or Europe, and they think it was worth it, at least for now. Other pro-focused kids never had the academic aptitude to succeed in college, and making it as any kind of pro will likely improve their employment outcomes over what they’d otherwise do post-HS.

For the very small percentage of DCUM posters who have boys staring in the DA during HS, I bet almost all of us come from families that highly value education and I agree that “cutting back” means nothing like the worst case scenarios presented here. One thing I haven’t seen mentioned much is the way in which playing DA or other very demanding sport can help with academics. My kid was not particularly academically ambitious at the start of middle school, but older kids in the program told him his abilities meant he’d have a ton of great recruiting options if he had all “As” through junior year, which turned out to be true, even with fewer APs than the very top students at his HS and limited non-soccer ECs. To get there he stayed up until midnight or later most nights to study after practice, as did his friends aiming for top schools. Now that he’s in college, there is both peer pressure and academic mentoring from older teammates who are majoring in subjects ranging from the dreaded Communications to Physics and Engineering. And yes, the soccer bro network is a real thing and more important than just the increased access to internships.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AP courses are overrated. The big 3 private schools will eliminate all AP classes in 2020 I think.

Where I work, we have quite a few people who attended TJ and went onto Carnegie Mellon, UVa, Georgia Tech. I myself went to UVA. All of us have to report to the VP who studied communications @GMU and played D1 soccer there. The CFO was also a D1 soccer player @GMU and hired my boss. He went from a worker to director then VP in three years. The power of sports and networking is much more powerful than AP courses.

Because they are not showing competitive results vs public schools. APs are not meaningless at all. And if they are not hard, why duck them? And I'll circle back to you in 10 years to see how the network all works out/ There are those of us who can do both AP and soccer. Those who can do only AP are more likely to do well than those who can do only athletics. And the academic kids have a network too, though I can tell you none of it matters at places where you can earn real money.

There are higher percentage kids from Potomac private school attending Ivies and Stanford than public schools. That's the fact. Anyone can attend public schools. Private school is by invitation only. Because they are not showing competitive results vs public schools is laughable.

D1 athletes, in general, have better opportunities than the general student population and better paying job than students who have better academic credentials. For example, athletes are great at IT sales. After ten years, IT sale people make around 700K/yr while a STEM engineer makes at most 200k/yr. Not even close.

Hilarious. By the way, TJ is by invite only and not based on how much mommy and daddy can pay and whom they know on the Board. When it drops APs, tell me all about it. Until then, talk to somebody who plays at a higher level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hilarious. By the way, TJ is by invite only and not based on how much mommy and daddy can pay and whom they know on the Board. When it drops APs, tell me all about it. Until then, talk to somebody who plays at a higher level.

Nobody talks about TJ. We're talking about public schools like Mkcean, Langley, James Madison. The only requirement is to live in that Pyramid.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2018/06/19/eight-private-high-schools-washington-area-are-dropping-out-ap-program

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Head thump.

Why do people think this is just about AP and having the same meaningless argument about AP?

It’s about an overall reduction in academics—a refocusing on sports over academics whether it be a weaker school, fewer Advanced classes, tutors etc.

Forrest : trees.
SMH

Because it's about getting into college. The only advantage to AP's is to get into college. There is no reason to do "more" academics if you don't have to... it's meaningless. Stop acting like your kids do AP because they love the subject and enjoy spending their nights doing homework... they do AP's to impress colleges.

My kids do AP because the regular classes are too boring. Same reason DA kids play DA instead of Rec.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree with everything you’ve said here, but the OP probably was talking to at least some parents of boys (the equation is very different for girls) who are aiming to go pro out of HS. You almost certainly will have to sacrifice academics in that situation to a degree that would make most posters here very uncomfortable, like taking online classes for a year or two, transferring to schools like the Calverton school so you can spend more time training with DCU, moving overseas for better clubs, etc. There are scores of kids doing this each year from DAs around the country, including several from the local ones. I know families who were nervous to go down this path whose kids are now playing in MLS or Europe, and they think it was worth it, at least for now. Other pro-focused kids never had the academic aptitude to succeed in college, and making it as any kind of pro will likely improve their employment outcomes over what they’d otherwise do post-HS.

For the very small percentage of DCUM posters who have boys staring in the DA during HS, I bet almost all of us come from families that highly value education and I agree that “cutting back” means nothing like the worst case scenarios presented here. One thing I haven’t seen mentioned much is the way in which playing DA or other very demanding sport can help with academics. My kid was not particularly academically ambitious at the start of middle school, but older kids in the program told him his abilities meant he’d have a ton of great recruiting options if he had all “As” through junior year, which turned out to be true, even with fewer APs than the very top students at his HS and limited non-soccer ECs. To get there he stayed up until midnight or later most nights to study after practice, as did his friends aiming for top schools. Now that he’s in college, there is both peer pressure and academic mentoring from older teammates who are majoring in subjects ranging from the dreaded Communications to Physics and Engineering. And yes, the soccer bro network is a real thing and more important than just the increased access to internships.

Completely in agreement with the last statement. The majority of ex-D1 soccer players seem to get gravy high paying corporate management positions while the school "nerds" are the company workabee

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that people have to make it an us vs them scenario when it comes to athletes.

You do you.

Frats have networks,
Ivys' have networks
Athletes have networks
and apparently academic kids do too
i'm sure artists do too.

so what?

Because athletes have access to powerful alumni and people in influential positions that the rest of the student at the university. Watch this link below and see what Cris Carter said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPr6mAba85s

I guess if you don't get it, you don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have heard of people doing this. It's also common in gymnastics.

I have never seen it work out well in the few examples I know personally. Invariably the child has had a subpar education and then has ended up either not playing college or playing college but not further.

Ditto. I've watched this for decades. So many "star" high school athletes completely crap out at the college level and never actually play their sport. Several kids I know went to sub par colleges just because they got "signed" to the college team and that means so much to the kids in high school. One coach was red faced and spitting because I said I would not send my child to a smaller/lesser school to play they sport they showed some promise in. They'd go to the best college they'd get in. My kid was recruited by 2 non impressive, not- good reputation colleges and we didn't even call them back. The high schools must get some kind of kick back from getting the kids signed because I have seen so many smart athletes sign at some really bad schools.

You sound bitter.

And poor manners. Reflects poorly on the high school and coach if you didn’t even call back to say thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with everything you’ve said here, but the OP probably was talking to at least some parents of boys (the equation is very different for girls) who are aiming to go pro out of HS. You almost certainly will have to sacrifice academics in that situation to a degree that would make most posters here very uncomfortable, like taking online classes for a year or two, transferring to schools like the Calverton school so you can spend more time training with DCU, moving overseas for better clubs, etc. There are scores of kids doing this each year from DAs around the country, including several from the local ones. I know families who were nervous to go down this path whose kids are now playing in MLS or Europe, and they think it was worth it, at least for now. Other pro-focused kids never had the academic aptitude to succeed in college, and making it as any kind of pro will likely improve their employment outcomes over what they’d otherwise do post-HS.

For the very small percentage of DCUM posters who have boys staring in the DA during HS, I bet almost all of us come from families that highly value education and I agree that “cutting back” means nothing like the worst case scenarios presented here. One thing I haven’t seen mentioned much is the way in which playing DA or other very demanding sport can help with academics. My kid was not particularly academically ambitious at the start of middle school, but older kids in the program told him his abilities meant he’d have a ton of great recruiting options if he had all “As” through junior year, which turned out to be true, even with fewer APs than the very top students at his HS and limited non-soccer ECs. To get there he stayed up until midnight or later most nights to study after practice, as did his friends aiming for top schools. Now that he’s in college, there is both peer pressure and academic mentoring from older teammates who are majoring in subjects ranging from the dreaded Communications to Physics and Engineering. And yes, the soccer bro network is a real thing and more important than just the increased access to internships.

Completely in agreement with the last statement. The majority of ex-D1 soccer players seem to get gravy high paying corporate management positions while the school "nerds" are the company workabee

Lol. Good plan. Ditch the academics. Play soccer and the "gravy high paying corporate management positions" will be yours. Best of luck with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lol. Good plan. Ditch the academics. Play soccer and the "gravy high paying corporate management positions" will be yours. Best of luck with that.

You know nothing about the real world, do you? It is not how much you know but who you know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol. Good plan. Ditch the academics. Play soccer and the "gravy high paying corporate management positions" will be yours. Best of luck with that.

You know nothing about the real world, do you? It is not how much you know but who you know.

Go for it. I am sure a bunch of educated, high income soccer parents reading this forum will be sure the take advice form an anonymous poster the their kids should focus on soccer instead of school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that people have to make it an us vs them scenario when it comes to athletes.

You do you.

Frats have networks,
Ivys' have networks
Athletes have networks
and apparently academic kids do too
i'm sure artists do too.

so what?

Because athletes have access to powerful alumni and people in influential positions that the rest of the student at the university. Watch this link below and see what Cris Carter said: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPr6mAba85s

I guess if you don't get it, you don't get it.

Oh I get it... I get preferred walk on spots. Bring up the team GPA... get the contacts in return.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol. Good plan. Ditch the academics. Play soccer and the "gravy high paying corporate management positions" will be yours. Best of luck with that.

You know nothing about the real world, do you? It is not how much you know but who you know.

Go for it. I am sure a bunch of educated, high income soccer parents reading this forum will be sure the take advice form an anonymous poster the their kids should focus on soccer instead of school.

If you had a kid in the top 1% of the nation, yes, they would.

[Anonymous]

Try again,


Boys:

1 in 5,355 high school players will be drafted to the MLS

1 in 447 college players will be drafted in the MLS

Girls:

1 in 10,316 high school players will be drafted to the NWSL

1 in 986 college players will be drafted in the NWSL


If you focus on school instead of soccer, you would be able to calculate those odds as being significantly lower than 1 in 100.