Can I name my Jewish daughter Mary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It is weird culturally because of the Catholic focus with the Virgin Mary, but it is biblically Jewish. No one questions Mark or Paul with Jewish boys, and there are a ton of Jewish men with those names...very New Testament. It really is just cultural.
Now, Christine, Christina, Chrissy...that is a Christian name.

Not entirely true. Jews are "Saul," which was Paul's Jewish name. Jewish "Paul"s again, are largely named after older relatives who picked an assimilated Christian version of the traditional Jewish name.

"Mark," like "Julius," are/were popular Jewish names because they are Roman names.

-- mom to a "Julius Saul," named after an Orthdox great uncle (deceased) and a great-grandmother and great-grandfather, Paul and Pauline.

You are taking it away too far. St. Paul, St. Mark- My point is that these are Christan religious names and I can list 20 Jewish Marks and Pauls..while yo can list original sources, so can Mary...but it was culturally taken by Catholic culture.

I am telling you what Jews actually think and say to each other. I am not speculating on history. I am a Jewish woman who has had four babies myself, and heard countless conversations among other Jews, especially those of my mother's generation, about these "Christian"-y name choices. Is Christian-splaining a thing? You don't have to like it, or think it's reasonable, but this is what Jews will say about little Mary. They will say, "That's an odd choice. I don't know why she would name her daughter Mary. It's so Christian." Not all Jews, but enough that if you participate in Jewish life at all, you might want to think twice before setting yourself up for a lifetime of hurt feelings, or feeling misunderstood.

This is not making Jews sound good. I don’t want to believe anyone would make a child feel bad about her name of all things.

And you think Christians would react any differently to a Christian boy named Mohamed?

Oh, well, if Christians do it, it must be okay... Wait!

Isn’t the whole point to repair the world rather than replicating intolerance?

Being surprised by a name and it causing some confusion isn't the same as intolerance. Few if any are suggesting you should mock a Jewish Mary or a Christian Mohamed. But that doesn't mean a few eyebrows won't be raised. Tikun Olam doesn't vitiate human nature.

Nor does tikun olam mean we must erase the things that make us a vibrant and distinctive culture. Names are important in every culture and serve as in markers in every culture.

Somehow the “lifetime of hurt feelings and being misunderstood” you predicted was downgraded to “a few raised eyebrows”. This just makes me feel bad thinking of converts who keep birth names, especially transracially adopted children. If the name “Mary” is enough to cause a born Jewish child to go through vetting at every new engagement with the community, what does an AA or AS Jewish child face?

Are you Jewish? There's an obvious difference between an adopted child keeping their birth name; and choosing the single-most Christian girls' name deliberately.

[Anonymous]

I have pretty much read all the replies. I am Jewish and I would not use the name as “Mary”. However, I would use a name that is very similar such as Miriam or Mariana. Even Mara and Maria are nice alternatives. The reason I would not use the name as Mary is because in this country it has a very non-Jewish connotation that I would not want to saddle my Jewish child with ( constantly having to justify and explain her name ). My parents gave me an Irish name and even today I have to explain that sometimes. This is just my take on it, and I know several Mary’s. I know several adult Mary’s and a child Mary, and my own grandmother had a form of the name.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

I never did say it was the same, now did I?

I shared a little anecdote, and encouraged OP to do what she wants to do with her own child's name. All the extra stuff you're reading into it just isn't there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Are you Jewish? There's an obvious difference between an adopted child keeping their birth name; and choosing the single-most Christian girls' name deliberately.

I'm one of the PPs who had a Jewish great-aunt who went by Mary. In my opinion, Christina is the single-most Christian girls' name.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Are you Jewish? There's an obvious difference between an adopted child keeping their birth name; and choosing the single-most Christian girls' name deliberately.

I'm one of the PPs who had a Jewish great-aunt who went by Mary. In my opinion, Christina is the single-most Christian girls' name.

Well I think it's Mary. I guess. Mary Catherine or Mary Margaret even moreso.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

I never did say it was the same, now did I?

I shared a little anecdote, and encouraged OP to do what she wants to do with her own child's name. All the extra stuff you're reading into it just isn't there.

So you as a Christian feel competent to declare that there's no issue? Got it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you are still reading, I think you need to consider that your daughter will be her own person and have her own journey toward figuring out her relationship with her Jewish identity.

Please don't make it harder on her by forcing her first interaction with Jewish identity to be explaining that her mom "just liked the name Mary" for her entire childhood.

Do you think that the members of the Jewish community here are going to be incessantly asking a small child, "If you're Jewish, how come your name is Mary?!?! " The members of the Jewish community where I grew up would not have done this.

Mine would. I am a poster from above named Katherine. Was always questioned about whether I was really Jewish, was a convert, etc. Still happens today when I introduce myself at shul. I would not name a Jewish child Mary (or Kristen, Christian, Luke, Noel/Noelle, or other names strongly associated with Christianity ... though would make an exception for Paul since, for some reason, I know a fair number of older Jewish men with this name).

I'm not saying I would only name a child a recognizably Jewish name like Isaac or Benjamin. Just that I wouldn't choose one so strongly associated with Christianity, particularly when there is a Jewish variant, Miriam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is weird culturally because of the Catholic focus with the Virgin Mary, but it is biblically Jewish. No one questions Mark or Paul with Jewish boys, and there are a ton of Jewish men with those names...very New Testament. It really is just cultural.
Now, Christine, Christina, Chrissy...that is a Christian name.

Not entirely true. Jews are "Saul," which was Paul's Jewish name. Jewish "Paul"s again, are largely named after older relatives who picked an assimilated Christian version of the traditional Jewish name.

"Mark," like "Julius," are/were popular Jewish names because they are Roman names.

-- mom to a "Julius Saul," named after an Orthdox great uncle (deceased) and a great-grandmother and great-grandfather, Paul and Pauline.

You are taking it away too far. St. Paul, St. Mark- My point is that these are Christan religious names and I can list 20 Jewish Marks and Pauls..while yo can list original sources, so can Mary...but it was culturally taken by Catholic culture.

I am telling you what Jews actually think and say to each other. I am not speculating on history. I am a Jewish woman who has had four babies myself, and heard countless conversations among other Jews, especially those of my mother's generation, about these "Christian"-y name choices. Is Christian-splaining a thing? You don't have to like it, or think it's reasonable, but this is what Jews will say about little Mary. They will say, "That's an odd choice. I don't know why she would name her daughter Mary. It's so Christian." Not all Jews, but enough that if you participate in Jewish life at all, you might want to think twice before setting yourself up for a lifetime of hurt feelings, or feeling misunderstood.

This is not making Jews sound good. I don’t want to believe anyone would make a child feel bad about her name of all things.

And you think Christians would react any differently to a Christian boy named Mohamed?

Oh, well, if Christians do it, it must be okay... Wait!

Isn’t the whole point to repair the world rather than replicating intolerance?

Being surprised by a name and it causing some confusion isn't the same as intolerance. Few if any are suggesting you should mock a Jewish Mary or a Christian Mohamed. But that doesn't mean a few eyebrows won't be raised. Tikun Olam doesn't vitiate human nature.

Nor does tikun olam mean we must erase the things that make us a vibrant and distinctive culture. Names are important in every culture and serve as in markers in every culture.

Somehow the “lifetime of hurt feelings and being misunderstood” you predicted was downgraded to “a few raised eyebrows”. This just makes me feel bad thinking of converts who keep birth names, especially transracially adopted children. If the name “Mary” is enough to cause a born Jewish child to go through vetting at every new engagement with the community, what does an AA or AS Jewish child face?

It's a consideration. It can be tough for an AA or other minority Jewish child, adopted or not. It was one reason we decided to pursue ART instead of adoption when we experienced secondary infertility. Although we felt we could love and raise a child of any race, we felt it would be unfair to a child of non-Jewish origin, particularly a minority child, to make them stand out so in their adopted community.

Adults who convert do so knowingly. They can choose to change their name, take a Hebrew name -- which they have to do anyway as Hebrew names are important in synagogue -- or keep their given name and know that if it sounds extremely non-Jewish, they may be asked about their origins. Asked, not necessarily judged. An adult can deal with that. It's harder for a child. It's especially hard for a child who in fact was born Jewish but will always encounter skeptics that this is so, merely because of her name. I speak from personal experience as someone with a non-Jewish first and last name. This is simply a fact in any remotely religious (Conservative or Orthodox) Jewish community. You can rail against it being unfair, and you may be right, but it's not going to change in time for this kid's birth.

No one is saying OP can't actually name her daughter Mary. Of course she can. But these are valid considerations and objections. If she wants to do it anyway, she can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

I never did say it was the same, now did I?

I shared a little anecdote, and encouraged OP to do what she wants to do with her own child's name. All the extra stuff you're reading into it just isn't there.

So you as a Christian feel competent to declare that there's no issue? Got it.

It's two parents deciding what they want to name their child. At the end of the day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you are still reading, I think you need to consider that your daughter will be her own person and have her own journey toward figuring out her relationship with her Jewish identity.

Please don't make it harder on her by forcing her first interaction with Jewish identity to be explaining that her mom "just liked the name Mary" for her entire childhood.

Do you think that the members of the Jewish community here are going to be incessantly asking a small child, "If you're Jewish, how come your name is Mary?!?! " The members of the Jewish community where I grew up would not have done this.

Mine would. I am a poster from above named Katherine. Was always questioned about whether I was really Jewish, was a convert, etc. Still happens today when I introduce myself at shul. I would not name a Jewish child Mary (or Kristen, Christian, Luke, Noel/Noelle, or other names strongly associated with Christianity ... though would make an exception for Paul since, for some reason, I know a fair number of older Jewish men with this name).

I'm not saying I would only name a child a recognizably Jewish name like Isaac or Benjamin. Just that I wouldn't choose one so strongly associated with Christianity, particularly when there is a Jewish variant, Miriam.

I would find a different shul.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you are still reading, I think you need to consider that your daughter will be her own person and have her own journey toward figuring out her relationship with her Jewish identity.

Please don't make it harder on her by forcing her first interaction with Jewish identity to be explaining that her mom "just liked the name Mary" for her entire childhood.

Do you think that the members of the Jewish community here are going to be incessantly asking a small child, "If you're Jewish, how come your name is Mary?!?! " The members of the Jewish community where I grew up would not have done this.

Mine would. I am a poster from above named Katherine. Was always questioned about whether I was really Jewish, was a convert, etc. Still happens today when I introduce myself at shul. I would not name a Jewish child Mary (or Kristen, Christian, Luke, Noel/Noelle, or other names strongly associated with Christianity ... though would make an exception for Paul since, for some reason, I know a fair number of older Jewish men with this name).

I'm not saying I would only name a child a recognizably Jewish name like Isaac or Benjamin. Just that I wouldn't choose one so strongly associated with Christianity, particularly when there is a Jewish variant, Miriam.

Oh yeah, I guess Noel might be the MOST Christian girl's name! Pasqual and Jesus for the boys. I guess a Jewish boy named Frances Xavier might get some second looks as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

I never did say it was the same, now did I?

I shared a little anecdote, and encouraged OP to do what she wants to do with her own child's name. All the extra stuff you're reading into it just isn't there.

So you as a Christian feel competent to declare that there's no issue? Got it.

It's two parents deciding what they want to name their child. At the end of the day.

Of course it is. That doesn't change the fact that you as a Christian don't know what you're talking about here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you are still reading, I think you need to consider that your daughter will be her own person and have her own journey toward figuring out her relationship with her Jewish identity.

Please don't make it harder on her by forcing her first interaction with Jewish identity to be explaining that her mom "just liked the name Mary" for her entire childhood.

Do you think that the members of the Jewish community here are going to be incessantly asking a small child, "If you're Jewish, how come your name is Mary?!?! " The members of the Jewish community where I grew up would not have done this.

Mine would. I am a poster from above named Katherine. Was always questioned about whether I was really Jewish, was a convert, etc. Still happens today when I introduce myself at shul. I would not name a Jewish child Mary (or Kristen, Christian, Luke, Noel/Noelle, or other names strongly associated with Christianity ... though would make an exception for Paul since, for some reason, I know a fair number of older Jewish men with this name).

I'm not saying I would only name a child a recognizably Jewish name like Isaac or Benjamin. Just that I wouldn't choose one so strongly associated with Christianity, particularly when there is a Jewish variant, Miriam.

I would find a different shul.

I have attended shuls all over the East Coast and in the midwest and even 2 shuls in Japan -- an Ashkenazi one in Tokyo and a Sephardic one in Kobe. It always happens. Maybe not at a Reform shul, but at Conservative and Orthodox shuls, it happens. Such is life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're Christian and named our daughter Marian, which a lot of people hear as "Miriam," and then ask if we are Jewish.

It's a pretty name, OP! I vote for using it if you like it.

People asking if a Catholic child is Jewish =/= people asking if a Jewish child is Catholic.

Now, it's entirely possible that OP doesn't care about the confusion. But there WILL be confusion.

I never did say it was the same, now did I?

I shared a little anecdote, and encouraged OP to do what she wants to do with her own child's name. All the extra stuff you're reading into it just isn't there.

So you as a Christian feel competent to declare that there's no issue? Got it.

It's two parents deciding what they want to name their child. At the end of the day.

Of course it is. That doesn't change the fact that you as a Christian don't know what you're talking about here.

I guess she DOES know what she is talking about here, because she used a name often associated with another religion than hers-which is what the OP is asking about doing. Not sure why you seem to have issue with her particular religion.