Reaction to "Study of Choice and Special Academic Programs: Report of Findings and Recommendations"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the real issue here is that MCPS is trying to find a cheap solution to an expensive problem. The expensive problem is that middle class kids of all races get far more enrichment opportunities than their working class counterparts. This includes summer learning, music lessons, and all sorts of other intangibles.

Now, Title I schools often are able to fill that gap to some degree with additional funding for summer school or after school programming for all kids. BUT, as I understand, the federal guidelines for Title I have changed and, as a result, schools with relatively high FARMS rates are now ineligible.

So, you get two kids from the same school, both bright, both hard working. Both have parents who are interested and engaged. Both have been exposed to decent in-school differentiation and education.

But one has been in piano since 4, is enrolled in summer reading and math boot camp in addition to their engaging summer camp, and has an adult meeting them at the bus to help them with their homework while the sun is still up.

No "in group comparison" is going to make up for the differences between those two kids. Only systematic engagement from preK on up is going to do anything about that gap, but MCPS isn't proposing anything like that.

You make it sound like it's a good thing to be an obsessive tiger parent?! God help us all if the only paths are abject failure or summer academic boot camp.

It surely beats dumbing down for the whole school system, which sounds like you would be happy to see.

[Anonymous]

Btw, even by DCUM standard, the degree of intentionsl obfuscation in this thread is astounding. Maybe the election is rubbing off.

[Anonymous]

]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the real issue here is that MCPS is trying to find a cheap solution to an expensive problem. The expensive problem is that middle class kids of all races get far more enrichment opportunities than their working class counterparts. This includes summer learning, music lessons, and all sorts of other intangibles.

Now, Title I schools often are able to fill that gap to some degree with additional funding for summer school or after school programming for all kids. BUT, as I understand, the federal guidelines for Title I have changed and, as a result, schools with relatively high FARMS rates are now ineligible.

So, you get two kids from the same school, both bright, both hard working. Both have parents who are interested and engaged. Both have been exposed to decent in-school differentiation and education.

But one has been in piano since 4, is enrolled in summer reading and math boot camp in addition to their engaging summer camp, and has an adult meeting them at the bus to help them with their homework while the sun is still up.

No "in group comparison" is going to make up for the differences between those two kids. Only systematic engagement from preK on up is going to do anything about that gap, but MCPS isn't proposing anything like that.

You make it sound like it's a good thing to be an obsessive tiger parent?! God help us all if the only paths are abject failure or summer academic boot camp.

Parenting is about giving responsibilities and guidance to your child. Parents of high achieving students do that. They have high expectation of their children, but they also provide the support needed, and expect their children to work hard and do their part.

What you call "Tiger Parenting", is actually parenting by delegating responsibility. These parents (regardless of race, education, SES) make the education of their children a priority and value hardwork and learning.

The people who do not have high expectation of their children, whose kids do not work hard and when the parents do not provide support, guidance and encouragement...in other words, when parents do not make their children's education their responsibility and want rewards without the work...that is called abdicating the parental responsibility.

Good parents delegate not abdicate their responsibility towards their children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NYT article today, "Why Talented Black and Hispanic Students Can Go Undiscovered"

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/10/upshot/why-talented-black-and-hispanic-students-can-go-undiscovered.html?_r=1

Nonverbal test as first step.

We already due this screening and many minority kids are identified however because of the limited slots many don't make it to the HGC. So we are back to the same solution almost everyone will agree with.... Make more slots!

OK

Pay up then.

Do you think MCPS magically pulls slots out of its ass?

MCPS has money to pay Metis for this stupid ass research as well as pay Joshua Starr? Sure, it has money to magically pull out from its ass. Maybe start by removing bullshit positions in MCPS central office. Like the department of Equity - because it is basically department of "Hide Achievement Gap by using smoke and mirrors" .

If MCPS simply adds more slots without changing how/the demographics of who they select, they will simply add even more Asians. This will not increase the Hispanic and black numbers at all.

MCPS should not look at race. They should choose the best candidates based on academic performance. If by adding more slots, more Asians will be selected, then only means that MCPS is not doing right by qualified Asian students. It also means that there are proportionately less amount of qualified Hispanic and Black students.

If there is such a dearth of qualified students amongst the Blacks and Hispanics, then getting them into a very limited, very small, magnet program will help the Black and Hispanic student community in what way?

I think, it is more important that MCPS gets the basics right with URMs, first try and make them do well in PARCC or MSAs , rather than the magnet admission test.

This is just political hogwash.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NYT article today, "Why Talented Black and Hispanic Students Can Go Undiscovered"

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/10/upshot/why-talented-black-and-hispanic-students-can-go-undiscovered.html?_r=1

Nonverbal test as first step.

We already due this screening and many minority kids are identified however because of the limited slots many don't make it to the HGC. So we are back to the same solution almost everyone will agree with.... Make more slots!

OK

Pay up then.

Do you think MCPS magically pulls slots out of its ass?

MCPS has money to pay Metis for this stupid ass research as well as pay Joshua Starr? Sure, it has money to magically pull out from its ass. Maybe start by removing bullshit positions in MCPS central office. Like the department of Equity - because it is basically department of "Hide Achievement Gap by using smoke and mirrors" .

If MCPS simply adds more slots without changing how/the demographics of who they select, they will simply add even more Asians. This will not increase the Hispanic and black numbers at all.

MCPS should not look at race. They should choose the best candidates based on academic performance. If by adding more slots, more Asians will be selected, then only means that MCPS is not doing right by qualified Asian students. It also means that there are proportionately less amount of qualified Hispanic and Black students.

If there is such a dearth of qualified students amongst the Blacks and Hispanics, then getting them into a very limited, very small, magnet program will help the Black and Hispanic student community in what way?

I think, it is more important that MCPS gets the basics right with URMs, first try and make them do well in PARCC or MSAs , rather than the magnet admission test.

This is just political hogwash.

Your lasr sentence says it all. It is all political.

[Anonymous]

Why not end all the busing and using the money saved to improve all programs throughout the county. There is higher demand and greater ability to do the gifted programs than kids have access to. If more slots need to be opened up, why not open them up at kids home schools? Why force kids to waste 2 hours a day and bus them around the county just for access?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why not end all the busing and using the money saved to improve all programs throughout the county. There is higher demand and greater ability to do the gifted programs than kids have access to. If more slots need to be opened up, why not open them up at kids home schools? Why force kids to waste 2 hours a day and bus them around the county just for access?

Which "busing" are you referring to?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why not end all the busing and using the money saved to improve all programs throughout the county. There is higher demand and greater ability to do the gifted programs than kids have access to. If more slots need to be opened up, why not open them up at kids home schools? Why force kids to waste 2 hours a day and bus them around the county just for access?

Because the money saved is minuscule compared to the budget as a whole, so it will have no impact.

Because MCPS has proved over the years that they have no idea how to educate multiple peer groups at different ability levels without racially segregating.

Because kids who are at the academic/ability level of the magnets are so advanced that they typically have few peers at their home school. For example, my DD was reading at the college level (according to MAP-R) when she entered the magnet. There were basically a handful of kids at the homeschool that had similarly advanced reading/language skills. There were many examples of inappropriate instruction that she received, and other examples of ways in which she was missing out on instruction that she needed at her skill level at that time (instead of waiting until 10th grade). There was no way to group and teach them at their level. They also needed a bigger peer group than just 3-4 other kids. As much learning at the magnet (and any school probs) happens from interaction with peers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why not end all the busing and using the money saved to improve all programs throughout the county. There is higher demand and greater ability to do the gifted programs than kids have access to. If more slots need to be opened up, why not open them up at kids home schools? Why force kids to waste 2 hours a day and bus them around the county just for access?

Which "busing" are you referring to?

I believe they are referring to the busing involved in getting to magnet schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why not end all the busing and using the money saved to improve all programs throughout the county. There is higher demand and greater ability to do the gifted programs than kids have access to. If more slots need to be opened up, why not open them up at kids home schools? Why force kids to waste 2 hours a day and bus them around the county just for access?

Which "busing" are you referring to?

I believe they are referring to the busing involved in getting to magnet schools.

Oh. As I recall, the study said that the immersion and selective-application special programs cost an additional about $6 million, including busing. Which would be a lot if I won it in the lottery, but it's not a lot if you're trying to improve all programs throughout the county.

[Anonymous]

$6 millón is still $6 million. Better to spread it around the entire county when there are more kids wanting to do the programs than slots for the programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:$6 millón is still $6 million. Better to spread it around the entire county when there are more kids wanting to do the programs than slots for the programs.

It's $38.35 per student.

[Anonymous]

So if my kid wants to be an astronaut and NASA doesn't select him...we should end space travel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So if my kid wants to be an astronaut and NASA doesn't select him...we should end space travel?

Obviously. If your kid doesn't get selected then the process is clearly biased and unfair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So if my kid wants to be an astronaut and NASA doesn't select him...we should end space travel?

Obviously. If your kid doesn't get selected then the process is clearly biased and unfair.

Only if he is URM.