Does 1580+ help T20 admissions?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’m a broken record here but once you hit the threshold, it doesn’t matter for the HYP of the world.

It does matter for a school like Duke or Vandy.

It matters too at JHU Penn. That said, they have gotten so many 1580+ applying to JHU and Penn. Sometimes it gives you an illusion that they don't care but they do. Any school outside HYPMS all cares a great deal about your test score.

Those who want to believe that somehow a 1580 is actually viewed differently than a 1570 will keep deluding themselves. Nothing that anyone says will convince them otherwise. Likewise, those who believe that MIT somehow considers a 770 different than a 780 (though both may result from the exact same number of missed questions) because of their bucketing example which was an example rather than a hard rule will likewise never be convinced otherwise.

Others will settle into what the vast majority of informed voices say which is that above a certain point other factors take over.

Pick your poison because neither group is listening to the other but as you pick remember that correlation isn't causation.

Views are changing.

A year ago, people would challenge "somehow a 1580 is actually viewed differently than a 1500 will keep deluding themselves." Now they don't say 1500 anymore. Because they also believe 1580 is different from 1500 in kind.

A 1580 is different than a 1500, it always has been. The rule of thumb was that you were fine once you crossed the bar and that generally still holds true. People who believe that schools look at small gradations in scores to boost USNWR rankings are kidding themselves.

A 1580 isn't any different than a 1560 as they could both result from missing the exact same number of questions depending on the individual test. That is what seems lost to many. People also don't realize that an 800 isn't necessarily perfect and that a miss could result in a 790 or a 800 on a section depending on the individual test. The SAT just isn't granular enough to make the jumps that some want to make.

DP not sure if I agree with this. Caltech makes it clear they put applicants in different SAT score bands in 20 point intervals

I wonder if a bunch of people misunderstood Caltech methodology. If you score an 780-800 on each subject test, they put you in the highest band. Therefore you could score a 780 on both sections, and your score of 1560 would not be differentiated in any way from a 1600.

But 1560 isn't exactly a magic cutoff either. You could score an 800 on one section and a 760 on another, and you would be in the highest band for one section and not the highest band the other.

I think it's because most people at this level achieve 800 math easily. Hence the 1580.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:consider that there are probably more than 100,000 superscored 1580+ sat scorers applying to college every year, it isn't that impressive of a score.

No more than 5,000 achieve this score even superscored and possibly closer to 2-3,000 nationally each year according to multiple estimates. Even college Board states the "99+" percentile (as apposed to just "99") starts at 1560. Whatever 99+ is, it's a very small number of students.

[Anonymous]

Only about 3000 nationally have 1580+. This does not guarantee admissions to any T20 school. But I think the chances they got rejected by every T20 school is also low, maybe 10% probability? As long as they apply to a reasonable number of schools, they should get in somewhere in T20 or T25.

[Anonymous]

This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Needs to be 1540? I doubt it. They will accept A great score will help but there will be plenty of kids in the 25-50% score range accepted among those 3000 kids. They aren't going to give up their priorities to maximize test scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Mean 1540? not the average.
But yes the distribution will be similar, the middle 50% in the range of 1510-1560 for the 3000 kids (now submitters).

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:consider that there are probably more than 100,000 superscored 1580+ sat scorers applying to college every year, it isn't that impressive of a score.

No! 1580+ remains extremely difficult to get. Superscore doesn’t help in this range.

+1
Superscore 1580 means you need at least 800 or 790 in one subject. Kids who can do that typically have at least 750 on the other

There were several at our school who couldn’t cross that hurdle for the verbal. One was being recruited by MIT and JHU and fell off because of it.

Recruited athletes? They rescinded the offer because the SAT was 20 points too low??

Because they couldn’t meet a 750/750 threshold.

So a 740/790 wouldn't get in?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Approximately additional 700-800 1560+ to matriculate at three schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:consider that there are probably more than 100,000 superscored 1580+ sat scorers applying to college every year, it isn't that impressive of a score.

No! 1580+ remains extremely difficult to get. Superscore doesn’t help in this range.

+1
Superscore 1580 means you need at least 800 or 790 in one subject. Kids who can do that typically have at least 750 on the other

There were several at our school who couldn’t cross that hurdle for the verbal. One was being recruited by MIT and JHU and fell off because of it.

Recruited athletes? They rescinded the offer because the SAT was 20 points too low??

Because they couldn’t meet a 750/750 threshold.

So a 740/790 wouldn't get in?

Might not move forward with the recruiting process. The coach will decide if they are worth taking a shot on but they would be the type of candidate that often doesn’t get in at MIT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:consider that there are probably more than 100,000 superscored 1580+ sat scorers applying to college every year, it isn't that impressive of a score.

No! 1580+ remains extremely difficult to get. Superscore doesn’t help in this range.

+1
Superscore 1580 means you need at least 800 or 790 in one subject. Kids who can do that typically have at least 750 on the other

There were several at our school who couldn’t cross that hurdle for the verbal. One was being recruited by MIT and JHU and fell off because of it.

Recruited athletes? They rescinded the offer because the SAT was 20 points too low??

Because they couldn’t meet a 750/750 threshold.

So a 740/790 wouldn't get in?

Might not move forward with the recruiting process. The coach will decide if they are worth taking a shot on but they would be the type of candidate that often doesn’t get in at MIT.

Depends on sport. It's fine for football and basketball.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Only about 3000 nationally have 1580+. This does not guarantee admissions to any T20 school. But I think the chances they got rejected by every T20 school is also low, maybe 10% probability? As long as they apply to a reasonable number of schools, they should get in somewhere in T20 or T25.

Nope. Too many test optional schools, which means less spots for 1580+ scorers. These universities aren't taking all the high scorers first, then the TOs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Needs to be 1540? I doubt it. They will accept A great score will help but there will be plenty of kids in the 25-50% score range accepted among those 3000 kids. They aren't going to give up their priorities to maximize test scores.

True. The point is when they take a low score they will correspondingly take a high score to correct the distribution. The more low scores they are taking, the more high scores to balance them out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:consider that there are probably more than 100,000 superscored 1580+ sat scorers applying to college every year, it isn't that impressive of a score.

No! 1580+ remains extremely difficult to get. Superscore doesn’t help in this range.

+1
Superscore 1580 means you need at least 800 or 790 in one subject. Kids who can do that typically have at least 750 on the other

There were several at our school who couldn’t cross that hurdle for the verbal. One was being recruited by MIT and JHU and fell off because of it.

Recruited athletes? They rescinded the offer because the SAT was 20 points too low??

Because they couldn’t meet a 750/750 threshold.

So a 740/790 wouldn't get in?

Might not move forward with the recruiting process. The coach will decide if they are worth taking a shot on but they would be the type of candidate that often doesn’t get in at MIT.

Depends on sport. It's fine for football and basketball.

It might be but neither of us know that. I would be a bit skeptical though given MIT doesn't have to deal with a conference wide recruiting framework like the NESCAC for one and MIT tends to be more flexible regarding women than men. I do know what both the AO and the coaches told us during my daughters recruiting process where she was offered support. I also know other kids who didn't progress in the recruiting process and the reason in both cases was the verbal SAT score.

How do I know (someone will ask)? There are no secrets when it comes to recruiting at an athletics powerhouse private high school and an elite club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Needs to be 1540? I doubt it. They will accept A great score will help but there will be plenty of kids in the 25-50% score range accepted among those 3000 kids. They aren't going to give up their priorities to maximize test scores.

True. The point is when they take a low score they will correspondingly take a high score to correct the distribution. The more low scores they are taking, the more high scores to balance them out.

exactly, not 3000 1540 scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This year JHU, Penn, and Cornell are test required.

Previously there are 3000 matriculates at these three schools who did not submit scores. That means this year the three schools combined need ADDITIONAL 3000 enrolled there to have scores. The average score for these ADDITIONAL 3000 need to be 1540.

So yes, I think it helps this year.

Needs to be 1540? I doubt it. They will accept A great score will help but there will be plenty of kids in the 25-50% score range accepted among those 3000 kids. They aren't going to give up their priorities to maximize test scores.

True. The point is when they take a low score they will correspondingly take a high score to correct the distribution. The more low scores they are taking, the more high scores to balance them out.

exactly, not 3000 1540 scores.

What does this mean? I'm losing track of this new math