Are public school teachers better than private school teachers

[Anonymous]

Not trying to start a fight, but from what I have seen, the best public school teachers seem to be better than the best at my dd's private school.
People say that private school teachers have more freedom than those in public school, but to me, there is no difference since in private school, they try so hard to keep parents happy that they're not able to say what needs to be said about a particular child.
My ideal school would hire from the publis schools and give the same salaries and bennies w/o the unions.

[Anonymous]

Something to think about.....I was hired to teach at a private school BEFORE I completed my Bachelor's Degree. The school was able to hire me by calling me a "permanent sub". I was teaching a high school science class in a respected private school without a degree. I was 21 years old.

That would never happen in a public school.

[Anonymous]

On the other hand, simply getting a degree in elementary education with a low 'B' average from a crappy college that accepts all teens who apply doesn't make you better at teaching. ie, the public school certification process doesn't demand a lot.

I have two relatives who are certified teachers in early elementary, who work in the best school district in a Midwestern state that routinely puts up the best #s for ACT, SAT and CATs. Both relatives are quite dumb, although I will grant that they are good at handling younger kids. I bet 11:46 teaching @ age 21 was at least as decent as these two women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:On the other hand, simply getting a degree in elementary education with a low 'B' average from a crappy college that accepts all teens who apply doesn't make you better at teaching. ie, the public school certification process doesn't demand a lot.

I have two relatives who are certified teachers in early elementary, who work in the best school district in a Midwestern state that routinely puts up the best #s for ACT, SAT and CATs. Both relatives are quite dumb, although I will grant that they are good at handling younger kids. I bet 11:46 teaching @ age 21 was at least as decent as these two women.

Why do you assume 14:46 is smarter than your relatives? She's said absolutely nothing about her own qualifications or where she went to college. (And this is not meant to detract from 14:46, who may actually be a genius, rather it's to challenge your own assumptions.)

Plus, a 21-year-old has very little idea how to manage a classroom, whatever her qualifications, while somebody who went to a teaching college is taught some of these class-management skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:On the other hand, simply getting a degree in elementary education with a low 'B' average from a crappy college that accepts all teens who apply doesn't make you better at teaching. ie, the public school certification process doesn't demand a lot.

I have two relatives who are certified teachers in early elementary, who work in the best school district in a Midwestern state that routinely puts up the best #s for ACT, SAT and CATs. Both relatives are quite dumb, although I will grant that they are good at handling younger kids. I bet 11:46 teaching @ age 21 was at least as decent as these two women.

Why don't you become a teacher? We need brighter, rather than "quite dumb" teachers handling younger kids, especially in the special needs classes.

[Anonymous]

The new public school teachers just graduating and entering the field in this area seem to go through some pretty impressive training in my opinion -- certainly compared with the teachers I had years ago.

I'm a public school teacher and my training was a joke. I have an undergraduate degree from an Ivy League college and a Masters in education from a state college -- the masters was completely useless, except for the student teaching and observation.

I entered the field before there were any Praxis exams, although I have since taken several. The Praxis exams are not easy, but the pass rate is set quite low. If you can't pass the Praxis exams, you really have no business teaching.

I think the pass rate should be set higher; however, there would be a teacher shortage if that happened, as most of the "best and brightest" in this nation simply aren't that interested in working as teachers for $40k starting salary.

[Anonymous]

Why do you assume 14:46 is smarter than your relatives? She's said absolutely nothing about her own qualifications or where she went to college. (And this is not meant to detract from 14:46, who may actually be a genius, rather it's to challenge your own assumptions.)

Plus, a 21-year-old has very little idea how to manage a classroom, whatever her qualifications, while somebody who went to a teaching college is taught some of these class-management skills.

I don't mind answering at all. I went to the University of Hawaii. - Elem. Ed with an emphasis on Early Childhood Development. I don't think I'm "dumb", but I guess if I were, I wouldn't know it. I am definitely not a genius. Classroom management was not a problem. I taught in what was considered a very good private high school. I didn't have any significant problems with behavior in any of my classes. I certainly wasn't qualified to teach Science at the high school level. I basically learned along with the kids. When I didn't have the answer to a specific question, I was honest about it. We figured it out together. The problem I have is simple: Because I taught in a private school, I was able to get around that fact that I hadn't even graduated from college yet and teach a high school Science class. That's just crazy and would never have happened in any public school system.

I went back to school later and got my Master's in Legal Studies. When my youngest is older, I think I might look into teaching at the high school level again. I enjoyed it much more than I expected to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:On the other hand, simply getting a degree in elementary education with a low 'B' average from a crappy college that accepts all teens who apply doesn't make you better at teaching. ie, the public school certification process doesn't demand a lot.

I have two relatives who are certified teachers in early elementary, who work in the best school district in a Midwestern state that routinely puts up the best #s for ACT, SAT and CATs. Both relatives are quite dumb, although I will grant that they are good at handling younger kids. I bet 11:46 teaching @ age 21 was at least as decent as these two women.

This depends on the state. It is exceedingly difficult to get certified to teach in Wisconsin - one of my friends failed the test three times and she is NOT dumb. It's really easy in IL, and it appears to be pretty easy in MD.

[Anonymous]

It depends on the person who is teaching. You cannot make a generalization like that-private vs. public. I believe good teaching is a combination of passion, instincts, personality AND training. Also, many younger teachers who are new to the field are very enthusiastic, which is a great quality. I will also say that I always wonder why so many people in this are jump to go private, when the school system here is generally good- of course everyone has their reasons (special needs, religion, proximity, etc.)

[Anonymous]

pp here- excuse the above typos.

[Anonymous]

I hope we get some responses from MCPS teachers here. FWIW, I have relatives and friends who teach at MCPS and they are well-educated, excellent teachers. MCPS gets the cream of the crop (at least among the jurisdictions in MD, DC and VA) since they pay the most. The ones graduating at the top of their class from the universities in MD with top scores on the teaching exam are offered open contracts --- which means they are guaranteed a position in an MCPS school (of course, they still need to go through the interview process and be chosen by the principal --- assuming there are positions). It's tough to get a job with MCPS currently, so it's safe to assume that most newbie teachers did an excellent job in college, etc. Plus, MCPS teachers are required to pursue advanced degrees or the equivalent (through regular grad level classes related to their field). And MCPS teachers can be assessed by the general public since class test scores are public (at least by grade level). None of this happens in private schools ---even the "best" ones. FWIW, I went to private school in MoCo K-12 and while I had some excellent high school teachers (who had advanced degrees in the subject matter they taught), my elementary school teachers were mediocre at best. And I know a few private school teachers in DC and MD who weren't hired by MCPS so they went the private school route (and I know a few more who went back to teaching at a private school b/c it's easier than dealing with MCPS).

[Anonymous]

I think it really depends on a number of factors. I have taught in both private and public schools. Teaching is both an art and science - simply knowing your discipline is not enough, nor is passion/enthusiasm enough. The best teachers are both content experts and also have interpersonal skills and can implement the best theories of learning in their classes. I have seen excellent teachers in both private and public schools - as well as really bad teachers in both. Public schools generally pay much better than privates - but the privates *usually* offer much better working conditions. A number of top teachers are willing to trade off more money for actually enjoying their jobs.

I personally enjoy teaching in private school more than I did in public school. While at my public, I spent most of my time dealing with discipline issues, pointless mandatory meetings, and pushing paperwork. When at my private school, I felt like I could actually spend my time teaching.

[Anonymous]

Have you read the Nick Kristoff op-ed on paying teachers more? He links to a study that shows that education degrees only help performance for the few few years of teaching, after that, it doesn't have an impact compared to teachers who don't have that training. The other relevant factor is that most ed majors have the lowest SATs at a university, so taking the "top" ed majors, doesn't amount to much.

My experience at excellent private schools is that these schools can attract amazing teachers from top private universities and colleges because 1) these schools have a reputation for smart students and involved families, which make teaching easier; 2) they invest in teacher training and enrichment; 3) they can provide subsidized housing for young faculty; 4) they don't have to deal with gov't bureaucracy; 5) facilities and material support are fantastic. There is also an attitude that while good teachers can be born, they are also made. There is a lot more structured mentoring, which is extremely valuable for new faculty.

That being said, I think that this is true for the very best privates (e.g., Sidwell, GDS, Maret, etc.), I don't think that this is the case for all privates. You can't just lump all private schools together--or all public schools together for that matter--and say that one group of teachers is better than the other.

If I were to venture a guess, I'd say that any school with high SES for its families, public or private, is going to have great teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have you read the Nick Kristoff op-ed on paying teachers more? He links to a study that shows that education degrees only help performance for the few few years of teaching, after that, it doesn't have an impact compared to teachers who don't have that training. The other relevant factor is that most ed majors have the lowest SATs at a university, so taking the "top" ed majors, doesn't amount to much.

My experience at excellent private schools is that these schools can attract amazing teachers from top private universities and colleges because 1) these schools have a reputation for smart students and involved families, which make teaching easier; 2) they invest in teacher training and enrichment; 3) they can provide subsidized housing for young faculty; 4) they don't have to deal with gov't bureaucracy; 5) facilities and material support are fantastic. There is also an attitude that while good teachers can be born, they are also made. There is a lot more structured mentoring, which is extremely valuable for new faculty.

That being said, I think that this is true for the very best privates (e.g., Sidwell, GDS, Maret, etc.), I don't think that this is the case for all privates. You can't just lump all private schools together--or all public schools together for that matter--and say that one group of teachers is better than the other.

If I were to venture a guess, I'd say that any school with high SES for its families, public or private, is going to have great teachers.

EXACTLY-!!!!!That is why this thread is a little bit of a pet peeve for me. It is not like comparing apples to oranges but fruits to vegetables.

[Anonymous]

My sister-in-law failed the exam to become an English teacher in Virginia several times. So she got a job in a private school. I would hate to have her teaching my kids.