Reza Aslan: Sam Harris and "New Atheists" aren't new, aren't even atheists

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dawkins and Harris’s fans found this page quick quick, didn’t they?

Well given the title of the thread that's not too surprising is it?

[Anonymous]

Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

Bad logic

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

Bad logic

Good evidence.

[Anonymous]

This is basically every country that mandates atheism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But again; no atheist, agnostic, or anti-theist posting here wants to live in a country with state mandated atheism. It’s really quite ironic and highly hypocritical.

True -- it's just scaremonger Christian apologist proselytizer going nuts over non-existent state mandated athiesm, which even China doesn't have.

[Anonymous]

Man this guy is really beating the hell out of the Chinese government officials that frequent this forum.

They must be feeling so beaten down right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Man this guy is really beating the hell out of the Chinese government officials that frequent this forum.

They must be feeling so beaten down right now.

I really don't think there are any atheist countries. Not as the leading state principle anyway. Now compare with all the theocracies in the world. In Pakistan, for example, being Christian is a crime.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

Bad logic

Good evidence.

But ... evidence of WHAT? Toward what end?

Is it possible that it stinks to have a govt impose a religious belief OR lack of belief on the populace .... AND that there's no particular evidence that the god of isaac and abraham actually exists?

Maybe there's no proof of any god ... nor is there a compelling way to prove the negative ... and it's intrusive for a govt mandate beliefs one way or the other w/r/t the unprovable?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

Bad logic

Good evidence.

But ... evidence of WHAT? Toward what end?

Is it possible that it stinks to have a govt impose a religious belief OR lack of belief on the populace .... AND that there's no particular evidence that the god of isaac and abraham actually exists?

Maybe there's no proof of any god ... nor is there a compelling way to prove the negative ... and it's intrusive for a govt mandate beliefs one way or the other w/r/t the unprovable?

There is no proof of god -- that's why having faith is so important in religion. And why people are always looking for "signs" and interpreting things that happen as works of God. Its all they have to go on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“The great Enlightenment thinkers Voltaire, David Hume, Thomas Hobbes and John Locke were severely critical of institutional religion, viewing it as a destructive force in society. But they did not explicitly reject God’s existence, nor were they opposed to the idea of religious belief. (There were, of course, numerous other Enlightenment figures who professed atheism, such as Jean Meslier and the French philosopher Baron d’Holbach.) On the contrary, they recognized the inherent value of religious belief in fostering social cohesion and maintaining order, and so sought a means of replacing religion as the basis for making moral judgments in European society. It was political transformation they wanted, not religious reform.

Yet in the century that followed the Enlightenment, a stridently militant form of atheism arose that merged the Enlightenment’s criticism of institutional religion with the strict empiricism of the scientific revolution to not only reject belief in God, but to actively oppose it. By the middle of the 19th century, this movement was given its own name – anti-theism – specifically to differentiate it from atheism.

It was around this time that anti-theism reached its peak in the writings of the German philosophers Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels. Marx famously viewed religion as the “opium of the people” and sought to eradicate it from society. “The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness,” Marx wrote in his celebrated critique of Hegel.

In truth, Marx’s views on religion and atheism were far more complex than these much-abused sound bites project. Nevertheless, Marx’s vision of a religion-less society was spectacularly realized with the establishment of the Soviet Union and the People’s Republic of China – two nations that actively promoted “state atheism” by violently suppressing religious expression and persecuting faith communities.“


State atheism seems like the opposite of state religion, but in a way, state atheism becomes a religion itself, without being a religion. The state becomes the religion and whomever is in charge at the head of government becomes the “god.” Those atheist regimes kill a lot of people, their own people.

This is all bullshit, and you know it, as there are no "atheist regimes" who commit atrocities in the name of atheism.

Atrocities done in the name of religion are extraordinarily plentiful, though, so unless you want to start listing them and get embarrassed, I suggest you drop that failed argument.

It’s almost like you don’t have an honest bone in your body. Nothing in the quoted passage (which I didn’t post) said atrocities are committed “in the name of atheism” (your slippery phrasing). It said the atheist states committed atrocities. There’s a big difference, and you know it.

Do better.

So what you’re saying is that humans commit atrocities and not even faith in a god or gods and fear of divine retribution serves to prevent humans from committing these moral atrocities?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man this guy is really beating the hell out of the Chinese government officials that frequent this forum.

They must be feeling so beaten down right now.

I really don't think there are any atheist countries. Not as the leading state principle anyway. Now compare with all the theocracies in the world. In Pakistan, for example, being Christian is a crime.

There are atheist countries. The countries that everyone tries to escape from; the countries that have hidden, modern day genocide.



The countries that install facial recognition software to identify Christians who attend worship services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine how bad atheism really is if atheists and anti-theists don’t even want to live in countries that are atheistic. Every country that mandates atheism is a of nightmare place to live. Why?

Bad logic

Good evidence.

No it's not. No one wants mandated anything. This is so specious I don't know where to start.

I wouldn't mi d living in a country where the plurality of people are atheists by choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man this guy is really beating the hell out of the Chinese government officials that frequent this forum.

They must be feeling so beaten down right now.

I really don't think there are any atheist countries. Not as the leading state principle anyway. Now compare with all the theocracies in the world. In Pakistan, for example, being Christian is a crime.

There are atheist countries. The countries that everyone tries to escape from; the countries that have hidden, modern day genocide.



The countries that install facial recognition software to identify Christians who attend worship services.

Ah! so according to this unsourced poster (none of the supposed links go anywhere), there are large numbers of Christians attending church in China.

Who to believe -- poster who says Christianity is outlawed in China or poster who acknowledges the presence of Christians and churches in China?

Perhaps they are one and the same. Contradictions are not unusual among zealots.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man this guy is really beating the hell out of the Chinese government officials that frequent this forum.

They must be feeling so beaten down right now.

I really don't think there are any atheist countries. Not as the leading state principle anyway. Now compare with all the theocracies in the world. In Pakistan, for example, being Christian is a crime.

In countries that Christianity and Christians are persecuted, many times all religions that exist within that country (besides the “official religion” or state mandated atheism) are persecuted. The people who live in those countries do not have freedom of worship, thought, speech, expression, or self-determination. It’s really unbelievable that such places exist still.






https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/ewelinaochab/2021/01/13/one-in-eight-christians-worldwide-live-in-countries-where-they-would-be-persecuted/amp/

Also, the United States of course is not perfect, but we have laws that protect our citizens and are extremely tolerant compared to the rest of the world regarding these issues.