Housing prices have gone insane

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The poster about Annapolis is not entirely wrong...although he/she comes across a bit rough. However, I'm sure he/she is fed up with people arguing with him/her about their choices.

WFH is real, it's here, now, and it's not gonna go away. We're seeing a seismic shift in the American culture. I'm not saying cities/dense urban areas are gonna die, but their value proposition is diminishing. I suspect a few years from now, these so called urban areas will be a lot more "cheaper" in many different ways than they had been until 2019.

And yes, I think the big house, with a big lot, a bit (or more) further out, is gonna be back in vogue. It has to be. It makes sense. Technology has outpaced the need to be near your job, for a lot of jobs. We'll be seeing the real world effects of that in the next few years.

WFH is not the panacea you think. Companies can’t work with all work remotes just IC work that requires little collaboration or innovation. We have coasted this year off a) prior dynamics established in person and b) working more hours b/c we have nothing better to do.

Jobs like the accountant who just tabulates data, sure they may stay WFH unless there are security breaches and all of a sudden financial data is air gapped at the HQ.

Of course DCUM folks are in denial about the changing nature of jobs. They don’t want potential house hunters lurking the forum to be steered away to other areas by the reality. Irl, everyone, real estate agents included, are acknowledging that the increase in WFH are going to drastically flip property values in the next few years. My wife has been job searching, and about 70% of the jobs she came across are permanently 100% WFH or partially permanently WFH. WFH has been increasing in DC BEFORE the pandemic even started, and it has been increasing specifically because of rising house costs and commutes getting more lengthy. This NPR article from 2019 highlights that 35% of DC commuters were already teleworking occasionally or frequently in 2019, which is 16% higher than what it was in 2007. I wouldn’t be surprised if the pandemic alone hikes that number up to 55% over the next year, and with the augmentation of increased commutes/housing costs, I could easily see it topping off at 60%. I also think that this forum distorts the reality regarding how long the average DC worker is willing to commute to work. Those commuting 31-60+ minutes make up 60% of DC commuters, with 15% of that being in the 60+ minute category. Those with a commute of 30 minutes or less are in the minority. So while yes, while longer commutes are associated with a lot of negatives, more and more employers are working to combat those negatives, especially with increased remote working. I don’t know why people on DCUM deny this reality. The whole point of working hard and earning money is to be able to fund an enjoyable and laidback lifestyle, not to be so glued to your job that you feel the need to overpay for a house so you can be near it. Of course people will choose waterfront communities, bigger homes, and newer subdivisions when they have the choice. https://www.npr.org/local/305/2020/01/24/799292338/d-c-has-some-of-the-longest-commutes-in-the-country-what-help-is-available

The whole point of people returning from outer suburbs to the city was that it was cheaper and close to jobs. People started becoming attracted to living modestly and having modest prices. The modest prices don’t exist anymore, and they’re pushing more and more people out. Even people with high incomes are going, because the amount of people willing to pay $1M for a house like that is small, despite what the DCUM bubble thinks. It’s not “modest living” and “humble” to pay $1M for a $200k quality home. That’s called “stupid living.” That’s why you guys are always having panic attacks about school redistricting and jobs moving virtually every single day, because one little change can cause your property values to plummet. You chose to buy an overvalued home, which is very unwise. I don’t have to ever worry about that, because 70% of my property’s value comes from my house itself and the land it’s on. I have water access and I’m near Annapolis, which is sought after for its prestigious water culture that isn’t going anywhere. The universities and hospitals in Baltimore are not going anywhere either. The Fort Meade base is it not going anywhere.. We have some of the best school pyramids in the region. Howard County schools are desirable, even their worst schools would be considered okay/average schools in Montgomery County. Anne Arundel has many high-achieving school pyramids: Severna Park, Broadneck, Arundel, and South River. The new Crofton High School should be up in the high ranks as well, and it was already a sellers market for the schools before the high school even opened. The incomes in these central regions have increased at higher rates over the last 3 years than the incomes in the inner burbs have. The incomes in Frederick County have shot up at higher rates over the last 3 years than inner burb incomes as well.

It must take a lot of brain-power to convince yourself that the average person would actually choose living in a $1M shitshack for some goddamn public schools and a somewhat shorter commute over a nice house, possibly with water access, and just as good (if not better) schools. I’m impressed. It has nothing to do with wanting to show off, and everything to do with paying for actual quality living and a laidback lifestyle. Reading the personal finances subsection of this forum, it seems that whatever negative mental affects are spared from having a shorter commute by living an in inner burn are significantly outweighed by the “keeping up with the jonses” mentality. You guys seemingly have very depressed lifestyles and are way too focused about what your neighbors are doing and how much money they make, and constantly complain about feeling poor while having a $450k income. It’s pathetic and miserable sounding, I’ll pass.

[Anonymous]

PP clearly had to get his manifesto off his chest.

I’m sorry the most tech focused companies have congregated together for decades, and did more and more to keep their employees ON CAMPUS such as free dinners and dry cleaning.

Yes some jobs that are rote and IC focused will be sent packing, but most that was outsourced anywhere (like Zenefits and the like).

Just b/c we can kinda see each other’s faces now no way replaces in person discussions, shoulder to shoulder training, or a true shared workspace like a pad of paper or whiteboard. Maybe in 10-15 years we will have full immersion VR with suspended body rigs ala Ready Player One, but the resolution and processing required to render that is enormous and will require cabled power and such ungainly hardware.

And you should talk to Comcast about your brave new ALL VIRTUAL world.

[Anonymous]

Even if my job or DH’s was 100% remote which it definitely will not be (I could work 2-3 days remote already, he could work 1) I’d still choose where I’m living in Alexandria city. I love the proximity to everything. Sure there was a premium but we didn’t just move here to be close to our job. This allows us to live with just one car, with a smaller footprint house which we wanted anyways, a within walking distance to plenty, 10-15 minute drive or public transport from anything I need: stores, restaurants, museums, theaters, and live in a diverse community. On the days I do commute, I’m there and back sooner. For me, living here isn’t just about work. I have no idea what will happen to housing prices, right now it’s clear there isn’t a lot of SFH inventory and that could change as attitudes shift. But we are staying put, and would not have made a different decision. I do think the shift remote for a lot of white collar workers will allow people who can’t or don’t want to purchase close in to move further. But I doubt demand for SFH will soften so much close in that we see an absolute cratering of prices and suddenly you can buy a $900k house in Arlington for $600k or less. But honestly, no crystal ball in this situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The poster about Annapolis is not entirely wrong...although he/she comes across a bit rough. However, I'm sure he/she is fed up with people arguing with him/her about their choices.

WFH is real, it's here, now, and it's not gonna go away. We're seeing a seismic shift in the American culture. I'm not saying cities/dense urban areas are gonna die, but their value proposition is diminishing. I suspect a few years from now, these so called urban areas will be a lot more "cheaper" in many different ways than they had been until 2019.

And yes, I think the big house, with a big lot, a bit (or more) further out, is gonna be back in vogue. It has to be. It makes sense. Technology has outpaced the need to be near your job, for a lot of jobs. We'll be seeing the real world effects of that in the next few years.

WFH is not the panacea you think. Companies can’t work with all work remotes just IC work that requires little collaboration or innovation. We have coasted this year off a) prior dynamics established in person and b) working more hours b/c we have nothing better to do.

Jobs like the accountant who just tabulates data, sure they may stay WFH unless there are security breaches and all of a sudden financial data is air gapped at the HQ.

Of course DCUM folks are in denial about the changing nature of jobs. They don’t want potential house hunters lurking the forum to be steered away to other areas by the reality. Irl, everyone, real estate agents included, are acknowledging that the increase in WFH are going to drastically flip property values in the next few years. My wife has been job searching, and about 70% of the jobs she came across are permanently 100% WFH or partially permanently WFH. WFH has been increasing in DC BEFORE the pandemic even started, and it has been increasing specifically because of rising house costs and commutes getting more lengthy. This NPR article from 2019 highlights that 35% of DC commuters were already teleworking occasionally or frequently in 2019, which is 16% higher than what it was in 2007. I wouldn’t be surprised if the pandemic alone hikes that number up to 55% over the next year, and with the augmentation of increased commutes/housing costs, I could easily see it topping off at 60%. I also think that this forum distorts the reality regarding how long the average DC worker is willing to commute to work. Those commuting 31-60+ minutes make up 60% of DC commuters, with 15% of that being in the 60+ minute category. Those with a commute of 30 minutes or less are in the minority. So while yes, while longer commutes are associated with a lot of negatives, more and more employers are working to combat those negatives, especially with increased remote working. I don’t know why people on DCUM deny this reality. The whole point of working hard and earning money is to be able to fund an enjoyable and laidback lifestyle, not to be so glued to your job that you feel the need to overpay for a house so you can be near it. Of course people will choose waterfront communities, bigger homes, and newer subdivisions when they have the choice. https://www.npr.org/local/305/2020/01/24/799292338/d-c-has-some-of-the-longest-commutes-in-the-country-what-help-is-available

The whole point of people returning from outer suburbs to the city was that it was cheaper and close to jobs. People started becoming attracted to living modestly and having modest prices. The modest prices don’t exist anymore, and they’re pushing more and more people out. Even people with high incomes are going, because the amount of people willing to pay $1M for a house like that is small, despite what the DCUM bubble thinks. It’s not “modest living” and “humble” to pay $1M for a $200k quality home. That’s called “stupid living.” That’s why you guys are always having panic attacks about school redistricting and jobs moving virtually every single day, because one little change can cause your property values to plummet. You chose to buy an overvalued home, which is very unwise. I don’t have to ever worry about that, because 70% of my property’s value comes from my house itself and the land it’s on. I have water access and I’m near Annapolis, which is sought after for its prestigious water culture that isn’t going anywhere. The universities and hospitals in Baltimore are not going anywhere either. The Fort Meade base is it not going anywhere.. We have some of the best school pyramids in the region. Howard County schools are desirable, even their worst schools would be considered okay/average schools in Montgomery County. Anne Arundel has many high-achieving school pyramids: Severna Park, Broadneck, Arundel, and South River. The new Crofton High School should be up in the high ranks as well, and it was already a sellers market for the schools before the high school even opened. The incomes in these central regions have increased at higher rates over the last 3 years than the incomes in the inner burbs have. The incomes in Frederick County have shot up at higher rates over the last 3 years than inner burb incomes as well.

It must take a lot of brain-power to convince yourself that the average person would actually choose living in a $1M shitshack for some goddamn public schools and a somewhat shorter commute over a nice house, possibly with water access, and just as good (if not better) schools. I’m impressed. It has nothing to do with wanting to show off, and everything to do with paying for actual quality living and a laidback lifestyle. Reading the personal finances subsection of this forum, it seems that whatever negative mental affects are spared from having a shorter commute by living an in inner burn are significantly outweighed by the “keeping up with the jonses” mentality. You guys seemingly have very depressed lifestyles and are way too focused about what your neighbors are doing and how much money they make, and constantly complain about feeling poor while having a $450k income. It’s pathetic and miserable sounding, I’ll pass.

She’s baaaaaaaaccckk

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP clearly had to get his manifesto off his chest.

I’m sorry the most tech focused companies have congregated together for decades, and did more and more to keep their employees ON CAMPUS such as free dinners and dry cleaning.

Yes some jobs that are rote and IC focused will be sent packing, but most that was outsourced anywhere (like Zenefits and the like).

Just b/c we can kinda see each other’s faces now no way replaces in person discussions, shoulder to shoulder training, or a true shared workspace like a pad of paper or whiteboard. Maybe in 10-15 years we will have full immersion VR with suspended body rigs ala Ready Player One, but the resolution and processing required to render that is enormous and will require cabled power and such ungainly hardware.

And you should talk to Comcast about your brave new ALL VIRTUAL world.

I work for a local tech company and they just announced this week we are closing our offices, except for a new satellite space that will have a handful of jump seats and conference rooms/training space.

We are all officially remote....for long past the pandemic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Mouth of the Severn is back.

Actually, it’s the South River. Once again, the “cultured” and “educated” snobs can’t even get geography outside of the beltway correctly, but still feel like their opinions about them are correct.

No one cares where your boat is docked.

At least I have a boat. You have a dirty and traffic congested suburb that’s close to lots of industrial pollution. Instead of a boat, you have lifelong Xanax and Citalopram prescriptions needed to cure the DCUM “Help, I make $400k, but I feel poor because I can’t keep up with my neighbors making $800k” McLean/Bethesda/Potomac/Chevy Chase syndrome.

You need to get yourself some Xanax boo

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The point is, the only people who pay $1M to live in a house like that in McLean/Potomac/Bethesda/Chevy Chase are only doing so for prestige. They’re more desperate to make sure people know they’re rich than they are about owning actual luxury homes. That’s why they’re paying exorbitant prices for middle-class homes constructed in the 1970s and trying to justify their lame decision to do so.

It's actually the opposite. Some people need to feel like to show off a massive, "luxury" home, to show they're rich, so they keep driving until they find one they can afford. The folks in the 1970s "shitshack" value proximity to the city, culture, and amenities over a large, showy house.

This is completely true. We had considered moving out of Chevy chase for more land etc and the places father out seemed so desolate like little lonely islands where you need to use a car everywhere and people go to ugly strip malls for stuff. Except their houses sure are big.

[Anonymous]

I wonder how climate change will affect the “Annapolis” poster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP clearly had to get his manifesto off his chest.

I’m sorry the most tech focused companies have congregated together for decades, and did more and more to keep their employees ON CAMPUS such as free dinners and dry cleaning.

Yes some jobs that are rote and IC focused will be sent packing, but most that was outsourced anywhere (like Zenefits and the like).

Just b/c we can kinda see each other’s faces now no way replaces in person discussions, shoulder to shoulder training, or a true shared workspace like a pad of paper or whiteboard. Maybe in 10-15 years we will have full immersion VR with suspended body rigs ala Ready Player One, but the resolution and processing required to render that is enormous and will require cabled power and such ungainly hardware.

And you should talk to Comcast about your brave new ALL VIRTUAL world.

I work for a local tech company and they just announced this week we are closing our offices, except for a new satellite space that will have a handful of jump seats and conference rooms/training space.

We are all officially remote....for long past the pandemic.

DP.. I work in tech.. most of the big, established tech companes won't do FT remote permanently. I am working for a big tech now.

Yes, I know about FB and twitter, but Apple, Google, Microsoft - none of them have plans for FT remote permanently, and they employ a lot of people.

[Anonymous]

I predict housing prices will go down in 2021/2022 when there is a glut of short sales on the market. A real estate agent I spoke to recently said they are preparing for foreclosures and short sales next year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP clearly had to get his manifesto off his chest.

I’m sorry the most tech focused companies have congregated together for decades, and did more and more to keep their employees ON CAMPUS such as free dinners and dry cleaning.

Yes some jobs that are rote and IC focused will be sent packing, but most that was outsourced anywhere (like Zenefits and the like).

Just b/c we can kinda see each other’s faces now no way replaces in person discussions, shoulder to shoulder training, or a true shared workspace like a pad of paper or whiteboard. Maybe in 10-15 years we will have full immersion VR with suspended body rigs ala Ready Player One, but the resolution and processing required to render that is enormous and will require cabled power and such ungainly hardware.

And you should talk to Comcast about your brave new ALL VIRTUAL world.

I work for a local tech company and they just announced this week we are closing our offices, except for a new satellite space that will have a handful of jump seats and conference rooms/training space.

We are all officially remote....for long past the pandemic.

Local tech company? DC doesn’t have any innovative tech companies so that tracks. It’s all about selling “enterprise” slock products or services or worse technical contracting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Even if my job or DH’s was 100% remote which it definitely will not be (I could work 2-3 days remote already, he could work 1) I’d still choose where I’m living in Alexandria city. I love the proximity to everything. Sure there was a premium but we didn’t just move here to be close to our job. This allows us to live with just one car, with a smaller footprint house which we wanted anyways, a within walking distance to plenty, 10-15 minute drive or public transport from anything I need: stores, restaurants, museums, theaters, and live in a diverse community. On the days I do commute, I’m there and back sooner. For me, living here isn’t just about work. I have no idea what will happen to housing prices, right now it’s clear there isn’t a lot of SFH inventory and that could change as attitudes shift. But we are staying put, and would not have made a different decision. I do think the shift remote for a lot of white collar workers will allow people who can’t or don’t want to purchase close in to move further. But I doubt demand for SFH will soften so much close in that we see an absolute cratering of prices and suddenly you can buy a $900k house in Arlington for $600k or less. But honestly, no crystal ball in this situation.

The prices will decline and look more similar to outer burb prices. I know DCUM doesn’t want to admit it, and of course everyone is going to be on here saying they prefer to live closer in, because 90% of this forum is closer in burb people. But in Facebook DC area parenting groups, which have people from all over the region, everyone is saying otherwise. Your anecdote doesn’t change the statistics as shown by the NPR article. 35% of DC area workers were already WFH even before the pandemic because of increased housing costs. Employers are “happy to make those changes” according to that article. So everyone can deny it all they want, but the majority of jobs in DC probably will be virtual. This is not to mention that fact that some companies have been leaving the DC area altogether because they have had trouble recruiting people because of housing prices. Discovery Inc moved to Knoxville. You may chose to live closer in regardless, but the vast majority of DC area workers wouldn’t. That’s why the median-incomes in the outer burbs grew at higher rates than inner burbs median incomes did over the past 3 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The point is, the only people who pay $1M to live in a house like that in McLean/Potomac/Bethesda/Chevy Chase are only doing so for prestige. They’re more desperate to make sure people know they’re rich than they are about owning actual luxury homes. That’s why they’re paying exorbitant prices for middle-class homes constructed in the 1970s and trying to justify their lame decision to do so.

It's actually the opposite. Some people need to feel like to show off a massive, "luxury" home, to show they're rich, so they keep driving until they find one they can afford. The folks in the 1970s "shitshack" value proximity to the city, culture, and amenities over a large, showy house.

This is completely true. We had considered moving out of Chevy chase for more land etc and the places father out seemed so desolate like little lonely islands where you need to use a car everywhere and people go to ugly strip malls for stuff. Except their houses sure are big.

Please tell me what “culture” Chevy Chase has over Annapolis, Baltimore, or Ellicott City. Is the culture moving in an ugly $1M house in hopes to become associated with the super rich people in multi-million gated mansions who are likely involved in big politics, even though those people don’t want anything to do with you and send their kids to private schools? Is it crying because you can’t keep up with Cassie from Long Island, NY who sends her kids to Georgetown Prep, while you have to resort to BCC? Most of the houses in Chevy Chase look like cheap fraternity houses and I feel like I’m in Towson whenever I have to drive through it. Also lol @ “ugly suburban strip malls,” when Chevy Chase and NW DC are just high density suburbs that have everything generic that suburban strip malls do, except they trying to make it seem “urban,” which ends up so ugly and run down. It looks so messy, unplanned, and ugly. All the commercial stuff along 185 looks so terrible. Most people don’t like living in places that always have heavy traffic from people using the roads to get to DC, never-ending and heavy road construction, industrial pollution, and squashed together houses with narrow streets that aren’t friendly for children playing. Nobody is paying $1M for homes like the one in OP that are a step above section 8 housing. Get real. Whoever the realtor is is desperately trying to make it seem popular. It was “contingent,” then “pending,” now “contingent” again. It will probably be withdrawn from the market and then show up again 4 months later with an $850k asking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Mouth of the Severn is back.

Actually, it’s the South River. Once again, the “cultured” and “educated” snobs can’t even get geography outside of the beltway correctly, but still feel like their opinions about them are correct.

No one cares where your boat is docked.

At least I have a boat. You have a dirty and traffic congested suburb that’s close to lots of industrial pollution. Instead of a boat, you have lifelong Xanax and Citalopram prescriptions needed to cure the DCUM “Help, I make $400k, but I feel poor because I can’t keep up with my neighbors making $800k” McLean/Bethesda/Potomac/Chevy Chase syndrome.

You need to get yourself some Xanax boo

Even by DCUM standards, he is a major head case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Mouth of the Severn is back.

Actually, it’s the South River. Once again, the “cultured” and “educated” snobs can’t even get geography outside of the beltway correctly, but still feel like their opinions about them are correct.

No one cares where your boat is docked.

At least I have a boat. You have a dirty and traffic congested suburb that’s close to lots of industrial pollution. Instead of a boat, you have lifelong Xanax and Citalopram prescriptions needed to cure the DCUM “Help, I make $400k, but I feel poor because I can’t keep up with my neighbors making $800k” McLean/Bethesda/Potomac/Chevy Chase syndrome.

You need to get yourself some Xanax boo

Even by DCUM standards, he is a major head case.

You’re right. Maybe I need to do some yoga, shop at Moms Organic, and eat some factory made naan so I can get cultured.