MCPS Boundary Study Meeting Tonight (12/11) at Julius West @ 7pm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But that doesn’t mean they need a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity.

I’m all for switching boundaries for utilization.

Good news! There are no plans for "a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity." None. No plans. NO. PLANS.

[Anonymous]

Really? That’s not what the activists say. Not is it what was originally in the contract with the consultant.

So you can see why the parents are concerned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But that doesn’t mean they need a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity.

I’m all for switching boundaries for utilization.

Good news! There are no plans for "a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity." None. No plans. NO. PLANS.

Not true.

One of the goals is to increase ‘diversity’. Don’t you read MCPS communication?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Really? That’s not what the activists say. Not is it what was originally in the contract with the consultant.

So you can see why the parents are concerned.

You mean, the people who were yelling and heckling at the meeting last night?

Here's the MCPS Request for Proposals: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/procurement/uploads/4886.1/4886.1%20RFP%20FINAL%20.pdf

Here's the consultant's proposal: https://www.scribd.com/document/427753221/Boundary-Analysis-Proposal-WXY-Architecture#from_embed

If you have a copy of the contract, please link to it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But that doesn’t mean they need a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity.

I’m all for switching boundaries for utilization.

Good news! There are no plans for "a countywide redistricting based especially on diversity." None. No plans. NO. PLANS.

Not true.

One of the goals is to increase ‘diversity’. Don’t you read MCPS communication?

I read the MCPS communication. It said nothing about county-wide boundary changes. It also said nothing about "based especially on diversity."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I do not understand why this is so difficult for people.

-White and Asian kids do just as well academically regardless of the SES or racial demo of a school. If anything, being in a higher FARMs demo would make it easier for them to get into elite schools.

-Studies show White kids in particular actually benefit the most from being in SES and racially diverse schools. Go figure. Most white kids in America go to deeply segregated schools that does not reflect the world they will deal with when they become an adult.

-Residents are entitled to free public school, but they are not entitled to a particular school. If parents have a problem with this, they can do like the rest of white americans and can isolate their kids in a private school.

-You are free to pay for specialized enrichment activities for your child on your own dime.

Don't let your fear of brown and black people and your perception of their respective "cultures" blind you from basic facts.

I’m brown, but that sounds like complete BS. First off, impossible to truly measure this anyway - too many variable.

You don’t help your cause by posting BS comments that you pretend are facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really? That’s not what the activists say. Not is it what was originally in the contract with the consultant.

So you can see why the parents are concerned.

You mean, the people who were yelling and heckling at the meeting last night?

Here's the MCPS Request for Proposals: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/procurement/uploads/4886.1/4886.1%20RFP%20FINAL%20.pdf

Here's the consultant's proposal: https://www.scribd.com/document/427753221/Boundary-Analysis-Proposal-WXY-Architecture#from_embed

If you have a copy of the contract, please link to it.

You see, that’s the problem. The consultant said last night that they made a change to the SOW to take out the county-wide boundary recommendation language that everyone is upset about BUT THEY CANT SHARE THAT WITH US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really? That’s not what the activists say. Not is it what was originally in the contract with the consultant.

So you can see why the parents are concerned.

You mean, the people who were yelling and heckling at the meeting last night?

Here's the MCPS Request for Proposals: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/procurement/uploads/4886.1/4886.1%20RFP%20FINAL%20.pdf

Here's the consultant's proposal: https://www.scribd.com/document/427753221/Boundary-Analysis-Proposal-WXY-Architecture#from_embed

If you have a copy of the contract, please link to it.

You see, that’s the problem. The consultant said last night that they made a change to the SOW to take out the county-wide boundary recommendation language that everyone is upset about BUT THEY CANT SHARE THAT WITH US.

OK, so you don't know what's in the contract.

In that case, please stop telling us what's in the contract. Because you don't know what's in the contract.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do not understand why this is so difficult for people.

-White and Asian kids do just as well academically regardless of the SES or racial demo of a school. If anything, being in a higher FARMs demo would make it easier for them to get into elite schools.

-Studies show White kids in particular actually benefit the most from being in SES and racially diverse schools. Go figure. Most white kids in America go to deeply segregated schools that does not reflect the world they will deal with when they become an adult.

-Residents are entitled to free public school, but they are not entitled to a particular school. If parents have a problem with this, they can do like the rest of white americans and can isolate their kids in a private school.

-You are free to pay for specialized enrichment activities for your child on your own dime.

Don't let your fear of brown and black people and your perception of their respective "cultures" blind you from basic facts.

Can you link the studies?

NP here but this study was in the email we all got from MCPS. https://tcf.org/content/facts/the-benefits-of-socioeconomically-and-racially-integrated-schools-and-classrooms/?session=1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do not understand why this is so difficult for people.

-White and Asian kids do just as well academically regardless of the SES or racial demo of a school. If anything, being in a higher FARMs demo would make it easier for them to get into elite schools.

-Studies show White kids in particular actually benefit the most from being in SES and racially diverse schools. Go figure. Most white kids in America go to deeply segregated schools that does not reflect the world they will deal with when they become an adult.

-Residents are entitled to free public school, but they are not entitled to a particular school. If parents have a problem with this, they can do like the rest of white americans and can isolate their kids in a private school.

-You are free to pay for specialized enrichment activities for your child on your own dime.

Don't let your fear of brown and black people and your perception of their respective "cultures" blind you from basic facts.

Can you link the studies?

NP here but this study was in the email we all got from MCPS. https://tcf.org/content/facts/the-benefits-of-socioeconomically-and-racially-integrated-schools-and-classrooms/?session=1

So here's where it would be nice to have a reasonable conversation/discussion. I believe in research. But I don't necessarily believe that those studies are using the same definitions of "integrated" "high-poverty" and "affluent" across studies, or that people advocating for change want to use in this County. I agree and believe that concentrated poverty is bad for schools. But what does "concentrated poverty" or "high-poverty" mean? Is 40% impoverished "high"? Only 80%+? Each study defines it differently. Some studies compare students in 80% impoverished schools with those in <20% impoverished schools. MCPS cannot distribute its population so that ALL schools are <20% FARMs. What about the 20-80% schools? Do they improve achievement gaps or not? Also, a lot of the studies compare places where the tax base and school funding are not shared between the "high" and "low" poverty schools - town systems where towns next to each other have very different resources to devote to their schools. That is at least not true of MCPS elementary schools, where high poverty schools receive more funding for lower class sizes and additional instructional specialists.

Basically, I don't think the studies necessarily support the idea that the current MCPS achievement gap will be improved by as many schools as possible being as close to the full-County percentages in terms of racial and SES demographics. I'd be interested in whether people more familiar with the studies think that they apply to MCPS in this way. Honestly, I would be ok with sending my kids to any of the schools closest to my home (of which there are multiple MS and HS - we are walkers only to our ES). I might lose money on my house if the boundaries change, but I care more about my kids' education than about the value of our home. I think they can get a good education at any of these schools and that there are benefits to not living in a bubble of privilege. But I don't see how getting each school closer to countywide percentages will solve the persistent achievement gap and I also don't think that boundary changes will solve our capacity problems. Schools cannot run at exactly 100% capacity all the time. MCPS itself says ideal is 80-100% capacity, and there are very few schools in the County that are below 80% capacity. I'm sure some improvement can be made, but there is no magic bullet solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At the meeting tonight, there's a poster on Students Not Assigned To Closest School -

ES: 37% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
MS: 45% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
HS: 38% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school

That's CURRENTLY in MCPS.

Those are the boundaries that people want to maintain because they want "neighborhood schools."

How is this even possible? I call BS.
Kids who are bussed away from their closest school are special ed and magnet students, I'll give you that, but, looking at our catchment area, there's no way almost half of my child's middle school schoolmates live closer to another middle school. No way.

Maybe not in your catchment, but yours is shockingly not the only one. Off the top of my head, and just in my broader neighborhood:

Takoma Park kids that attend SSIMS instead of TPMS (for the subsection of Takoma Park that attends RTES).

SSIMS kids zoned for Northwood instead of Blair.

Kids zoned for Northwood who are much closer to Wheaton.

Taken all together, and assuming this is not the only cluster, I can absolutely believe that many kids are not in the nearest school. Which is fine! The boundaries need to be somewhere, and they need to take into consideration all sorts of factors, including weird historical stuff like the fact that Blair used to be somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I do not understand why this is so difficult for people.

-White and Asian kids do just as well academically regardless of the SES or racial demo of a school. If anything, being in a higher FARMs demo would make it easier for them to get into elite schools.

-Studies show White kids in particular actually benefit the most from being in SES and racially diverse schools. Go figure. Most white kids in America go to deeply segregated schools that does not reflect the world they will deal with when they become an adult.

-Residents are entitled to free public school, but they are not entitled to a particular school. If parents have a problem with this, they can do like the rest of white americans and can isolate their kids in a private school.

-You are free to pay for specialized enrichment activities for your child on your own dime.

Don't let your fear of brown and black people and your perception of their respective "cultures" blind you from basic facts.

My UMC kids are at two different DCC high schools. I would send them again, no regrets, but please do share these studies that show "white" students benefit from schools with racial and SES diversity. To my knowledge there are no good studies that show this. What are they measuring? School performance? I think there are benefits, but they are not things easily quantifiable.

Well they certainly aren't hurt by it. So all this fuss about mixing with black and brown kids has much less to do with academic performance and more to do with unsubstantiated "beliefs". It would be nice to see studies proving why we should *not* work to integrate both racially and SES.


White students’ test scores don’t drop when they go to schools with large numbers of black and Latino students.

https://nces.ed.gov/nationsreportcard/subject/studies/pdf/school_composition_and_the_bw_achievement_gap_2015.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At the meeting tonight, there's a poster on Students Not Assigned To Closest School -

ES: 37% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
MS: 45% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
HS: 38% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school

That's CURRENTLY in MCPS.

Those are the boundaries that people want to maintain because they want "neighborhood schools."

How is this even possible? I call BS.
Kids who are bussed away from their closest school are special ed and magnet students, I'll give you that, but, looking at our catchment area, there's no way almost half of my child's middle school schoolmates live closer to another middle school. No way.

Maybe not in your catchment, but yours is shockingly not the only one. Off the top of my head, and just in my broader neighborhood:

Takoma Park kids that attend SSIMS instead of TPMS (for the subsection of Takoma Park that attends RTES).

SSIMS kids zoned for Northwood instead of Blair.

Kids zoned for Northwood who are much closer to Wheaton.

Taken all together, and assuming this is not the only cluster, I can absolutely believe that many kids are not in the nearest school. Which is fine! The boundaries need to be somewhere, and they need to take into consideration all sorts of factors, including weird historical stuff like the fact that Blair used to be somewhere else.

This is probably true at the margins of many school zones. Many people in the Bradley Hills neighborhood in Bethesda live extremely close to North Bethesda (which feeds to Walter Johnson) but go to Pyle/Whitman. Many people in Kensington are closer to Einstein but are bused to WJ. On the north end of the WJ feeding area, many people are probably closer to RM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At the meeting tonight, there's a poster on Students Not Assigned To Closest School -

ES: 37% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
MS: 45% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
HS: 38% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school

That's CURRENTLY in MCPS.

Those are the boundaries that people want to maintain because they want "neighborhood schools."

How is this even possible? I call BS.
Kids who are bussed away from their closest school are special ed and magnet students, I'll give you that, but, looking at our catchment area, there's no way almost half of my child's middle school schoolmates live closer to another middle school. No way.

Maybe not in your catchment, but yours is shockingly not the only one. Off the top of my head, and just in my broader neighborhood:

Takoma Park kids that attend SSIMS instead of TPMS (for the subsection of Takoma Park that attends RTES).

We live in the Norhwood Cluster. DS attended Highland View ES. We have friends who lived closer to HVES than we do, but were zoned for New Hampshire Estates/Oakview. We live closer to Eastern MS (our friends' kids would have to walk past our house to get to Eastern, their zoned MS), but DS was zoned for SSIMS. Many of his friends at SSIMS live close to Sligo MS. We can walk to Blair, but are zoned for Northwood.
None of the examples I just listed involve kids who are in special ed or magnets.

SSIMS kids zoned for Northwood instead of Blair.

Kids zoned for Northwood who are much closer to Wheaton.

Taken all together, and assuming this is not the only cluster, I can absolutely believe that many kids are not in the nearest school. Which is fine! The boundaries need to be somewhere, and they need to take into consideration all sorts of factors, including weird historical stuff like the fact that Blair used to be somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At the meeting tonight, there's a poster on Students Not Assigned To Closest School -

ES: 37% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
MS: 45% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school
HS: 38% of students in MCPS do not attend their closest school

That's CURRENTLY in MCPS.

Those are the boundaries that people want to maintain because they want "neighborhood schools."

How is this even possible? I call BS.
Kids who are bussed away from their closest school are special ed and magnet students, I'll give you that, but, looking at our catchment area, there's no way almost half of my child's middle school schoolmates live closer to another middle school. No way.

Maybe not in your catchment, but yours is shockingly not the only one. Off the top of my head, and just in my broader neighborhood:

Takoma Park kids that attend SSIMS instead of TPMS (for the subsection of Takoma Park that attends RTES).

SSIMS kids zoned for Northwood instead of Blair.

Kids zoned for Northwood who are much closer to Wheaton.

Taken all together, and assuming this is not the only cluster, I can absolutely believe that many kids are not in the nearest school. Which is fine! The boundaries need to be somewhere, and they need to take into consideration all sorts of factors, including weird historical stuff like the fact that Blair used to be somewhere else.

Sorry, trying to repost and fix my previous messed up quoted post

We live in the Norhwood Cluster. DS attended Highland View ES. We have friends who lived closer to HVES than we do, but were zoned for New Hampshire Estates/Oakview. We live closer to Eastern MS (our friends' kids would have to walk past our house to get to Eastern, their zoned MS), but DS was zoned for SSIMS. Many of his friends at SSIMS live close to Sligo MS. We can walk to Blair, but are zoned for Northwood.
None of the examples I just listed involve kids who are in special ed or magnets.