Why are DCUM parents less inclined to have their child major in business?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

It's also just not true. The top employers of almost every top college are Amazon, Apple, Google, etc.

source?

Yale: https://ocs.yale.edu/outcomes/
Williams: https://www.williams.edu/career-center/files/2021-Destinations-After-Williams.pdf
Amherst: https://careers.amherst.edu/outcomes/
Pomona: https://www.pomona.edu/outcomes/interactive-dashboard
Stanford: https://msandecareers.stanford.edu/jobs-internships/employment-report/employment-report-bachelor-science-graduates
Johns Hopkins: https://imagine.jhu.edu/first-destination-outcomes/
Swarthmore: https://cdn.uconnectlabs.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/187/2023/03/fds-2022_Digital-5.pdf
UChicago: https://collegeadmissions.uchicago.edu/files/documents/uchicago-career-outcomes.pdf
Wellesley: https://www1.wellesley.edu/careereducation/class-2023-first-destination
Emory: https://cpd.emory.edu/outcomes/
I tried to give you a nice spread. Where did you think students were going but the best companies?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not a major for academically smart kids.

True, outside of the top undergrad business programs (Wharton, Mit, Cornell, and about 5 others) it is not where smart kids land. Look at the smartest kids from the top private high schools and top publics: Engineering, other stem, Liberal Arts (typically prelaw or prePhD goals, for the smartest).

Again not true at all.
If a university has a business program, it's usually higher demand and more competitive to get in.
Students are smarter on the average.

A student at IU Kelley may be smarter than the average IU student, but those students in IU Kelley are NOT on average the same level of smarts as students from the top rigor/most academic group of top private and top public high schools. Those kids do Stem, Engineering, Liberal Arts at top schools, and if they want business they go to the big names, Wharton et al.
OP asked why DCum looks down on it—that is why. And it is consistent with what the PP teacher said regarding their high school, and what the vast majority of UMC parents see in their circles.

Most of DCUM actually takes a big dump on history, English, etc humanities majors at any school…if you are generally polling overall DCUM sentiment.

There's currently a post asking how people feel about english majors, and people are overwhelmingly positive. DCUM is pretty receptive to liberal arts majors, tolerates STEM/Engineering, and takes a dump on pre-professional programs.

Sorry…DCUM cares about top schools and takes a huge shit on liberal arts majors….except if you procure such major from a top 20 school. Which of course says more about the prestige whoring aspect of DCUM in general which is its most common characteristic.

These people would think majoring in pottery making or some other naval gazing major at an ivy is better than majoring in business at a T50.

And would they be wrong with the consulting or bust culture of the ivies? I majored in something super impractical and really didn't have to worry, cause McKinsey had my back.

How long ago did you graduate, and what was your major? And do you have a masters?

I'm 30, so a "while" ago, but not really much change when I talked to students about their plans during reunion.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not a major for academically smart kids.

True, outside of the top undergrad business programs (Wharton, Mit, Cornell, and about 5 others) it is not where smart kids land. Look at the smartest kids from the top private high schools and top publics: Engineering, other stem, Liberal Arts (typically prelaw or prePhD goals, for the smartest).

Again not true at all.
If a university has a business program, it's usually higher demand and more competitive to get in.
Students are smarter on the average.

A student at IU Kelley may be smarter than the average IU student, but those students in IU Kelley are NOT on average the same level of smarts as students from the top rigor/most academic group of top private and top public high schools. Those kids do Stem, Engineering, Liberal Arts at top schools, and if they want business they go to the big names, Wharton et al.
OP asked why DCum looks down on it—that is why. And it is consistent with what the PP teacher said regarding their high school, and what the vast majority of UMC parents see in their circles.

Most of DCUM actually takes a big dump on history, English, etc humanities majors at any school…if you are generally polling overall DCUM sentiment.

There's currently a post asking how people feel about english majors, and people are overwhelmingly positive. DCUM is pretty receptive to liberal arts majors, tolerates STEM/Engineering, and takes a dump on pre-professional programs.

Sorry…DCUM cares about top schools and takes a huge shit on liberal arts majors….except if you procure such major from a top 20 school. Which of course says more about the prestige whoring aspect of DCUM in general which is its most common characteristic.

These people would think majoring in pottery making or some other naval gazing major at an ivy is better than majoring in business at a T50.

And would they be wrong with the consulting or bust culture of the ivies? I majored in something super impractical and really didn't have to worry, cause McKinsey had my back.

How long ago did you graduate, and what was your major? And do you have a masters?

I'm 30, so a "while" ago, but not really much change when I talked to students about their plans during reunion.

major? masters?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not a major for academically smart kids.

True, outside of the top undergrad business programs (Wharton, Mit, Cornell, and about 5 others) it is not where smart kids land. Look at the smartest kids from the top private high schools and top publics: Engineering, other stem, Liberal Arts (typically prelaw or prePhD goals, for the smartest).

Again not true at all.
If a university has a business program, it's usually higher demand and more competitive to get in.
Students are smarter on the average.

A student at IU Kelley may be smarter than the average IU student, but those students in IU Kelley are NOT on average the same level of smarts as students from the top rigor/most academic group of top private and top public high schools. Those kids do Stem, Engineering, Liberal Arts at top schools, and if they want business they go to the big names, Wharton et al.
OP asked why DCum looks down on it—that is why. And it is consistent with what the PP teacher said regarding their high school, and what the vast majority of UMC parents see in their circles.

Most of DCUM actually takes a big dump on history, English, etc humanities majors at any school…if you are generally polling overall DCUM sentiment.

There's currently a post asking how people feel about english majors, and people are overwhelmingly positive. DCUM is pretty receptive to liberal arts majors, tolerates STEM/Engineering, and takes a dump on pre-professional programs.

Sorry…DCUM cares about top schools and takes a huge shit on liberal arts majors….except if you procure such major from a top 20 school. Which of course says more about the prestige whoring aspect of DCUM in general which is its most common characteristic.

These people would think majoring in pottery making or some other naval gazing major at an ivy is better than majoring in business at a T50.

And would they be wrong with the consulting or bust culture of the ivies? I majored in something super impractical and really didn't have to worry, cause McKinsey had my back.

How long ago did you graduate, and what was your major? And do you have a masters?

I'm 30, so a "while" ago, but not really much change when I talked to students about their plans during reunion.

major? masters?

Jewish Studies and Anthropology. No masters or graduate degree, though I'd consider in the future. Not many peers in consulting started after a masters program.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

It's also just not true. The top employers of almost every top college are Amazon, Apple, Google, etc.

source?

Yale: https://ocs.yale.edu/outcomes/
Williams: https://www.williams.edu/career-center/files/2021-Destinations-After-Williams.pdf
Amherst: https://careers.amherst.edu/outcomes/
Pomona: https://www.pomona.edu/outcomes/interactive-dashboard
Stanford: https://msandecareers.stanford.edu/jobs-internships/employment-report/employment-report-bachelor-science-graduates
Johns Hopkins: https://imagine.jhu.edu/first-destination-outcomes/
Swarthmore: https://cdn.uconnectlabs.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/187/2023/03/fds-2022_Digital-5.pdf
UChicago: https://collegeadmissions.uchicago.edu/files/documents/uchicago-career-outcomes.pdf
Wellesley: https://www1.wellesley.edu/careereducation/class-2023-first-destination
Emory: https://cpd.emory.edu/outcomes/
I tried to give you a nice spread. Where did you think students were going but the best companies?

I clicked on Wellesley. I don't see Amazon, Apple or Google on there. I see Microsoft, but they aren't all that desirable for graduates interested in tech. They are considered somewhat of a dinosaur. Neither really is Adobe.

I used to live/work in SV for a FAANG. Oh, and I graduated from a no name state u.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

It's also just not true. The top employers of almost every top college are Amazon, Apple, Google, etc.

source?

Yale: https://ocs.yale.edu/outcomes/
Williams: https://www.williams.edu/career-center/files/2021-Destinations-After-Williams.pdf
Amherst: https://careers.amherst.edu/outcomes/
Pomona: https://www.pomona.edu/outcomes/interactive-dashboard
Stanford: https://msandecareers.stanford.edu/jobs-internships/employment-report/employment-report-bachelor-science-graduates
Johns Hopkins: https://imagine.jhu.edu/first-destination-outcomes/
Swarthmore: https://cdn.uconnectlabs.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/187/2023/03/fds-2022_Digital-5.pdf
UChicago: https://collegeadmissions.uchicago.edu/files/documents/uchicago-career-outcomes.pdf
Wellesley: https://www1.wellesley.edu/careereducation/class-2023-first-destination
Emory: https://cpd.emory.edu/outcomes/
I tried to give you a nice spread. Where did you think students were going but the best companies?

I clicked on Wellesley. I don't see Amazon, Apple or Google on there. I see Microsoft, but they aren't all that desirable for graduates interested in tech. They are considered somewhat of a dinosaur. Neither really is Adobe.

I used to live/work in SV for a FAANG. Oh, and I graduated from a no name state u.

DP. I just clicked on the Wellesley page: Amazon, Adobe and Microsoft. Students at these schools overwhelmingly poor into finance so all the best financial services are there too of course. There probably is a Google or Apple graduate, just not from the small sample they show.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

It's also just not true. The top employers of almost every top college are Amazon, Apple, Google, etc.

source?

Yale: https://ocs.yale.edu/outcomes/
Williams: https://www.williams.edu/career-center/files/2021-Destinations-After-Williams.pdf
Amherst: https://careers.amherst.edu/outcomes/
Pomona: https://www.pomona.edu/outcomes/interactive-dashboard
Stanford: https://msandecareers.stanford.edu/jobs-internships/employment-report/employment-report-bachelor-science-graduates
Johns Hopkins: https://imagine.jhu.edu/first-destination-outcomes/
Swarthmore: https://cdn.uconnectlabs.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/187/2023/03/fds-2022_Digital-5.pdf
UChicago: https://collegeadmissions.uchicago.edu/files/documents/uchicago-career-outcomes.pdf
Wellesley: https://www1.wellesley.edu/careereducation/class-2023-first-destination
Emory: https://cpd.emory.edu/outcomes/
I tried to give you a nice spread. Where did you think students were going but the best companies?

I clicked on Wellesley. I don't see Amazon, Apple or Google on there. I see Microsoft, but they aren't all that desirable for graduates interested in tech. They are considered somewhat of a dinosaur. Neither really is Adobe.

I used to live/work in SV for a FAANG. Oh, and I graduated from a no name state u.

Wellesley is tiny. I wouldn't expect too many grads going to Jane Street.
When did FAANG become dinosaur? I feel like most newbie grads want those places.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

Please, many a Harvard grad will line up to be chosen by Google or any top tech firm, it doesn't need to be AI
-A yale grad.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

CS students are desperate for a job. This isn't 2015.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many CEO’ s have a STEM background from undergrad.

And most of them also have an MBA...hmmm, why is that?

No one here is trashing MBAs. They're faulting undergrad business.

+1

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

Please, many a Harvard grad will line up to be chosen by Google or any top tech firm, it doesn't need to be AI
-A yale grad.

Once more…nobody disputes that Harvard grads aren’t knocking down the door at Coca Cola, Eli Lilly, Ford, McDonalds…all the “old school” companies that actually comprise the vast majority of Fortune 500 companies.

Hence, why those companies don’t spend much time recruiting Harvard grads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

CS students are desperate for a job. This isn't 2015.

Not really for CS students that actually have some skills (for instance strong ML skills)…BTW, what is significant about 2015 for CS grads?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:dcum always recommends CS and Engineering as degrees with best employment but I recruit finance undergrad and it is a decent major.

I don't really see the difference between DCUM promoting econ majors and finance degrees. They overwhelmingly go to the same careers.

That’s not really true. Econ and Finance majors from top schools may end up in IB and consulting, but you will find more Finance majors working for F500 companies either in trainee programs or going into financial planning & analysis or treasury functions. Econ majors aren’t usually hired for these roles.

Statistically, you have far more Econ majors pursuing graduate work vs finance majors as well (and interestingly, you have Math and Econ majors pursuing finance PhDs in higher numbers than finance undergrads).

I don't necessarily see the difference, other than you just saying econ majors aren't hired. From DC's recent cohort, quite a few are going to Apple after going into their Financial Developer program, and a ton participate in those trainee programs for financial planning and many of those jobs list "Finance, Financial Economics, Econ,..." as acceptable degrees. Sure, many went into IB or Consulting, but most end up in typical financial positions that you would get from a decent finance program. Of course, more people are going into Econ grad school-there's more economics to do out in the academic world, and if your goal is to work for the Fed or some prime-time international NPO, grad programs place well into them. The math majors going into finance want to be quants, not really surprising to me.

From what school? You have to go beyond the Top 50 to understand the difference for an Econ major vs a Finance major and career paths.

Actually…there is plenty of grad school work for Finance PhDs but schools have a hard time getting people to pursue those PhDs…that is why a finance PhD comes with a generous stipend and it is one of the few academic areas with lots of tenure-track jobs.

I don't see why. The type of students to get into a Finance PhD program are top students. The type of students to get into a good finance development program are from top schools overwhelmingly (in the case of Apple, they take a few "local" students at Santa Clara University for DEI). If you have the chops to get into a good finance career, you typically come from the top 50 or 100 colleges.
DC attended CMC.

Well…it depends a ton if you have an Econ or finance degree from CMC vs a finance or Econ degree from say University of Alabama. The finance majors probably have an easier time getting a job in the Coca Cola management trainee program vs the Econ majors…or a real world example, getting a job in the Capital One trainee program.

CMC doesn't have a finance undergrad program. I'm not sure about Capital one specifically, but most finance development programs do list econ as a sought-after background. Would you really want to design a finance program that excludes Harvard econ grads for example? If you have any prominence, you'll definitely be getting applications from top colleges, so it wouldn't really help to close those students off with a finance major requirement.

Most Harvard grads have little interest working for a F500 company…even if you designed a program for them I bet you wouldn’t even fill 50 interview slots at Harvard for say the Ford or Eli Lilly or John Deere Finance/Trainee program.

Companies know their target audience and are way more likely to recruit from Penn State than Harvard.

Really? It seems like people are always saying you need to graduate from places like Harvard to get in the door at Goldman Sachs, Apple, etc. Investment banking, engineering, etc. are no longer paths of interest for Harvard et al. grads?

You mentioned Goldman and Tech…there are only like 3 investment banks in the Fortune 500.

I guess you don’t understand that Harvard grade want to work for PE firms, hedge funds, VC funds…and yes maybe 20 tech companies but actually they want to work at OpenAI or other hot tech startups. Most of these firms pay crazy amounts but are not Fortune 500 companies.

There are probably 400 Fortune 500 companies that certainly aren’t top targets for Harvard grads.

Please, many a Harvard grad will line up to be chosen by Google or any top tech firm, it doesn't need to be AI
-A yale grad.

Once more…nobody disputes that Harvard grads aren’t knocking down the door at Coca Cola, Eli Lilly, Ford, McDonalds…all the “old school” companies that actually comprise the vast majority of Fortune 500 companies.

Hence, why those companies don’t spend much time recruiting Harvard grads.

Harvard has over 400 alum in Eli Lilly, and Eli Lilly really is heavy on getting grad school graduates. I have no idea how the finance students are doing but seeing as it is a medicine company and Harvard is the top biological sciences university in the US, i don’t think they’re struggling to get Harvard talent.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It’s not a major for academically smart kids.

True, outside of the top undergrad business programs (Wharton, Mit, Cornell, and about 5 others) it is not where smart kids land. Look at the smartest kids from the top private high schools and top publics: Engineering, other stem, Liberal Arts (typically prelaw or prePhD goals, for the smartest).

Again not true at all.
If a university has a business program, it's usually higher demand and more competitive to get in.
Students are smarter on the average.

A student at IU Kelley may be smarter than the average IU student, but those students in IU Kelley are NOT on average the same level of smarts as students from the top rigor/most academic group of top private and top public high schools. Those kids do Stem, Engineering, Liberal Arts at top schools, and if they want business they go to the big names, Wharton et al.
OP asked why DCum looks down on it—that is why. And it is consistent with what the PP teacher said regarding their high school, and what the vast majority of UMC parents see in their circles.

Most of DCUM actually takes a big dump on history, English, etc humanities majors at any school…if you are generally polling overall DCUM sentiment.

There's currently a post asking how people feel about english majors, and people are overwhelmingly positive. DCUM is pretty receptive to liberal arts majors, tolerates STEM/Engineering, and takes a dump on pre-professional programs.

Sorry…DCUM cares about top schools and takes a huge shit on liberal arts majors….except if you procure such major from a top 20 school. Which of course says more about the prestige whoring aspect of DCUM in general which is its most common characteristic.

These people would think majoring in pottery making or some other naval gazing major at an ivy is better than majoring in business at a T50.

It many cases it probably is...it is hard to overestimate the power of the ivy brand (and a few other top schools), and the opportunities and doors that open just by attending. When one majors in art does not mean they will not be successful. Art majors from ivies go on to run museums or nonprofits, or they may become an actual artist. Or they go to med or dental school. The possibilities for highly successful outcomes are there, from ANY major at an ivy or the like.