private school admissions--what sets kids apart?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I don’t think any of this “hooked” stuff is true. My kid is unhooked - no legacy because we are from another country, no athletic ability whatsoever, very good but not amazing academics (ie some Bs), no interesting extra curriculars. A very nice, smart kid who is very well liked by teachers so really the only thing I can think of is that he had very good recommendations - but I’m sure that lots of other kids had these too. Got into 2 out of 2 Big 3s that we applied to and 2 out of 2 “next tier” schools.
For anyone reading this: do not be put off by talk of hooks! Just apply if you like the schools and think your kid will be happy there.

You still don’t get it do you? Being from another country often IS a hook.

my exact thought when reading that post

Really? Why would it be?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We just found out about private school admissions for several of our friends' children. They did amazingly well and got into the most competitive middle and high schools.
My kids applied in the last few years and didn't get into the more competitive schools. We were disappointed, but it is what it is.
I can't help but feel a little sting that all these kids are getting into schools that my kids were rejected from--mostly because I do not understand what set them apart. Our kids all seem very similar--well-rounded with good grades/school involvement, nice kids. Families are nice. Parents are involved. Everyone is UMC or wealthy. We are close with these families so I don't think they are doing any crazy, amazing ECs or accomplishments that I don't know about. I know their grades (similar to my kids).
What sets kids apart in 5th or 8th grade? Essays? letter of Rec? Parent essays? Family involvement in schools?
I think my kids are great, so I wish I knew what prevented them from gaining admission.

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[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We just found out about private school admissions for several of our friends' children. They did amazingly well and got into the most competitive middle and high schools.
My kids applied in the last few years and didn't get into the more competitive schools. We were disappointed, but it is what it is.
I can't help but feel a little sting that all these kids are getting into schools that my kids were rejected from--mostly because I do not understand what set them apart. Our kids all seem very similar--well-rounded with good grades/school involvement, nice kids. Families are nice. Parents are involved. Everyone is UMC or wealthy. We are close with these families so I don't think they are doing any crazy, amazing ECs or accomplishments that I don't know about. I know their grades (similar to my kids).
What sets kids apart in 5th or 8th grade? Essays? letter of Rec? Parent essays? Family involvement in schools?
I think my kids are great, so I wish I knew what prevented them from gaining admission.

Admissions to these schools isn't as fair, predictable, or logical as many think. It's difficult for staff to choose between candidates that look the same.

And the value of differentiators --- such as they are --- shifts around from year to year or even week to week during the process.

Especially at the margins, it's highly subjective and even capricious.






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[Anonymous]

I think the truth is there are a lot of really qualified kids. I do think test scores matter and are the differentiator when otherwise kids look the same: sports, clubs, leadership (as much as you can in 8th grade) etc. Tippy top test scores definitely give an advantage. Schools want really smart kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the truth is there are a lot of really qualified kids. I do think test scores matter and are the differentiator when otherwise kids look the same: sports, clubs, leadership (as much as you can in 8th grade) etc. Tippy top test scores definitely give an advantage. Schools want really smart kids.

Not really. DC had a 97/100 GPA, 98% SSAT, interviewed very well, had leadership positions at his former school, full pay family, excellent recommendation letters, coming from another private and still got waitlisted by every "Big 5" school for high school.
The kids that got in from his school were good academically but had a hook of some sort, either elite athletes that had good chances of being recruited for college, legacy/ big donor kids/ had an older sibling at the school, or members of an under represented minority group. Again, not to take away anything from these kids: they were good academically, but that's not enough for the ultra competitive schools.

[Anonymous]

I think the "hook" is the rationalization that qualified families use to rationalize what is a sometimes irrational process. If there are 30 kids with outstanding test scores, great recommendations and interesting extracurricular activities but only 10 spots, kids are going to be rejected.

Not every attribute is a "hook." Sure, a billionaire offering to name a building is unique. But being a good athlete, charming interviewee, STEM geek, good debater or anything else is just part of the package.

Parents feel the need to explain that their kid "would have gotten in if only they had a hook." The hook is that the kids who did get in were selected for whatever reason, but it doesn't mean that it was a reason external to kid's achievement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the "hook" is the rationalization that qualified families use to rationalize what is a sometimes irrational process. If there are 30 kids with outstanding test scores, great recommendations and interesting extracurricular activities but only 10 spots, kids are going to be rejected.

Not every attribute is a "hook." Sure, a billionaire offering to name a building is unique. But being a good athlete, charming interviewee, STEM geek, good debater or anything else is just part of the package.

Parents feel the need to explain that their kid "would have gotten in if only they had a hook." The hook is that the kids who did get in were selected for whatever reason, but it doesn't mean that it was a reason external to kid's achievement.

I agree. And you see the same in the college board. If someone says their kid got in then everyone says that whatever slightly unique thing about them was the hook.

[Anonymous]

I felt just that way too. Of my friends, the only two who got in were the legacy and educational consultant kids. Then we got in off the waitlist. Nothing special about us but full pay (and obvs otherwise qualified kids). Really was not expecting that.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Test scores, first choice letters, legacy, URM, sports, being potentially very large donors in addition to full pay.

You seem very confident that you know what went into the other kids' applications, and sometimes there are things that their parents haven't mentioned to you.

I agree with this. We have been through admissions multiple times with our kids. The times we have been successful, it felt like an all-out siege, but none of the strategizing and effort would have been visible to other parents.

What did you do that wouldn’t have been obvious to others?

We have been accepted to 2nd tier schools only and WL at first tier. I still don’t understand why. ISEE scores 7,8,9,9; national placement in science; city recognition for art portfolio (submitted to school); plays 4 sports; UMC family that is active at K-8; parent recognized for school donations; well written parent statements and student essay. Applied to top tier in K, 6, and 9 - all WL. I know legacy kids with lower stats who get in. The non-legacy kids (very view) who do get in have similar stats. What did you do differently?

Did you ask the HoS at your K-8 why your child was not admitted to top tier for 9th? HoS at St Pats, Lowell, Sheridan, Norwood would know.

Yes, I asked, but I feel like I got a 'non-answer' - "competition was steep and there were just so many great kids and not enough spots". It just seems like other "great kids" similar to mine get the spots and never my kid. Oh well, my focus is on my younger ones now and I'm not sure top tier is for them - I'm tempted to send them there the older ones went for simplicity.

Your emphasis on "first tier" and "2nd tier" could be your answer.

Are you saying there isn't a pecking order in high schools or just that it is supposed to remain unsaid?

You’re saying too much of the quiet part out loud. Also focused too much on rankings instead of showing fit. You’re supposed to say things like “Jr wants to go to the library every day to learn after school and is looking for a school where there are more kids like her,” not “we’re looking for Jr to be in a top tier school.”

This is also internally in your K-8 discussions with teachers and administrators. If you don’t show you know why your daughter would be a better fit at NCS than Holton beyond that NCS is ranked first, especially if administrators think Holton would also be a fit or might be a better fit, they may not bat for you with NCS.

So gross and eye-rolly. How do you do that crap and not vomit all over yourselves? You know in 20 years NONE of this will matter!

I don’t. But I know people who do, and do so successfully.

I also think this practice is completely unfair. For all these schools’ talk about systemic bias no one seems to realize that parents of most kids coming from underprivileged backgrounds don’t know don’t have time to learn the difference between Sidwell and GDS. They just want their kids to go to the best schools and “get ahead,” sometimes without much of an idea of what that means. It’s unfair to ask them to have a reason to want to a school beyond “I want the best for my child.”

Why exactly is it unfair? Because you assume they don't have the fortitude to make a distinction? Equating privilege, or lack there of, with an (in)ability to appropriately analyze options is at best, short-sighted, at worst, insulting. Underprivileged is not synonymous with incapable or stupid.

Have you ever been underprivileged? I have. Where I come from, people don't use phrases like "fortitude to make a distinction." People use phrases like "you know those presidents sent their girls to Sidwell." When I had to write my "Why Princeton" essay, my dad said, "That essay is stupid. You just write, 'Because it's Princeton.' There. Three words. Done." I had to explain that it wasn't how that worked, and that when there was a 250 word limit, the essay shouldn't be 3 words. By that point, I was more privileged than he was, even though he was more capable than I.

He was more capable than me.

Actually, both “than I” and “than me” are fine but not great. Best is to add the verb at the end: “than I was.”
- professional editor (who thinks pointing out spelling and grammar errors/typos on informal online posts is a jerk move that reflects badly on the corrector, not the poster)

💯
And, it further proves and validates the culture that is being addressed in the thread.

[Anonymous]

Being awesome. Great interviews.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You may think you know these families in your K-8 or PK-6 well, know where the parents are from, where they went to school, etc. But what you may not know, because most people don't talk about it, is the legacy connections to the top schools that they have through grandparents, random aunts/ uncles, etc. They have links to these schools that may not be immediately obvious via the parents. And that can make the difference in admissions.

At which top colleges is a random aunt/uncle connection needle-moving for admissions?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You may think you know these families in your K-8 or PK-6 well, know where the parents are from, where they went to school, etc. But what you may not know, because most people don't talk about it, is the legacy connections to the top schools that they have through grandparents, random aunts/ uncles, etc. They have links to these schools that may not be immediately obvious via the parents. And that can make the difference in admissions.

At which top colleges is a random aunt/uncle connection needle-moving for admissions?

Unless the aunt/uncle is a donating billionaire alum or someone famous, it isn’t. Colleges don’t even consider grandparents as legacy in most cases. Parents only, and even then legacy isn’t that big a thing (or anything at all) for moat places any more.

[Anonymous]

Didn't realize private middle school = Harvard admissions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also, we had former attendees/board members write letters of recommendation.

+1. This is an important comment.

I recall that I have stated this on this DCUM board in the past, and I'll repeat it because it was eye-opening for me.

If you know someone on the board or a big donor or a family whose children excelled at that school, it may be helpful to ask them to write a letter on behalf of your DS or DD.

Approximately 8 years ago, when our DS was rejected from Potomac, I had a friend tell me that she wishes she would have known that my DS was applying because she or her DH could have written a letter. My son still may not have been admitted even with the letter, but I was intrigued that she was pretty confident that the letter could have helped. I honestly didn't think that there was a place for any letters in the application, other than letters from teachers or coaches.

In the past 10 years, we knew a girl who was admitted to a top school (cannot state it) off of the wait list for middle school. The girl's friend had been admitted to this school, but had turned it down for another top school. Upon turning it down, that girl's family recommended that this school admit the girl who was on the wait list. Within one day, that girl got a call off of the wait list. Maybe it was coincidence, but maybe not.

Finally, I know of a family where their DD was admitted to a top school for middle school. She might have gotten admitted on her own. However, a person very connected with the school was willing to write a letter on her behalf. Who knows if that helped, but it likely did help as this school gets so many applicants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Didn't realize private middle school = Harvard admissions

Have you seen some of the acceptance rates? Many of the schools only accept 20-60 new students per class. When you consider hundreds apply, it’s very competitive.

For our DD, who applied during non-entry year, her school only accepted 4-6 students. It felt like a dry-run for college applications.