Parking no longer free on Saturdays in MoCo lots starting 7/8/23

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

AMEN!

I feel the exact same.

It’s not us suburbanite pushing our way of life into others. It’s the crazy urbanist cult pushing their way of life on us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


This is exactly the case. These activists want to urbanize every part of Montgomery County. It's crazy, because if you want to live in an urban environment, you have plenty of options in DC and in some parts of MoCo. But, that is not enough.

We CHOSE to live in the suburbs. Quit trying to impose your urban lifestyle on people who don't want it.

Yes, and your neighbors CHOSE to elect elected officials who are trying to change Montgomery County so that people aren't forced to drive everywhere for everything. Quit trying to impose your opinions on your neighbors.

And that's why MoCo is in steep decline and is excellent at killing jobs and businesses. It'll be funny when MoCo urbanizes everything and ends up building a bunch of mini ghost cities like China because everyone moves for jobs that all left MoCo.

They want to turn the county into Tokyo/Hong Kong when people move specifically to the burbs to escape horrific concrete jungles with no space. MoCo urbanists won't be happy until we look and live like people in Hong Kong and have Soviet style housing. But at least you can take the bus to the grocery store!

Utopia vision for Moco is when we finally live densely like people in Hong Kong because it is so good for the environment!



Beautiful future vision for MoCo:

This is definitely the vision that our current County leadership has.

I’m certainly not voting for them, but they do seem to have a following.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

Do you think there should be parking meters on bike racks? Why should they be expected to provide free bike storage? It’s “only” $3/hour.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

Do you think there should be parking meters on bike racks? Why should they be expected to provide free bike storage? It’s “only” $3/hour.

First let's actually have bike racks. Most of the places I go, I have to lock my bike to a random pole.

However, I'll be happy to pay the equivalent share of the cost of one bike parking space that I pay for one car parking space.

~Structured parking costs $40,000-80,000 per space
~$1 per hour is 0.0025% of the cost of the space
~A bike rack costs $300, and that's 2 bike parking spaces
~So I'll pay $0.00 per hour

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

Do you think there should be parking meters on bike racks? Why should they be expected to provide free bike storage? It’s “only” $3/hour.

First let's actually have bike racks. Most of the places I go, I have to lock my bike to a random pole.

However, I'll be happy to pay the equivalent share of the cost of one bike parking space that I pay for one car parking space.

~Structured parking costs $40,000-80,000 per space
~$1 per hour is 0.0025% of the cost of the space
~A bike rack costs $300, and that's 2 bike parking spaces
~So I'll pay $0.00 per hour

Touché
You made a very effective argument.

I still disagree with the idea of requiring payment for parking. I don’t think it will discourage driving. I do think it will encourage people to drive further to places that don’t require fees, hurting local businesses in the process.

Moreover, while I agree that it would be great to have better public transportation, especially for the poor who may not be able to afford a car, I don’t think disgruntlement over parking fees will generate a groundswell for increased investment in public transit. I think it more likely that citizens disgruntled over taxes and fees are going to be less likely to support massive spending for public transportation infrastructure.

Finally, parking fees don’t means test. While some people may not be able to afford a car, dependency on a car is not a guarantee of affluence. People may need a car to juggle multiple jobs and family needs. $3 may not seem like much to a DCUM’er, but to somebody struggling with minimum wage to support a family, it may be a burden, but they may not have the leisure time to walk/ride a bicycle to the store (children in tow?) to buy groceries for their family and lug them home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Touché
You made a very effective argument.

I still disagree with the idea of requiring payment for parking. I don’t think it will discourage driving. I do think it will encourage people to drive further to places that don’t require fees, hurting local businesses in the process.

Moreover, while I agree that it would be great to have better public transportation, especially for the poor who may not be able to afford a car, I don’t think disgruntlement over parking fees will generate a groundswell for increased investment in public transit. I think it more likely that citizens disgruntled over taxes and fees are going to be less likely to support massive spending for public transportation infrastructure.

Finally, parking fees don’t means test. While some people may not be able to afford a car, dependency on a car is not a guarantee of affluence. People may need a car to juggle multiple jobs and family needs. $3 may not seem like much to a DCUM’er, but to somebody struggling with minimum wage to support a family, it may be a burden, but they may not have the leisure time to walk/ride a bicycle to the store (children in tow?) to buy groceries for their family and lug them home.

People struggling with minimum wage to support a family are already highly disproportionately likely to have to take twice as long to walk, ride a bicycle, or take a bus (children in tow?) to buy groceries for their family and lug them home, BECAUSE CARS ARE REALLY, REALLY EXPENSIVE.

If you're concerned about these families, then advocate for making it possible for them to buy groceries, conveniently, without a car.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

Do you think there should be parking meters on bike racks? Why should they be expected to provide free bike storage? It’s “only” $3/hour.

No, because the government is trying to encourage cycling. Also, think about how many bikes you can fit into the space one car takes!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Touché
You made a very effective argument.

I still disagree with the idea of requiring payment for parking. I don’t think it will discourage driving. I do think it will encourage people to drive further to places that don’t require fees, hurting local businesses in the process.

Moreover, while I agree that it would be great to have better public transportation, especially for the poor who may not be able to afford a car, I don’t think disgruntlement over parking fees will generate a groundswell for increased investment in public transit. I think it more likely that citizens disgruntled over taxes and fees are going to be less likely to support massive spending for public transportation infrastructure.

Finally, parking fees don’t means test. While some people may not be able to afford a car, dependency on a car is not a guarantee of affluence. People may need a car to juggle multiple jobs and family needs. $3 may not seem like much to a DCUM’er, but to somebody struggling with minimum wage to support a family, it may be a burden, but they may not have the leisure time to walk/ride a bicycle to the store (children in tow?) to buy groceries for their family and lug them home.

People struggling with minimum wage to support a family are already highly disproportionately likely to have to take twice as long to walk, ride a bicycle, or take a bus (children in tow?) to buy groceries for their family and lug them home, BECAUSE CARS ARE REALLY, REALLY EXPENSIVE.

If you're concerned about these families, then advocate for making it possible for them to buy groceries, conveniently, without a car.

People need a solution now for their transportation problems. Advocating for solutions in 20 years is good, it will take years to build new infrastructure for metro, more and more frequent buses, running. More bus lines. Families need a quick solution. It’s great that you want to advocate for lower income families who rely on public transportation but we also must maintain an advance roads and parking.

And separately from that when the county decides to charge parking fee, it hurts the local businesses that surround those parking garages. People vote with their wallets. People don’t want to rush through dinner and finish in two hours. So people will go to where they can leisurely shop and eat. That’s where they’ll spend their money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

You seem disgruntled.

As another MoCo suburbanite, I want to encourage mass transit and biking. I don't have a problem paying for parking. I love that MoCo encourages biking and mass transit over driving. So, it's not just the "urbanist cult" that supports MoCo's values on this topic. You can tell, because we voted for them and they won.

Deal with it or move.

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People need a solution now for their transportation problems. Advocating for solutions in 20 years is good, it will take years to build new infrastructure for metro, more and more frequent buses, running. More bus lines. Families need a quick solution. It’s great that you want to advocate for lower income families who rely on public transportation but we also must maintain an advance roads and parking.

And separately from that when the county decides to charge parking fee, it hurts the local businesses that surround those parking garages. People vote with their wallets. People don’t want to rush through dinner and finish in two hours. So people will go to where they can leisurely shop and eat. That’s where they’ll spend their money.

Yes. So let's start working on solutions now! It will not take 20 years. We can - and should - start right now. There are plenty of things we can - and should - do quickly.

As for where people want to go - people want to go to nice places. Given a choice between a nice place where you have to pay to park, or a non-nice place where you can park for "free", most people will choose nice places. Of course there are people who will cut off their own noses to spite their faces, but we don't have to make public policy around their honestly silly preferences.

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Anonymous wrote:The council is so good at figuring out new ways to take our money! This is on top of recently raising property tax rates and the recordation tax, of course.

"On or about July 8, 2023, Saturday payment will be required in garages and lots. Rates and hours requiring payment will be the same as the rest of the week."

https://www.montgomerycountymd.gov/DOT-Parking/FAQ/using-meters.html

Poor drivers. Won't someone think of the drivers?

Poor county council, nonprofits, snd community activists. Whatever will they do without more taxpayer money!!!? We gotta make sure they can eat!

Eh. "Free" parking subsidizes drivers and driving. End driver/driving subsidies.

End lunch subsidies, housing subsidies, electric power tool and car subsidies, solar panel subsidies, etc. etc.

End it all!

That's an unnuanced view of public policy. In the nuanced view, we subsidize behaviors/actions we want to encourage, and remove subsidies from behaviors/actions we don't want to encourage. We want to encourage kids having lunches, people having housing, and clean(er), local energy sources. We don't want to, and don't need to, encourage driving.

Which is why we make parking easier, so that local businesses thrive.

But this is moco, where the county does everything in its power to kill jobs, kill businesses, and stifle economic growth. No surprise.

No, when we make parking easier, we get a lot of roads, traffic congestion, parking lots, and car crashes, none of which contribute to economic vitality or help most local businesses. It's true that car crashes are good for car-repair, tow truck, and car-sales businesses, though.

Fix the problem then. What solution you got so a grocery store run doesn't take 4 hours and you can move millions of people all over the county.

Let me guess,.you have the typical list of really stupid ideas the bike idiots always try to propose.

I'm working on it. What are you doing?

Why should I have to do anything? I pay taxes.

Until there is a solution, I will drive. And you can eat my exhaust.

What a charmer you are.

I live in the suburbs because I chose to live in the suburbs. I WANT to drive everywhere and not have to take 10 hours on weekend to so basic chores because I have to take public train.

That’s what you clowns don’t get. You try to make the suburbs NYC, as if we have the same kind of density that can make public transportation economically viable.

We live in the burbs. Now accept the fact that it requires driving and stop having grand delusions that you can bike, bus, and take trains everywhere. You can’t. No one wants to spend entire days just trying to do two things like going to get milk and sugar and then having to spend 4 more hours to get to Target to pickup cleaning supplies.

Suburbanites drive. Get over it.

So do. Nobody is stopping you.

And pay for it.

We already do pay for it, numbnuts. Gas tax, car sales tax, registration fees, emissions fees, etc. etc. You know who pay yet enjoys all of the benefits? Cyclists. We should require licenses to own and operate bicycles if they want to use the roads and demand we cater to building so much infrastructure for them. Tax cyclists who currently get free rides.

I both cycle and own a car so I pay for all of those things even if I happen to be cycling.

Also, you know you know this but gas and other car taxes do not come close to covering the cost of maintaining roads. Those costs absolutely come out of general taxation coffers.

And cars allow people to get to work in order to generate incomes so govts can tax. Duh.

Let's see how economically viable killing peoples' ability to drive works when you demand people bike 20 miles each way to work. The county would implode.

It's suburbia. People drive. Deal with it.

The fact that people drive does not magically mean that gas taxes and registration pay for all costs associated with driving. You want to live 20 miles from work, you pay for it. plenty of people live in MoCo and don't live 20 miles from work.

So because SOME people don't live 20 miles from work and SOME people can walk or bike to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same..

Really, really genius logic you got there.

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can't walk or bike to work means NOBODY can easily do the same?

Because SOME people live 20 miles from work and SOME people can drive to work means EVERYONE can easily do the same?

Way to miss the point. The urbanist cult doesn't want to give anyone a choice. People who move to suburbia on purpose to have suburbia aren't the ones trying to control other peoples' lives. If you want to bike to work and take 6 hours to go to the grocery store by taking public transportation, that's all you. I will drive and expect to be able to drive. I moved to suburbia and expect to drive. I pay taxes to support the infrastructure for driving.

If you hate suburbia then get the hell out. Go move your cramped ass apartment in NYC for $3500 per mo so you can walk everywhere. Stop expecting everyone else to adopt your desired lifestyle.

I will drive everywhere because I want to and that's the way suburbia is designed. Deal with it or move.

Who is stopping you from driving everywhere, and how are they doing this? Are they in the room with you right now?

Stop being facetious. We all know the urbanists and thrive 2050 loons want to make it as hard as possible for people to drive. Everyone should be biking 4 hours to finish up grocery shopping!

So, in fact, nobody is stopping you from driving everywhere?

I guess her job that doesn't pay her enough to pay $3/hour for parking while going shopping is stopping her?

Do you think there should be parking meters on bike racks? Why should they be expected to provide free bike storage? It’s “only” $3/hour.

No, because the government is trying to encourage cycling. Also, think about how many bikes you can fit into the space one car takes!

I bet no one on the county council rides a bike to work.