There Needs to Be Enforced Equity Among PTA's

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was President of one of these more wealthy associations and we donated a huge amount of money to the county to disperse to other schools that didn't have the same level of participation as the more successful schools. We also mentored their association on fund raising etc. It isn't that they don't have the money in those areas, it is they lack participation.

And why do you think they lack participation? People are working! People that don't make as much money have more inflexible jobs. They also tend to work in the evenings when these meetings are held (like me). They also probably can't afford a house cleaner, so they have to keep up their house themselves after work. They also probably can't afford to order take out as much either-- cooking dinner takes time. They might also not have two cars, or might have to rely on public transportation to make it to the school-- public transportation that stops running or gets scarce later in the day. It blows my mind that people don't see the connection. A lack of participation doesn't mean that parents don't care-- it's that they don't have the energy to do so after all the other work they have to do. The wealthy have easier lives in a million little ways that add up to them having more energy to participate.

And all of this goes back to life isn't fair and equal. And it never will be. But expecting a PTA leader at a wealthier school (most of whom also have jobs) to run both their PTA and yours is unrealistic. Is any of this ideal? No, of course not. But most of us (PTA leaders/volunteers) are already stretched thin to keep our own PTAs going. If we made it our mission to run our PTA and fundraise for other schools, no one would participate. Because its too much. And believe it or not, even the wealthy PTAs are being run by the same handful of people. So the participation is still lacking, even if the money isn't.

There is such a massive problem with the way schools are supported. They rely on unpaid work. That might have worked out when public schools were set up and millions of women were stay at home mothers, but it is completely dysfunctional in the modern world. Civic associations, PTAs, scouting troops-- they all have relied on unpaid labor. And the system falls apart when families have to have two incomes to stay afloat. There's no time.

We need some kind of systematic, societal change that puts value on this kind of labor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.

Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was President of one of these more wealthy associations and we donated a huge amount of money to the county to disperse to other schools that didn't have the same level of participation as the more successful schools. We also mentored their association on fund raising etc. It isn't that they don't have the money in those areas, it is they lack participation.

And why do you think they lack participation? People are working! People that don't make as much money have more inflexible jobs. They also tend to work in the evenings when these meetings are held (like me). They also probably can't afford a house cleaner, so they have to keep up their house themselves after work. They also probably can't afford to order take out as much either-- cooking dinner takes time. They might also not have two cars, or might have to rely on public transportation to make it to the school-- public transportation that stops running or gets scarce later in the day. It blows my mind that people don't see the connection. A lack of participation doesn't mean that parents don't care-- it's that they don't have the energy to do so after all the other work they have to do. The wealthy have easier lives in a million little ways that add up to them having more energy to participate.

I was a PTA officer of a very poor school with high FARMS and ESOL rates. We made dinner available to people, encouraged them to bring their whole family to PTA meetings, had childcare and babysitting provided with movie nights, ran shuttles, to get the parents to participate. Crickets! None of the poor people showed up. Did not matter when we had the meetings, did not matter if we had translators, if we had coffee and breakfast made available to them, had weekend events for the family. LOL! These people did not show up.

I don't resent the rich school. Because rich or poor, no one wants to parent their children it seems and parental participation is very little in both rich and poor school. Yes, the rich can still throw money for outsourcing their kid's education, opportunities or EC activities because they are aware of the path to a MC/UMC/Rich life and what education and ECs their kids will need to at least get into a good college.

The awful truth is that for uneducated parents or poorly educated parents in poor schools, they have no idea of what the education that opens the door to college and career even looks like. They are not the guides that their children can get help from. As a result, they completely cede control to the school and not question any made up statistics that the school tells them. They are gullible and they are powerless. They are fed the lies by unscrupulous administrators that the achievement gap is completely filled in their schools.

They do not even understand what they hear because they themselves are poorly educated. They will not be involved with the PTA because they see no reason to advocate for their child. They can easily be manipulated by MCPS and school administration to advocate for dismantling programs that they think give unfair advantages to other children doing better than theirs. They are fed the lies that their kids are doing poorly because other kids have taken the resources of their children. They never ask more of the administration and the teachers, but somehow their sense of entitlement to get some sort of restitution from others doing better than them is immense.

I think the PTA of rich schools should not feel guilty for what they do for their own children. I find this misplaced guilt even more annoying than the fact that they have money. Seriously.

MCPS provides the same to rich and poor schools. However, the parents of poor school cannot even maximize what opportunities MCPS provides. However, they will bellyache about the icecream socials that the rich school kids get through their PTA. They don't know that they need to ask MCPS for more Math and English tutoring, more experienced teachers, more aides in the classrooms. This is the level of understanding of their own problems.

Rich parents want their kids to go to college and know what career path they will choose. Poor parents don't have any idea of what this path will mean. They are aware that other kids are doing better but it is easier to be the fake victim of others pickpocketing their "golden" opportunities rather than to accept that they are in a deep, deep hole because of whatever reasons and they need to get the help to get out of it. That is the reason this thread was started. To blame for your own misfortunes and shortcoming someone else, rather than face what your own disadvantages are and find a way out. They don't acknowledge their problems and swallow the bitter pill, so their ongoing chronic disease of underachievement is never addressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.

Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

Schools are funded similarly by MCPS. In fact, some baseline ECs are available for each school from MCPS and the county. What is needed though is for parents to ask for it via the PTA etc. However, most of us are unaware of what we need to do, what the PTA can do, what MCPS can do and we are given the runaround. That is why, after hating the PTA for many years, I joined the PTA and used their respources to bring programs to my kid's school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.


Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

There are rules (in the name of equity and impartiality) that prevents PTA to donate to teachers directly. A workaround is creating a foundation where you can give "grants" to teachers for supplies.

Another thing is the MCPS gives some money to teachers for supplies each year BUT, they can only order from MCPS-approved vendors and these vendors have marked up their supplies to astronomical amounts. Buying a stapler for a teacher through the approved MCPS vendor means that the teacher has used almost half of their recommended amount. Follow the money and ask for the list of these vendors and their prices. MCPS is very corrupt.

The teachers are also not very helpful because of their unions and other interests to make things easier. They can create a combined wishlist but they don't. Some of them are corrupt also and have items that they don't use in the classroom. I was giving jumbo sized everything to my son's teacher from COSTCO and he was basically taking some home. Eventually, I started to ration it for him for each quarter. It was tiresome.

[Anonymous]

We need to suppress students who are doing too well academically by eliminating tracking and ap classes. We also need to definitely enforcing equity with ptas. I totally agree, OP. We need to end poverty. We need to ensure that everyone has the same decision making capacity or enforce decisions so that all decisions are the same and everyone achieves the same outcome even if we need to hold some back to achieve it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We need to suppress students who are doing too well academically by eliminating tracking and ap classes. We also need to definitely enforcing equity with ptas. I totally agree, OP. We need to end poverty. We need to ensure that everyone has the same decision making capacity or enforce decisions so that all decisions are the same and everyone achieves the same outcome even if we need to hold some back to achieve it.

A few of us are trying to have a serious conversation here. I'm sure you can find something else to do with your time...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was President of one of these more wealthy associations and we donated a huge amount of money to the county to disperse to other schools that didn't have the same level of participation as the more successful schools. We also mentored their association on fund raising etc. It isn't that they don't have the money in those areas, it is they lack participation.

And why do you think they lack participation? People are working! People that don't make as much money have more inflexible jobs. They also tend to work in the evenings when these meetings are held (like me). They also probably can't afford a house cleaner, so they have to keep up their house themselves after work. They also probably can't afford to order take out as much either-- cooking dinner takes time. They might also not have two cars, or might have to rely on public transportation to make it to the school-- public transportation that stops running or gets scarce later in the day. It blows my mind that people don't see the connection. A lack of participation doesn't mean that parents don't care-- it's that they don't have the energy to do so after all the other work they have to do. The wealthy have easier lives in a million little ways that add up to them having more energy to participate.

+1

Some, as evidenced by the responses in the thread, clearly see the connection. They just don't think their advantages are "unfair" and maybe they aren't strictly "unfair"

That said, I don't believe any of these near million dollar foundations are just buying blackboards and chalk. People don't park that kind of money in a foundations without gaining other advantages.

I doubt any of them are going to discuss that here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.

Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

MCPS does not ban it, the principals do. We are sharing the teacher wish lists via our parent chat group. Not an issue at all.

MCPS offered tutoring for free last year, this summer and this fall. Some of the schools offered summer school and summer camps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.


Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

There are rules (in the name of equity and impartiality) that prevents PTA to donate to teachers directly. A workaround is creating a foundation where you can give "grants" to teachers for supplies.

Another thing is the MCPS gives some money to teachers for supplies each year BUT, they can only order from MCPS-approved vendors and these vendors have marked up their supplies to astronomical amounts. Buying a stapler for a teacher through the approved MCPS vendor means that the teacher has used almost half of their recommended amount. Follow the money and ask for the list of these vendors and their prices. MCPS is very corrupt.

The teachers are also not very helpful because of their unions and other interests to make things easier. They can create a combined wishlist but they don't. Some of them are corrupt also and have items that they don't use in the classroom. I was giving jumbo sized everything to my son's teacher from COSTCO and he was basically taking some home. Eventually, I started to ration it for him for each quarter. It was tiresome.

Just send in extra of everything asked plus tons of clorox or other brand wipes, kleenex and if they have snacks, send lots of packaged snacks. We did that every year inn ES. I don't get why teachers should even have to ask. And, send in books/games for indoor recess.

Its funny the rich families are the one complaining. Those schools are used to having little money and making due.

And, some of it is on the PTA. We've been at a few schools where the PTA was controlled by a few friends who did nothing and didn't want help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We need to suppress students who are doing too well academically by eliminating tracking and ap classes. We also need to definitely enforcing equity with ptas. I totally agree, OP. We need to end poverty. We need to ensure that everyone has the same decision making capacity or enforce decisions so that all decisions are the same and everyone achieves the same outcome even if we need to hold some back to achieve it.

PTA's are private organizations. There is nothing not monitor or police. The issue is with MCCPTA and things they could do are reduce dues for low income schools and provide grants to low income schools, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m not sure why this is a PTA issue. At our prior ES, our teachers would create Amazon lists and the room parents would send via email supply lists and the parents would buy everything and then some for classroom supplies.

Why do so many counties ban the sharing of Amazon lists to parents? I'm at a high FARMs school and I'd buy anything off my teacher's list.

I'm convinced that counties/state/America likes income segregation. Why else would they not allow parents to pick and choose schools? Why else would schools not be funded similarly? My current school's boundaries were reconfigured to create a high poverty school so that it would be designated as a Title one school. They would get more money for resource teachers and help kids learn English, hire more translators for parents, etc. When poverty is such an issue like this, why aren't they starting long before Kindergarten?! Where are the tutoring summer camps and after care programs?

Schools are funded similarly by MCPS. In fact, some baseline ECs are available for each school from MCPS and the county. What is needed though is for parents to ask for it via the PTA etc. However, most of us are unaware of what we need to do, what the PTA can do, what MCPS can do and we are given the runaround. That is why, after hating the PTA for many years, I joined the PTA and used their respources to bring programs to my kid's school.

As a parent, I learned most PTA's don't focus on teachers and the parents pet projects so you are far best to buy directly for the teacher - extra supplies, books, games, snacks, cleaning products. Just send it in so if they are at a school that they cannot ask, they get it. Or, you can send up to 5 $20 gift cards a year per teacher. Just not all at once.

[Anonymous]

I don't actually like anything my PTA funds, so I'm not interested in donating or joining them. I give my teacher an anonymous gift card to Amazon at the beginning of the year. I also volunteer when asked. I send in balls/toys/games because last year there wasn't *one* toy on the entire playground for Kindergarteners. DD said something about it on the first day and I didn't believe her. But then the whining kept continuing so I contacted the teacher and then the principal- nope- no toys! They expected them to just sit and talk or run around? I mean it was a walled in courtyard that didn't even have a bench/ball/play structure/chalk- nothing!

The things my school needs funded, can't be funded by PTA: new playground equipment, more teachers, tutoring, redone bathrooms/ cafeterias/ libraries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PTA President here at a middle school with a FARMS rate of over 55% and parent engagement is very little (despite the PTA trying). We have a small budget, are overworked (all officers have full-time jobs), and we have a small membership. Two miles away is another MS which has an entirely opposite profile- teachers have a $150 stipend, PTA budget over $25K, totally engaged parent community with a lot of volunteers. It's the classic story of the Haves vs the Have-Nots. I would love to see a PTA organization at a pre-defined regional level where a good amount of the funds raised are split evenly across the schools within the same region. Notice I didn't say cluster level since even amongst the clusters, SES can still be very segregated.

I think if you want everything to be equal then that should be the county’s job and not PTA’s. What would be the role of a PTA?

As I suggested, the MCCPTA (county level) can rethink how PTAs are organized today. The role of the PTA is to support their schools which is absolutely still needed. The issue is, because of the way our school assignments are done, some schools don't have that support system at all. Do you know that some schools don't even have a PTA?

But the parents at those schools are welcome to start one if they want one. Because they don’t choose to start one doesn’t mean my school should not be allowed to have one!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PTA President here at a middle school with a FARMS rate of over 55% and parent engagement is very little (despite the PTA trying). We have a small budget, are overworked (all officers have full-time jobs), and we have a small membership. Two miles away is another MS which has an entirely opposite profile- teachers have a $150 stipend, PTA budget over $25K, totally engaged parent community with a lot of volunteers. It's the classic story of the Haves vs the Have-Nots. I would love to see a PTA organization at a pre-defined regional level where a good amount of the funds raised are split evenly across the schools within the same region. Notice I didn't say cluster level since even amongst the clusters, SES can still be very segregated.

I think if you want everything to be equal then that should be the county’s job and not PTA’s. What would be the role of a PTA?

As I suggested, the MCCPTA (county level) can rethink how PTAs are organized today. The role of the PTA is to support their schools which is absolutely still needed. The issue is, because of the way our school assignments are done, some schools don't have that support system at all. Do you know that some schools don't even have a PTA?

But the parents at those schools are welcome to start one if they want one. Because they don’t choose to start one doesn’t mean my school should not be allowed to have one!

No one is saying that. What I was simply suggesting was that instead of having an overall MCCPTA (county level) PTA where truthfully they don't accomplish much with the exception of collecting a percentage of everyone's membership fee- why don't we have multiple regional ones that actually take some of that money and distribute it evenly back to all schools that are within their region? We have a PTA at our school and no, it's not booming like the W schools but even I can sympathize for schools that don't have PTAs or have PTAs that struggle to get parent involvement.