The Italian should have won gold, not Jade (floor exercise)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some people like ballet. To each their own. But this wasn't a ballet competition. Judge it by the rules that govern the event.

This isn’t the gymnastics of Nadia anymore. You have to hit the difficulty scores.

This. It's a sport about tumbling and doing hard things in tough spaces. IMO it make be less of a performance to watch, but it's a sport not a entertainment experience and I think it's as it should be. It's not about how much the audience enjoys it, but about how hard and accurate the skills are.

If you want more about grace and performance, there are a lot of dance competitions, rhythmic gymnastics, cheerleading competitions etc. But artistic gymnastics is about the skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

+1. I appreciate the focus on athletic skill over "grace."

[Anonymous]

Essentially they are moving more in the direction of "figure skating" over "ice dancing". If you want more of an emphasis on the dance aspect, you might want to watch rhythmic gymnastics instead of the regular gymnastics. There is much more emphasis on the dance aspects and presentation (although there are still gymnastic requirements) over the tumbling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

+1. I appreciate the focus on athletic skill over "grace."

But the Italian demonstrated athletic skill—arguably more athleticism since her moves were more fluid.

Jade’s extra twists really weren’t landed well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

This!! It's like putting a ruffle on a bulging bicep. It's weirdly sexist to say "female gymnasts need to perform athletic feats and still put on a pretty show".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

+1. I appreciate the focus on athletic skill over "grace."

But the Italian demonstrated athletic skill—arguably more athleticism since her moves were more fluid.

Jade’s extra twists really weren’t landed well.

You are arguing that degree of difficulty shouldn't matter as much, and that gymnasts should eschew difficult routines that they may not execute perfectly for (much) easier ones that they can do more perfectly. I could not disagree more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

+1. I appreciate the focus on athletic skill over "grace."

But the Italian demonstrated athletic skill—arguably more athleticism since her moves were more fluid.

Jade’s extra twists really weren’t landed well.

Lol. Take it up with the expert judges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The current way that gymnastics is judged actually discourages athletes from performing dance moves or linking moves that look more graceful. If you are remembering routines from 20 or 30 years ago when the code of points favored those things, I can see how you would think this. But, modern athletes construct their routines based on the current scoring system. That is what Jade Carey did.

Agree with this. Jade deserved the win, based on how gymnastics is scored and technicals. But I also get what OP is saying. Women’s gymnastics has gone away from the dance, grace, artistry elements. Women’s gymnastics is looking more gender neutral, like a less powerful version of men’s gymnastics. A lot more is expected out of the women athletically now, but the trade off is it isn’t as enjoyable to watch. For me at least. I prefer the older style. But new times. That is ok.

I come out on the opposite side. I'm embarrassed that they still make the female gymnasts do silly dance moves to music rather than just letting them do tumbling passes interspersed with floor work like the men do. While there is something to be said for fluidity of movement in performing the skills, I want bigger, higher, twistier to win over the much squishier notions of "grace" and whatnot. I also find the modern form to be more enjoyable than the gymnastics of old.

This!! It's like putting a ruffle on a bulging bicep. It's weirdly sexist to say "female gymnasts need to perform athletic feats and still put on a pretty show".

Absolutely this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are your credentials as a judge, OP?

Oh, and I'm 48. So does that mean all I have to do is roll around for the gold?

+1. No one asked you OP. Because you’re not an expert or renowned in the sport.

Y’all realize that taking this “reasoning” to its “logical” conclusion means… no one who is not an EXPERT in a particular sport/art/field/etc. should ever show even the slightest interest in that sport/art/field/etc. let alone take time out of their to observe, form opinions, and actually have the audacity to express those opinions. After all, if YOU aren’t an expert, how would YOU know if something is bad? Or boring? Or good, for that matter?

[Anonymous]

Personally, I appreciate that there is room in the sport for a mix of skills and artistry. To be sure, Jade's artistry can't touch Vanessa's, whose routine was exquisite. If I had to pick one to watch over and over, it would be Vanessa's.

Nonetheless, Jade's floor exercise was more difficult, and as a PP mentioned, she executed non tumbling skills like her leaps well. The open ended code rewards difficulty, and that's why Jade won. If you look at the breakdown of scores, Jade's executive score was the second lowest of all of the floor competitors, but her difficulty was .6 greater.

[Anonymous]

I think Jade deserved the gold. Loved her performance.

[Anonymous]

Jade leaves me kind of cold. I guess I'm glad she had her moment, though. In the end, it was a nice, diversified medal haul for the U.S. women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jade was fine, but there was nothing graceful or impressive in her routine. Very meh.

The Italian was flawless and graceful. Her performance was mesmerizing. And, she’s 30.

Gymnastics is not about grace. The dance moves are there to make it pretty, but the actual gymnastics moves are what get them points.

[Anonymous]

Can’t they change the scoring system to value grace again? I miss that