Policy changes to DoD child care allow civilian families to be kicked out of CDC with 45 day notice

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Not great for DoD civs but the reality is members of the military should have first priority at CDCs on base.

+1. As a full time working military spouse who finally got into a CDC, I am very supportive of this new policy. But I recognize it does suck for the families who will be bumped, especially in this area where day care is scarce and expensive.

DoD civilians also work on base and for those overseas there is a lot of panic. We can't PCS without childcare. The answer should be adding spots, not displacing us - DoD actually has the largest subsidized child care program in the country. I'm really tired of being a 2nd class citizen in DoD. My job is to support the military and I work the same hours.

But you’re not in the military. There’s big differences and the new policy recognizes that.

Yes in a perfect world, there would be enough spots for every unit there isn’t.

And yet we deploy, PCS, and work in war zones... this will do wonders for retention.

It would be different if this was a policy going forward and we knew to expect it. To not grandfather in existing families in dumb. Maybe we could have spent money on increasing childcare instead of sucking DoD dry for a border wall.

But again.. you are not military. DoD civilians, generally speaking, move less and have more options than active duty military. Some DoD civilians do those things you reference, but many, particularly in this area, do not, and use CDCs at length in this area. Then again, some military do too.

However, all that being said, I actually agree with you, and I am surprised some grandfathering was not employed.

If grandfathering were employed it would take years to clean up the core problem which is that the waitlists are longer than the average PCS time for military families. Civilians are stable, they can find care elsewhere easily. Military cannot and need care immediately for relatively short periods of time.

Are you from the DC area? It is not easy to find care here. Waitlists are months long.

Military wait years for a spot depending on rank and priority. We got offered a spot after four years and being on three different lists. And, it was for an infant spot when our child was 4. The purpose of the CDC is for military. That's like saying civilians should also get all the other "perks" like health care, fitness center, discounts, etc.

[Anonymous]

Hear hear. I fully agree with this. Why are DOD civilians getting subsidized childcare? It’s absolutely ridiculous. You are not as mission essential as active duty are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not great for DoD civs but the reality is members of the military should have first priority at CDCs on base.

+1. As a full time working military spouse who finally got into a CDC, I am very supportive of this new policy. But I recognize it does suck for the families who will be bumped, especially in this area where day care is scarce and expensive.

DoD civilians also work on base and for those overseas there is a lot of panic. We can't PCS without childcare. The answer should be adding spots, not displacing us - DoD actually has the largest subsidized child care program in the country. I'm really tired of being a 2nd class citizen in DoD. My job is to support the military and I work the same hours.

But you’re not in the military. There’s big differences and the new policy recognizes that.

Yes in a perfect world, there would be enough spots for every unit there isn’t.

And yet we deploy, PCS, and work in war zones... this will do wonders for retention.

It would be different if this was a policy going forward and we knew to expect it. To not grandfather in existing families in dumb. Maybe we could have spent money on increasing childcare instead of sucking DoD dry for a border wall.

But again.. you are not military. DoD civilians, generally speaking, move less and have more options than active duty military. Some DoD civilians do those things you reference, but many, particularly in this area, do not, and use CDCs at length in this area. Then again, some military do too.

However, all that being said, I actually agree with you, and I am surprised some grandfathering was not employed.

If grandfathering were employed it would take years to clean up the core problem which is that the waitlists are longer than the average PCS time for military families. Civilians are stable, they can find care elsewhere easily. Military cannot and need care immediately for relatively short periods of time.

Are you from the DC area? It is not easy to find care here. Waitlists are months long.

Military wait years for a spot depending on rank and priority. We got offered a spot after four years and being on three different lists. And, it was for an infant spot when our child was 4. The purpose of the CDC is for military. That's like saying civilians should also get all the other "perks" like health care, fitness center, discounts, etc.

Actually, that’s not the purpose of the CDC. It’s to provide quality childcare for DoD personnel with different priorities in order to meet the overall goal of the operation of the Department of Defense. That is why DoD civilians and even contractors are eligible. Also, the another poster’s ill-informed point- There are hundreds of mission essential civilian DoD employees. In fact, when commands go into mission essential only status, some active duty members do not have to come to work, while some civilians do. It depends on what you do and what is going on that is causing mission essential status only.

For example, you can’t tell me right now civilian physicians are less mission critical than many active duty jobs.

Also, people commenting don’t even seem to have read the policy. The complaint is not priority— it’s the fact that children of civilians can be kicked out with little notice, especially for the DC area and overseas locations where finding childcare on the economy is extraordinarily difficult. Not to mention I think that’s a terrible thing to do to young children once they’re happy and adjusted and have formed bonds in a caretaking environment.

The most maddening part is the Esper stated the rationale being military members have less stability, move more, etc than civilians, but apparently civilians overseas with equally short assignments overseas were not considered.

Please don’t comment on things about which you know nothing.

[Anonymous]

“Generally speaking” yes civilians are more stable. But that’s the problem with blanket policies with no nuance. Some civilian position and for some locations, particularly overseas, that is not the case. In fact, in some overseas locations, childcare facilities outside of base will not accept DoD civilian children or military children bc of their tax-exempt status. Policy changes are find, but ones implemented without consideration of all circumstances are not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Generally speaking” yes civilians are more stable. But that’s the problem with blanket policies with no nuance. Some civilian position and for some locations, particularly overseas, that is not the case. In fact, in some overseas locations, childcare facilities outside of base will not accept DoD civilian children or military children bc of their tax-exempt status. Policy changes are find, but ones implemented without consideration of all circumstances are not.

But why do you need SUBSIDIZED child care as a DOD civilian? And there are many many care options in this area. Choose bone of them and pay full price. Get a nanny. Do what every other person does. And most DOD civilians choose to go overseas bc of the perks. Stop acting like you are forced to go overseas or that you get orders every two years. You don’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Generally speaking” yes civilians are more stable. But that’s the problem with blanket policies with no nuance. Some civilian position and for some locations, particularly overseas, that is not the case. In fact, in some overseas locations, childcare facilities outside of base will not accept DoD civilian children or military children bc of their tax-exempt status. Policy changes are find, but ones implemented without consideration of all circumstances are not.

You do realize under this policy active duty families can get bumped too, right? This whole policy recognizes that too many people are using CDCs than is sustainable. This is “souring the milk” so to speak. Less people will see CDCs as a good option now, which will free up space for those the DoD has deemed top priority.

And don’t try to gatekeep this conversation. Anyone who is active duty orders and figuring out child care has every right to voice their support or opposition.

[Anonymous]

Coast Guard is getting bumped too.

I think investing more in care must come in conjunction with this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Generally speaking” yes civilians are more stable. But that’s the problem with blanket policies with no nuance. Some civilian position and for some locations, particularly overseas, that is not the case. In fact, in some overseas locations, childcare facilities outside of base will not accept DoD civilian children or military children bc of their tax-exempt status. Policy changes are find, but ones implemented without consideration of all circumstances are not.

You do realize under this policy active duty families can get bumped too, right? This whole policy recognizes that too many people are using CDCs than is sustainable. This is “souring the milk” so to speak. Less people will see CDCs as a good option now, which will free up space for those the DoD has deemed top priority.

And don’t try to gatekeep this conversation. Anyone who is active duty orders and figuring out child care has every right to voice their support or opposition.

Actually the active duty that get bumped under the new policy are active duty members with non-working spouses. Get a job or watch your kid(s). Your choice...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Generally speaking” yes civilians are more stable. But that’s the problem with blanket policies with no nuance. Some civilian position and for some locations, particularly overseas, that is not the case. In fact, in some overseas locations, childcare facilities outside of base will not accept DoD civilian children or military children bc of their tax-exempt status. Policy changes are find, but ones implemented without consideration of all circumstances are not.

You do realize under this policy active duty families can get bumped too, right? This whole policy recognizes that too many people are using CDCs than is sustainable. This is “souring the milk” so to speak. Less people will see CDCs as a good option now, which will free up space for those the DoD has deemed top priority.

And don’t try to gatekeep this conversation. Anyone who is active duty orders and figuring out child care has every right to voice their support or opposition.

Actually the active duty that get bumped under the new policy are active duty members with non-working spouses. Get a job or watch your kid(s). Your choice...

Actually, active duty with part time spouses, those seeking employment and those in school can also be bumped. The writings on the wall on what the CDC’s are going to be from now on.

[Anonymous]

Does anyone have any recent experience with this new policy? How is this being handled during the pandemic?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe one way to make this a bit more fair for those that get bumped is to give them priority in the Fee Assistance program (as I know there is a waitlist for that). In addition, they should be put to the top of the waitlist in their corresponding priority class.

Why should a DoD civilian, with no military spouse get fee assistance for daycare? Other federal employees pay full price for daycare. DoD should be no different.

[Anonymous]

My anecdotal experience with the Ft. Myer CDC: My husband was deployed in 2015 and I was simultaneously moving across the country with my two young kids (and pregnant with my third). I had landed a dream job and was trying to secure childcare so I could start work. DoD civilian children had filled up the pre-K rooms (they aged up in the system and generally don't PCS out) and I was told there was literally no shot at getting my kids in there. I literally BEGGED for any private daycare to let my kids essentially "jump the line" and one of them took pity on me. Quite literally, with two year military orders, I could not afford to wait in line. This is an example of a military readiness problem. What if I was single active duty? Or dual active duty? I am so glad this common sense policy is finally going into effect. While it might not benefit me anymore, it is the right thing to do. And as a active duty/civilian family, I fully support the concept that single and dual active duty families would get priority over mine.