School bus tickets seem like a scam that scream corruption

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's completely a scam.
Trying getting a ticket across a six lane highway (WTH are kids gettign dropped off across the street on a six lane highway, right before the ONRAMP to I270 where there are literally NO HOMES) while it's snowing, and you're in lane 6 in the opposite direction. Oh yes, so F'in EASY to see. And $275 in fines. Why is there a bus stop there at all? And it's SNOWING. And I"m supposed to rotate my head back and forth constantly 180 degrees while driving, paying attention to what's happening six lanes over from me in the opposite direction where, in common sense, there should be no bus stop.

Then come to find out the revenue is going to the camera installer.
Infuriating.

PP, if you can't see a big yellow school bus with flashing red lights and a strobe light on top, then you shouldn't be allowed to drive. You're endangering all of us.

PP You are not from here. A big old tractor trailer can easily hide a school bus any day. Who do you think can see the strobes on the top of the buses? Not small cars.

Cars in the Opposite direction from a school bus don't get any warning of the bus stopping. If you want drivers to be focused 6 lanes over staring at buses then you must want lots of rear end collisions. That would be distracted driving to be focused in on something so remote to the road you are traveling on.

The poster on the ticket above perfectly illustrates one of the huge problems with this scheme. In other jurisdictions, schools are prohibited from dropping children off on six lane roads. Those jurisdictions know it is too dangerous, so they don't do it. MCPS loves putting kids in danger, seeing them RUN across SIX lanes of traffic and then try to blame drivers for an inherently dangerous bus stop. If MCPS is so worried about safety, then move the bus stop to a safe location like is done in other jurisdictions that care about student safety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's completely a scam.
Trying getting a ticket across a six lane highway (WTH are kids gettign dropped off across the street on a six lane highway, right before the ONRAMP to I270 where there are literally NO HOMES) while it's snowing, and you're in lane 6 in the opposite direction. Oh yes, so F'in EASY to see. And $275 in fines. Why is there a bus stop there at all? And it's SNOWING. And I"m supposed to rotate my head back and forth constantly 180 degrees while driving, paying attention to what's happening six lanes over from me in the opposite direction where, in common sense, there should be no bus stop.

Then come to find out the revenue is going to the camera installer.
Infuriating.

And the scheme does not follow Maryland law. That came out at the hearing Monday. The police were authorized to put cameras on school buses, not MCPS. But MCPS contracted with this vendor so this contract is outside what is permitted by Maryland law. Only about half of the citations are getting paid and no one is getting their registration suspended.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's completely a scam.
Trying getting a ticket across a six lane highway (WTH are kids gettign dropped off across the street on a six lane highway, right before the ONRAMP to I270 where there are literally NO HOMES) while it's snowing, and you're in lane 6 in the opposite direction. Oh yes, so F'in EASY to see. And $275 in fines. Why is there a bus stop there at all? And it's SNOWING. And I"m supposed to rotate my head back and forth constantly 180 degrees while driving, paying attention to what's happening six lanes over from me in the opposite direction where, in common sense, there should be no bus stop.

Then come to find out the revenue is going to the camera installer.
Infuriating.

PP, if you can't see a big yellow school bus with flashing red lights and a strobe light on top, then you shouldn't be allowed to drive. You're endangering all of us.

PP You are not from here. A big old tractor trailer can easily hide a school bus any day. Who do you think can see the strobes on the top of the buses? Not small cars.

Cars in the Opposite direction from a school bus don't get any warning of the bus stopping. If you want drivers to be focused 6 lanes over staring at buses then you must want lots of rear end collisions. That would be distracted driving to be focused in on something so remote to the road you are traveling on.

The poster on the ticket above perfectly illustrates one of the huge problems with this scheme. In other jurisdictions, schools are prohibited from dropping children off on six lane roads. Those jurisdictions know it is too dangerous, so they don't do it. MCPS loves putting kids in danger, seeing them RUN across SIX lanes of traffic and then try to blame drivers for an inherently dangerous bus stop. If MCPS is so worried about safety, then move the bus stop to a safe location like is done in other jurisdictions that care about student safety.

I am from here. Never mind about what MCPS is or isn't doing. Your obligation, when you're driving, is to obey the law. And that includes stopping for stopped school buses. They're not hard to see, even on six-lane roads. If you can't do that, you should surrender your driver's license.

[Anonymous]

I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's completely a scam.
Trying getting a ticket across a six lane highway (WTH are kids gettign dropped off across the street on a six lane highway, right before the ONRAMP to I270 where there are literally NO HOMES) while it's snowing, and you're in lane 6 in the opposite direction. Oh yes, so F'in EASY to see. And $275 in fines. Why is there a bus stop there at all? And it's SNOWING. And I"m supposed to rotate my head back and forth constantly 180 degrees while driving, paying attention to what's happening six lanes over from me in the opposite direction where, in common sense, there should be no bus stop.

Then come to find out the revenue is going to the camera installer.
Infuriating.

PP, if you can't see a big yellow school bus with flashing red lights and a strobe light on top, then you shouldn't be allowed to drive. You're endangering all of us.

PP You are not from here. A big old tractor trailer can easily hide a school bus any day. Who do you think can see the strobes on the top of the buses? Not small cars.

Cars in the Opposite direction from a school bus don't get any warning of the bus stopping. If you want drivers to be focused 6 lanes over staring at buses then you must want lots of rear end collisions. That would be distracted driving to be focused in on something so remote to the road you are traveling on.

The poster on the ticket above perfectly illustrates one of the huge problems with this scheme. In other jurisdictions, schools are prohibited from dropping children off on six lane roads. Those jurisdictions know it is too dangerous, so they don't do it. MCPS loves putting kids in danger, seeing them RUN across SIX lanes of traffic and then try to blame drivers for an inherently dangerous bus stop. If MCPS is so worried about safety, then move the bus stop to a safe location like is done in other jurisdictions that care about student safety.

I am from here. Never mind about what MCPS is or isn't doing. Your obligation, when you're driving, is to obey the law. And that includes stopping for stopped school buses. They're not hard to see, even on six-lane roads. If you can't do that, you should surrender your driver's license.

Which law do you want obeyed? The one where the bus driver has to have their warning lights on for so many feet before they stop? You realize that someone 6 lanes over going the opposite direction will never get that warning. Never. But you want those drivers to magically stop when they are on the exact opposite side of the street from a school bus as it stops? What kind of super powers do you have that none of the rest of us have?

What about the law that said the police were to put these cameras on school buses? Oh, that law doesn't matter? Please list which laws matter and which don't and include the CEO of this company and the crimes he committed in your list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

Some of the tickets have been given out for cars stopped next to buses in traffic. These cameras literally just take a picture of what is next to it and the company sends a citation. The company is flooding the two police staff that review the citations with so many citations that they can't possibly keep up with reviewing them all. That allows non violations to get through and then the only recourse is to show up in District Court. 20% of the citations passed from the company to MCPS can be invalid under the scheme MCPS agreed to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Which law do you want obeyed? The one where the bus driver has to have their warning lights on for so many feet before they stop? You realize that someone 6 lanes over going the opposite direction will never get that warning. Never. But you want those drivers to magically stop when they are on the exact opposite side of the street from a school bus as it stops? What kind of super powers do you have that none of the rest of us have?

What about the law that said the police were to put these cameras on school buses? Oh, that law doesn't matter? Please list which laws matter and which don't and include the CEO of this company and the crimes he committed in your list.

This one.

MD Transp Code § 21-706 (2013)
§21-706.

(a) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle shall stop at least 20 feet from the rear of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its rear, or at least 20 feet from the front of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its front.

(b) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle may not proceed until the school vehicle resumes motion or the alternately flashing red lights are deactivated.

(c) This section does not apply to the driver of a vehicle on a divided highway, if the school vehicle is on a different roadway.

That's the one that applies to you when you're driving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Which law do you want obeyed? The one where the bus driver has to have their warning lights on for so many feet before they stop? You realize that someone 6 lanes over going the opposite direction will never get that warning. Never. But you want those drivers to magically stop when they are on the exact opposite side of the street from a school bus as it stops? What kind of super powers do you have that none of the rest of us have?

What about the law that said the police were to put these cameras on school buses? Oh, that law doesn't matter? Please list which laws matter and which don't and include the CEO of this company and the crimes he committed in your list.

This one.

MD Transp Code § 21-706 (2013)
§21-706.

(a) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle shall stop at least 20 feet from the rear of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its rear, or at least 20 feet from the front of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its front.

(b) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle may not proceed until the school vehicle resumes motion or the alternately flashing red lights are deactivated.

(c) This section does not apply to the driver of a vehicle on a divided highway, if the school vehicle is on a different roadway.

That's the one that applies to you when you're driving.

So you don't want to apply the one that applies to who installs the cameras, so skip that law.

But you want this one? Then you need to read what you posted.

"or at least 20 feet from the front of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its front."

That means for any cars that are already next to the school bus they can not legally comply with this law unless they put their car in reverse.

And therein lies the problem with these cameras. They give citations to cars that can't stop 20 feet from the front of the bus because they are next to the bus when the stop arm comes out.

About half of the people getting these citations don't pay them at all, so they aren't being taken seriously and aren't changing behaviors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

OK trolls, turn on your super powers and find the bus in this image. You can see it, right? Other side of the road, coming toward you. Got it?

https://tinyurl.com/vuebga6

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

OK trolls, turn on your super powers and find the bus in this image. You can see it, right? Other side of the road, coming toward you. Got it?

https://tinyurl.com/vuebga6

So first of all, if you're in a traffic jam like that, you're not going to get a ticket for passing a school bus.

And second of all (pointing out the obvious here), that's not actually a driver's eye view.

Please stop making excuses for why you violated the law while driving, by passing a stopped school bus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Which law do you want obeyed? The one where the bus driver has to have their warning lights on for so many feet before they stop? You realize that someone 6 lanes over going the opposite direction will never get that warning. Never. But you want those drivers to magically stop when they are on the exact opposite side of the street from a school bus as it stops? What kind of super powers do you have that none of the rest of us have?

What about the law that said the police were to put these cameras on school buses? Oh, that law doesn't matter? Please list which laws matter and which don't and include the CEO of this company and the crimes he committed in your list.

This one.

MD Transp Code § 21-706 (2013)
§21-706.

(a) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle shall stop at least 20 feet from the rear of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its rear, or at least 20 feet from the front of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its front.

(b) If a school vehicle has stopped on a roadway and is operating the alternately flashing red lights specified in § 22-228 of this article, the driver of any other vehicle meeting or overtaking the school vehicle may not proceed until the school vehicle resumes motion or the alternately flashing red lights are deactivated.

(c) This section does not apply to the driver of a vehicle on a divided highway, if the school vehicle is on a different roadway.

That's the one that applies to you when you're driving.

So you don't want to apply the one that applies to who installs the cameras, so skip that law.

But you want this one? Then you need to read what you posted.

"or at least 20 feet from the front of the school vehicle, if approaching the school vehicle from its front."

That means for any cars that are already next to the school bus they can not legally comply with this law unless they put their car in reverse.

And therein lies the problem with these cameras. They give citations to cars that can't stop 20 feet from the front of the bus because they are next to the bus when the stop arm comes out.

About half of the people getting these citations don't pay them at all, so they aren't being taken seriously and aren't changing behaviors.

Mom, how come you're punishing me for breaking the rule about not taking my phone upstairs, when Sophia's mom didn't punish her for using her phone in class?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

OK trolls, turn on your super powers and find the bus in this image. You can see it, right? Other side of the road, coming toward you. Got it?

https://tinyurl.com/vuebga6

So first of all, if you're in a traffic jam like that, you're not going to get a ticket for passing a school bus.

And second of all (pointing out the obvious here), that's not actually a driver's eye view.

Please stop making excuses for why you violated the law while driving, by passing a stopped school bus.

And there is where you are wrong Tickets are being given out for this situation.
Please stop making excuses for giving out citations to drivers who have not violated the law so that you can collect 100% of the fine money for a private company.

This is a money making scheme that has ultimately failed in a number of other jurisdictions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

OK trolls, turn on your super powers and find the bus in this image. You can see it, right? Other side of the road, coming toward you. Got it?

https://tinyurl.com/vuebga6

So first of all, if you're in a traffic jam like that, you're not going to get a ticket for passing a school bus.

And second of all (pointing out the obvious here), that's not actually a driver's eye view.

Please stop making excuses for why you violated the law while driving, by passing a stopped school bus.

And there is where you are wrong Tickets are being given out for this situation.
Please stop making excuses for giving out citations to drivers who have not violated the law so that you can collect 100% of the fine money for a private company.

This is a money making scheme that has ultimately failed in a number of other jurisdictions.

Whom are you addressing? If you got a ticket for passing a stopped school bus, when you didn't pass a school bus, that's a problem. If you got a ticket for passing a stopped school bus, when you did pass a stopped school bus, then the problem is that you passed a stopped school bus. Stop doing that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm with PP on this one. My husband got one of these on a six lane road with a nearly 50 MPH speed limit. He was in the farthest most right lane, bus was farthest lane opposite side. There were FOUR LANES of traffic moving between them. We watched the video. The bus stopped just as he was passing on the opposite side. He would have a) had to have been looking completely perpendicular to the road to see the bus through, again, FOUR lanes of moving traffic on dangerous road that buses have NO business stopping on in the first place and then SLAMMED on his brakes going 45 mph. That sounds like a safe scenario! The craziest part was to fight it he would have had to go to Annapolis and apparently if you lose the fight they can double the ticket.

It takes some doing to not see a school bus, especially since the driver flips the yellow lights on first.

OK trolls, turn on your super powers and find the bus in this image. You can see it, right? Other side of the road, coming toward you. Got it?

https://tinyurl.com/vuebga6

So first of all, if you're in a traffic jam like that, you're not going to get a ticket for passing a school bus.

And second of all (pointing out the obvious here), that's not actually a driver's eye view.

Please stop making excuses for why you violated the law while driving, by passing a stopped school bus.

And there is where you are wrong Tickets are being given out for this situation.
Please stop making excuses for giving out citations to drivers who have not violated the law so that you can collect 100% of the fine money for a private company.

This is a money making scheme that has ultimately failed in a number of other jurisdictions.

Whom are you addressing? If you got a ticket for passing a stopped school bus, when you didn't pass a school bus, that's a problem. If you got a ticket for passing a stopped school bus, when you did pass a stopped school bus, then the problem is that you passed a stopped school bus. Stop doing that.

What's your solution to the both problems?

There is no help for the 20% of the citations going out for non violations.

The passing the school buses isn't stopping because of these cameras. Violations are still continuing and children are still in danger. Other jurisdictions have real solutions that are actually stopping cars from passing school buses. But that's the same force as you posting on an anonymous forum and saying "stop it." Sure.