My nephew wants to join the military. I think only suckers agree to fight Republican wars. Advice?

[Anonymous]

I can tell you that in elite Republican circles (donors, politicians, lobbyists, think tanks, the people that control the party) they absolutely do denigrate the people who enlist in the military as stupid. Usually it’s just to lump them in with the other “useful fools” in the GOP base that they can control by controlling the news media and preachers.

But the people who start the wars do look down on people in the military as not being very smart. (As mentioned above: there’s a reason few politicans’ kids are in the military today. It was different 50 years ago.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can tell you that in elite Republican circles (donors, politicians, lobbyists, think tanks, the people that control the party) they absolutely do denigrate the people who enlist in the military as stupid. Usually it’s just to lump them in with the other “useful fools” in the GOP base that they can control by controlling the news media and preachers.

But the people who start the wars do look down on people in the military as not being very smart. (As mentioned above: there’s a reason few politicans’ kids are in the military today. It was different 50 years ago.)

Simple solution. You pay for this child's continued education. Problem solved if you don't want him in the military. Few politicians kids go into the military as they have family who can afford to send them to college or have other career prospects.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My nephew is from a red area.
He is thinking about joining the military. He (and his Mom) think that this a good way to improve himself.

But we’ve seen what’s happened with our military over the past two decades: a useless war in Iraq, boosted by neocons and for profit of guys like Cheney and Erik Prince. Inability to rebuild Afghanistan, which Bush failed to have an endgame for and got us stuck in it for decades. An endless war on terror initiatiated by the same for-profit republicans, that has created terrorists abroad who hate us. (To be fair, fighting terror is important. But sacrificing our values with Guantanamo, CIA-endorsed torture with no accountability, and unConstitutional domestic wiretaps without following the correct process were major errors.)

In all these misguided conflicts, thousands of American lives were wasted. Truly wasted, though no politician will say so. And the people killed are largely from red states. People in cities largely saw through Bush’s lies and stayed out of fighting. Turns out: they were right.

Now a war in Iran looms. Why would anyone agree to fight that stupid, useless war, run by idiots like Bolton who haven’t learned the mistakes of Iraq?

I have hinted at all this to my nephew. But I’m worried about him. I want to say “Don’t be a sucker. If there is a war in Iran created by the GOP, you’ll fight it and you’ll be throwing away your life for no reason.”

Don’t tell me to stay out of it. I’m close to him and to his dad. The only question is, how do I reach him with the truth? What’s the best strategy to break through the lies he hears all around him in he place he lives? What’s the best approach?

You say fighting terrorism is important and we need a strong military. How are these things going to happen, in your view? Perhaps your truth is different from your nephew’s.

You should stop hinting around and have a discussion. As PPs have suggested, ask him why he is doing it, what branch he is thinking of joining, how he sees a career path, what his alternatives might be, etc. And try not to be judgmental and condescending. He is or soon will be an adult and has to make his own decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.
I said “Republican wars”, but I should have said “misguided wars that were never honestly discussed with the American people.”

Our country needs a strong military. But why would anyone choose to join a military that fights wars based on lies? Vietnam was bad enough; at least rich peoples’ kids fought in that one. But Iraq? Now maybe Iran?

I would have a much different opinion if Republicans had come out after 2008 and said “Iraq was a mistake. Thousands of Americans died for no reason. And trillions were wasted that could have improved our bridges, education, and roads. And now we are going to have a full national discussion of how we made that mistake and how to never make that mistake again.”

But now we are sliding towards another war in Iran for no reason. No one should sign up to support that.

You are contradicting yourself. Grow up. The government cannot tell us everything and needs to try to keep us safe. Do you not get it. They do what they can based off the information they have and they aren't telling us the entire story.

Since you want something different, why not pay for it? Maybe they cannot afford it. Military is very good for many people.

“Grow up” is the lamest, laziest response on this board. Reflects poorly on you. Make your point without insults, like an educated adult.

[Anonymous]

You need to NOT hint, but really spell it out. He is too emotionally immature at 18 to understand that he may deal with lifelong PTSD that may wind up with him killing someone, or getting killed. Or killing himself. Help him look at the statistics of the percentage of homeless people who are vets. Of how many people can't get medical help they need through the VA, or how long they have to wait to get help.

If he wants to improve himself, help him go to therapy.

[Anonymous]

OP, I am liberal. I hate Trump. I am terrified that we are going war with Iran. I share your world view. I think you are wrong to force it on family in different circumstances than you.

You have the luxury of thinking big picture on international politics. A kid from a red state without a lot of resources is thinking— how can I “better myself”— bootstrap his way in to a solid future for himself, when he doesn’t have the luxury of parents paying for college or maybe even supporting him after HS graduation.

It’s pretty condescending for you to prattle on about the Military Industrial complex, when this kid is thinking about supporting himself and workforce skills. Even if he agrees with you, he might not have a better option.

So rather than lecturing his family, help him find options. Look with him at ROTC programs, where at least he gets college paid for and goes in as an officer. Offer to pay for/ help him find pell grants for vocational or technical school, so he can better himself without the military.

If he is determined to enlist, help him find a specialty where his skills will be in demand when he leaves and look with him at GI Bill options.

I’m on your side politically. But keeping this kid safe is about helping him find another good option, not lecturing about how their political viewpoint is wrong”.

So you do some research, and see what you can offer financially and say—

I love you so much. And I am so proud that you have group up to have the courage and strength of character to want to serve our country and make a good future for yourself. But, worried about your enlisting at a time when we are looking at possible war with Iran/ NK. Would you mind sitting down with me and looking at some possibilities I found where you would be safer than if you enlisted into infantry, but might accomplish the same goals?

Do not mix red state blue state politics or value judgments with this discussion. If this kid enlists, you could well end up estranged from your family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.
I said “Republican wars”, but I should have said “misguided wars that were never honestly discussed with the American people.”

Our country needs a strong military. But why would anyone choose to join a military that fights wars based on lies? Vietnam was bad enough; at least rich peoples’ kids fought in that one. But Iraq? Now maybe Iran?

I would have a much different opinion if Republicans had come out after 2008 and said “Iraq was a mistake. Thousands of Americans died for no reason. And trillions were wasted that could have improved our bridges, education, and roads. And now we are going to have a full national discussion of how we made that mistake and how to never make that mistake again.”

But now we are sliding towards another war in Iran for no reason. No one should sign up to support that.

You are contradicting yourself. Grow up. The government cannot tell us everything and needs to try to keep us safe. Do you not get it. They do what they can based off the information they have and they aren't telling us the entire story.

Since you want something different, why not pay for it? Maybe they cannot afford it. Military is very good for many people.

“Grow up” is the lamest, laziest response on this board. Reflects poorly on you. Make your point without insults, like an educated adult.

No, this person need to grow up. Either step up and financially and otherwise help this child or stay out of it. Ranting about how terrible the military is when clearly its this child's only option as no one is willing to help him is inappropriate. Military can be very good for many people. And, clearly this young man needs to get away from his family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I am liberal. I hate Trump. I am terrified that we are going war with Iran. I share your world view. I think you are wrong to force it on family in different circumstances than you.

You have the luxury of thinking big picture on international politics. A kid from a red state without a lot of resources is thinking— how can I “better myself”— bootstrap his way in to a solid future for himself, when he doesn’t have the luxury of parents paying for college or maybe even supporting him after HS graduation.

It’s pretty condescending for you to prattle on about the Military Industrial complex, when this kid is thinking about supporting himself and workforce skills. Even if he agrees with you, he might not have a better option.

So rather than lecturing his family, help him find options. Look with him at ROTC programs, where at least he gets college paid for and goes in as an officer. Offer to pay for/ help him find pell grants for vocational or technical school, so he can better himself without the military.

If he is determined to enlist, help him find a specialty where his skills will be in demand when he leaves and look with him at GI Bill options.

I’m on your side politically. But keeping this kid safe is about helping him find another good option, not lecturing about how their political viewpoint is wrong”.

So you do some research, and see what you can offer financially and say—

I love you so much. And I am so proud that you have group up to have the courage and strength of character to want to serve our country and make a good future for yourself. But, worried about your enlisting at a time when we are looking at possible war with Iran/ NK. Would you mind sitting down with me and looking at some possibilities I found where you would be safer than if you enlisted into infantry, but might accomplish the same goals?

Do not mix red state blue state politics or value judgments with this discussion. If this kid enlists, you could well end up estranged from your family.

When you enlist you don't always get a choice in wha too do. It doesn't work that way. You take tests and get assigned.

[Anonymous]

Dear OP, your darling Clinton bombed the heck out of Serbia and Kosovo and Bosnia. Without the UN approval. I suppose this makes no difference to you as pilots were up in the air. and never set foot on the ground? Depleted uranium cluster bombs too, that shook the ground and people are suffering from cancers in % that are unheard of.
But all that we learned on dcum is that you are yet another preachy, judgy aunt that knows what's best for the whole world. Usually it is people like you that are quick to judge, and never there to lend a hand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You need to NOT hint, but really spell it out. He is too emotionally immature at 18 to understand that he may deal with lifelong PTSD that may wind up with him killing someone, or getting killed. Or killing himself. Help him look at the statistics of the percentage of homeless people who are vets. Of how many people can't get medical help they need through the VA, or how long they have to wait to get help.

If he wants to improve himself, help him go to therapy.

Except the majority of military jobs are not front lines or about killing people so please, keep showing how clueless you are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I am liberal. I hate Trump. I am terrified that we are going war with Iran. I share your world view. I think you are wrong to force it on family in different circumstances than you.

You have the luxury of thinking big picture on international politics. A kid from a red state without a lot of resources is thinking— how can I “better myself”— bootstrap his way in to a solid future for himself, when he doesn’t have the luxury of parents paying for college or maybe even supporting him after HS graduation.

It’s pretty condescending for you to prattle on about the Military Industrial complex, when this kid is thinking about supporting himself and workforce skills. Even if he agrees with you, he might not have a better option.

So rather than lecturing his family, help him find options. Look with him at ROTC programs, where at least he gets college paid for and goes in as an officer. Offer to pay for/ help him find pell grants for vocational or technical school, so he can better himself without the military.

If he is determined to enlist, help him find a specialty where his skills will be in demand when he leaves and look with him at GI Bill options.

I’m on your side politically. But keeping this kid safe is about helping him find another good option, not lecturing about how their political viewpoint is wrong”.

So you do some research, and see what you can offer financially and say—

I love you so much. And I am so proud that you have group up to have the courage and strength of character to want to serve our country and make a good future for yourself. But, worried about your enlisting at a time when we are looking at possible war with Iran/ NK. Would you mind sitting down with me and looking at some possibilities I found where you would be safer than if you enlisted into infantry, but might accomplish the same goals?

Do not mix red state blue state politics or value judgments with this discussion. If this kid enlists, you could well end up estranged from your family.

When you enlist you don't always get a choice in wha too do. It doesn't work that way. You take tests and get assigned.

You take the ASVAB and can see the scores before you enlist. The Army, ay least, let’s you choose your specialty, if not the exact job when you enlist. It would be helpful for OP to encourage her nephew to work through so ASVABs, see what the score qualifies him to do, and choose a specialty he can build on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dear OP, your darling Clinton bombed the heck out of Serbia and Kosovo and Bosnia. Without the UN approval. I suppose this makes no difference to you as pilots were up in the air. and never set foot on the ground? Depleted uranium cluster bombs too, that shook the ground and people are suffering from cancers in % that are unheard of.
But all that we learned on dcum is that you are yet another preachy, judgy aunt that knows what's best for the whole world. Usually it is people like you that are quick to judge, and never there to lend a hand.

Do you have any points beside lame, wan whataboutism to deflect from the GOP's mistaken wars put on a credit card?

I wish there were two sides here. There were two sides in Vietnam, where both LBJ and Nixon bear massive responsibility (JFK much less, as it wasn't really clear how it would turn out in the early years.)

There are not two sides today. Republicans are at fault for getting American kids killed abroad in wars that were mistakes to start.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You need to NOT hint, but really spell it out. He is too emotionally immature at 18 to understand that he may deal with lifelong PTSD that may wind up with him killing someone, or getting killed. Or killing himself. Help him look at the statistics of the percentage of homeless people who are vets. Of how many people can't get medical help they need through the VA, or how long they have to wait to get help.

If he wants to improve himself, help him go to therapy.

Except the majority of military jobs are not front lines or about killing people so please, keep showing how clueless you are.

Most jobs in the Army or Marines are POG's. Persons other than grunts.

[Anonymous]

I'm more liberal than most everyone I know, but in this case, I'd say what you should do is tell your nephew you admire his courage and willingness to potentially sacrifice himself for his ideals. You should tell him you're proud of him. I didn't read every response. IF he said that he's only doing it to get money for college, then if you love him you should move heaven and earth to help him find alternative funding.

These aren't "Republican" wars. Every American is responsible for what is done in our name. Almost every one of us could be doing more to get our country governed in a way that is more in alignment with our ideals.

[Anonymous]

My grandfather joined the military and always spoke about how it was the first time in his life he had his own bed and always had meals. He was proud to have served, learned a trade and proudly worked until almost the day he died since he loved his job. I’m glad he enlisted when he did because it changed his life.