Goodbye Barcroft (APS)?

[Anonymous]

Man, there are some really nasty people on this site.

Randolph is close, but not next door to Barcroft. Geez, I can look at a map, including the walk zone maps APS just put out. APS maps show that elementary school kids cannot cross Columbia Pike or George Mason. So, how can kids who live north of Columbia Pike and west of George Mason WALK to Randolph.

And, how does sending lower income kids from one poor performing school, to another another (and higher FR/L) poor performing school help them????

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Man, there are some really nasty people on this site.

Randolph is close, but not next door to Barcroft. Geez, I can look at a map, including the walk zone maps APS just put out. APS maps show that elementary school kids cannot cross Columbia Pike or George Mason. So, how can kids who live north of Columbia Pike and west of George Mason WALK to Randolph.

And, how does sending lower income kids from one poor performing school, to another another (and higher FR/L) poor performing school help them????

Putting them on a bus for 5 blocks will be just fine. They will be ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Man, there are some really nasty people on this site.

Randolph is close, but not next door to Barcroft. Geez, I can look at a map, including the walk zone maps APS just put out. APS maps show that elementary school kids cannot cross Columbia Pike or George Mason. So, how can kids who live north of Columbia Pike and west of George Mason WALK to Randolph.

And, how does sending lower income kids from one poor performing school, to another another (and higher FR/L) poor performing school help them????

I think the better question is if you can somehow arrange options schools and boundaries so that only Randolph is a "bad" school instead of Carlin Spring, Randolph and Barcroft, is it worth it? That's 2 less schools of high poverty and one sacrificial lamb. So some kids are helped and some remain in the same (not great) situation. Yes, this is cynical, but I think it's part of the consideration.

[Anonymous]

So, if Barcroft and Carlin Springs are gone as a neighborhood schools, Randolph and Barrett (maybe) rises even further in FARMS. Ashlawn gets some more FARMS. If all Barcroft is sent to Randolph, APS can claim it only has one high FARMs elementary school.

I see that as a win win!

[Anonymous]

I really don't know if Spanish speaking families want their kids at immersion. DH's mom refused to teach him Spanish growing up because she thought English would be the best path for him. I think this is really common in a lot of immigrant/Spanish as a first language families.

That being said as a Claremont parent, I would be much happier with barcroft than carlin springs (just transportation wise).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man, there are some really nasty people on this site.

Randolph is close, but not next door to Barcroft. Geez, I can look at a map, including the walk zone maps APS just put out. APS maps show that elementary school kids cannot cross Columbia Pike or George Mason. So, how can kids who live north of Columbia Pike and west of George Mason WALK to Randolph.

And, how does sending lower income kids from one poor performing school, to another another (and higher FR/L) poor performing school help them????

I think the better question is if you can somehow arrange options schools and boundaries so that only Randolph is a "bad" school instead of Carlin Spring, Randolph and Barcroft, is it worth it? That's 2 less schools of high poverty and one sacrificial lamb. So some kids are helped and some remain in the same (not great) situation. Yes, this is cynical, but I think it's part of the consideration.

DP. I don't think it's cynical or making Randolph a "sacrificial lamb" to acknowledge that we don't have the ability to help all three through this particular process and helping two without helping the third is still better overall than maintaining the status quo. Let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

[Anonymous]

Native Spanish speaker here - APS is really wrong in thinking that moving the immersion schools close to Latino families will make the families apply for the school. Many immigrant families want their kids in English speaking schools because they think it is best for their kids. Claremont is not far from Columbia Pike, it is a quick bus ride. Distance isn't the issue here, but alas this SB doesn't always listen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Native Spanish speaker here - APS is really wrong in thinking that moving the immersion schools close to Latino families will make the families apply for the school. Many immigrant families want their kids in English speaking schools because they think it is best for their kids. Claremont is not far from Columbia Pike, it is a quick bus ride. Distance isn't the issue here, but alas this SB doesn't always listen.

I hope this is something the staff questionnaire will get at, because if this is a widely-held sentiment, maybe we don't need two immersion schools and part of the solution needs to be consolidating Key and Claremont into a single program to make room for another neighborhood school. Just turn Key neighborhood, move the immersion school to Carlin Springs, let Ashlawn pick up a lot of Carlin Springs to create more balance there, and then rework the boundaries in South Arlington and around Long Branch to balance things as much as possible. Realistically, we can't get around the fact that South Arlington schools as a whole have a 49% FARMS rate and there's only so far you can bus people into North Arlington to change that, but that doesn't mean you can't make the spread across South Arlington schools any better than 58 points (83% at Carlin Springs vs. 25% at Oakridge).

[Anonymous]

If they get one immersion program (which I am not entirely opposed to) I pray that they follow the method at Claremont over key. I obviously only have first hand knowledge of Claremont, but from what I heard from key it is a very different program and is not nearly as inclusive to Claremont (my friend describes the population as segregated, which is not my experience at Claremont).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Where do the kids who are zoned to Barcorft go if this happens? It says its one of the most walkable schools, but many people don't use it. I'm guessing the Spanish speaking kids would stay and walk, but what about families who don't want immersion?

Choice out like they right now. Making Barcroft immersion isn't about making UMC in the walk zone attend. It's to draw UMC from outside who want immersion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man, there are some really nasty people on this site.

Randolph is close, but not next door to Barcroft. Geez, I can look at a map, including the walk zone maps APS just put out. APS maps show that elementary school kids cannot cross Columbia Pike or George Mason. So, how can kids who live north of Columbia Pike and west of George Mason WALK to Randolph.

And, how does sending lower income kids from one poor performing school, to another another (and higher FR/L) poor performing school help them????

I think the better question is if you can somehow arrange options schools and boundaries so that only Randolph is a "bad" school instead of Carlin Spring, Randolph and Barcroft, is it worth it? That's 2 less schools of high poverty and one sacrificial lamb. So some kids are helped and some remain in the same (not great) situation. Yes, this is cynical, but I think it's part of the consideration.

DP. I don't think it's cynical or making Randolph a "sacrificial lamb" to acknowledge that we don't have the ability to help all three through this particular process and helping two without helping the third is still better overall than maintaining the status quo. Let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

I'll add to this that I don't think we can expect APS will be able to solve all of its problems in one fell swoop no matter what. They have theories for how all of these changes may will affect enrollment and performance at the various schools, but they won't know for sure until it's been implemented. If they make changes now to "help" Carlin Springs and/or Barcroft, after a few years they may have some good data on what worked and what didn't to help them figure out what further changes they can make to help Randolph as well. I know that is not a satisfying response for current Randolph families who want their children currently in the school to see improvement, but I think part of responsible governance needs to be taking a long view and making changes a little more incrementally so you can learn from them before you've gone too far down a road to change course.

[Anonymous]

The programs at Key and Claremont are identical. If there is segregation going on, then that is a parental/school leadership issue. We were at Claremont and there was nothing segregated about it.

I think it is important to remember that a substantial number of the spanish speakers at the immersion schools are not poor at all. There are many well educated and well to do Spanish speaking families in this area. There is a whole cadre of them at Claremont. They understand the importance of Spanish literacy for their kids and those kids are already fully bilingual in K. The challenge is getting more recent immigrants on board.

APS needs to reach out to the community and make sure they will apply to these schools if they are closer. Transferring a program fills up the school now, but incoming classes will be no different than they are now if APS doesn't seriously step up its efforts to encourage these families to apply and them help them navigate the process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Where do the kids who are zoned to Barcorft go if this happens? It says its one of the most walkable schools, but many people don't use it. I'm guessing the Spanish speaking kids would stay and walk, but what about families who don't want immersion?

Well, numbers wise, this could work out without a hitch, if they really transfer around 50% of their attendance zone out currently, then it's not so far fetched that this number still transferring out after the change, could be easily absorbed (as it is already)

[Anonymous]

The transfers are mostly UMC kids, not the majority of poor kids that live in the neighborhood. It is the poor kids who lose the very walkable school. Almost all would have to bus to Randolph, close in proximity but across two big roads.

I think the SB should think twice about moving a school that will disproportionately affect lower income families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The programs at Key and Claremont are identical. If there is segregation going on, then that is a parental/school leadership issue. We were at Claremont and there was nothing segregated about it.

I think it is important to remember that a substantial number of the spanish speakers at the immersion schools are not poor at all. There are many well educated and well to do Spanish speaking families in this area. There is a whole cadre of them at Claremont. They understand the importance of Spanish literacy for their kids and those kids are already fully bilingual in K. The challenge is getting more recent immigrants on board.

APS needs to reach out to the community and make sure they will apply to these schools if they are closer. Transferring a program fills up the school now, but incoming classes will be no different than they are now if APS doesn't seriously step up its efforts to encourage these families to apply and them help them navigate the process.

Claremont and Carlin Springs are two miles apart. If parents value immersion that highly, will 2 miles really be a barrier? I can see if we were talking about Jamestown because that 6-mile drive can take at least 20 minutes even without morning rush hour traffic, but here we're talking about maybe ten minutes during heavy rush while staying around the same commuter routes for people heading to/from work.