"Rescue" buying dogs from auctions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a huge market for this in "horse rescue." Kill buyers set up a shell and post on the internet that THESE HORSES ARE GOING TO SLAUGHTER IN 3 DAYS UNLESS POEPLE DONATE AND BAIL THEM OUT. The bail price is substantially more than the kill buyers paid, hundreds of dollars more. People's heartstrings are pulled, but the next week there is another pen full or horses GOING TO BE SENT TO SLAUGHTER TUESDAY UNLESS BAILED.

I think they are mostly send to slaughter anyway. Who knows where they find hundreds of homes for lame, useless, half starved horses once they are "bailed." They probably get sent to a private farm for a few days then shipped to Mexico.

It is a known scam. The FBI recently raided one of the big operations (Another Chance 4 Horses). sleezy. I don't deal with "rescues."

I could write a book on killpens, this is an issue near and dear to my heart. Now, I preface this with I am a long time horseman and advocate with decades of riding, showing and training behind me and I mostly know what I am doing with horses. I have a great veterinarian that I work with too. Most of the ninnies on those killpen sites are women who never got to have a pony when they were little girls and have absolutely NO idea what goes into rehabbing a horse, both time and money.

I have pulled horses from killpens; the pens are real, some are better than others, the horses that land in my pasture after I bail and ship them here are real. I usually deal with Kaufman in Texas ( I refuse to deal with Thompson or any of the Stanley brothers lots), mainly because I have a friend from my horse show days who goes into the pens 1 or 2 times a week and looks for good horses that are in a bad situation through no fault of their own, that can be bought and rehomed. The kill pens do send horses to slaughter, but those aren't the horses you see on their web pages. And the USDA highly regulates what horses are allowed to cross the border (no blind, pregnant, minis, lame, etc). The KB has found a better market through marketing to the rescue industry and bleeding heart women, creating a vicious circle.

Horses get sent to auction, it's a sad truth. They get sent because their owners die and relatives don't care, there is a divorce, the kids outgrow them, or go off to college, or someone loses their job and can't afford to keep them, or the horse develops a health issue that then erupts into a behavior issue and bam - off they go to the Friday night auction in Elkhart TX. Kill buyers are at auctions and that's where they get their horses. Usually, the first 10-50 horses at auction are bought for good prices by good buyers. Those buyers will pay and pick up their horses and then leave since they got what they came for. That usually leaves another 100-200 head of horses to be bought for pennies by the kill buyers who have contracts with the slaughter houses in Mexico and Canada. Most of those horses are good horses that weren't lucky enough to be ran through first.

Horses on the east coast are outrageously overpriced, it's much cheaper (if you know what you're doing and have a reliable quarantiner and shipper) to buy them in Texas or the midwest and have them shipped to you - which is what I did/do. We have a horse property so I have room to quarantine and assess them for rideability/resale in a round pen. My last pull is a registered Appendix gelding that is probably worth around 15K out here as a Dressage or Hunter/Jumper after I sort him out. I paid $800 +500 shipping, and then my time and some vet expenses. He has ulcers and I would bet money that is why he wound up at auction. He started bucking when saddled because his belly hurt and his owner dumped him at auction instead of calling a vet to see why he was cinchy. A month on ulcer guard (omeprazole) and horse metamucil and he will be right as rain again.

There are shady horse rescues out there - AC4H was one, and Hicaliber out in California is another one I would not touch with a ten foot pole.

Wow, to this poster ^^. So interesting. Sometimes I don't want to know these ugly truths. Thanks for sharing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think one of our "rescue" dogs is from one of these shady operations. Designer mix puppy, only 10 weeks old, "rescued" from an Amish breeder. The issue wasn't on my radar at the time, but in hindsight it seems obvious. Our second rescue is from City Dogs and came with a good amount of information about her history.

Same here. I've kept an eye on the rescue I got my dog from and it's become clear that they are one of these rescues. And my dog is the poster child for a poorly bred, messed up, puppy mill product. I love him but oooooooooh boy is he a health disaster both mentally and physically.

[Anonymous]

Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

PP here. It depends on what kind of dog you want and how long you're willing to wait. A reputable rescue group like City Dogs or Lucky Dog will have a lot of hoops to jump through, but you'll end up having a lot of support and most likely a good experience. Or there are the actual shelters and reputable breeders. It's the groups that call themselves rescues but have rotating litters of purebred or designer mix puppies that are suspect. If it seems implausible that they could consistently come across enough of those puppies/dogs to stay in business, it's probably a scam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

City shelters and reputable breeders IMO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a huge market for this in "horse rescue." Kill buyers set up a shell and post on the internet that THESE HORSES ARE GOING TO SLAUGHTER IN 3 DAYS UNLESS POEPLE DONATE AND BAIL THEM OUT. The bail price is substantially more than the kill buyers paid, hundreds of dollars more. People's heartstrings are pulled, but the next week there is another pen full or horses GOING TO BE SENT TO SLAUGHTER TUESDAY UNLESS BAILED.

I think they are mostly send to slaughter anyway. Who knows where they find hundreds of homes for lame, useless, half starved horses once they are "bailed." They probably get sent to a private farm for a few days then shipped to Mexico.

It is a known scam. The FBI recently raided one of the big operations (Another Chance 4 Horses). sleezy. I don't deal with "rescues."

I could write a book on killpens, this is an issue near and dear to my heart. Now, I preface this with I am a long time horseman and advocate with decades of riding, showing and training behind me and I mostly know what I am doing with horses. I have a great veterinarian that I work with too. Most of the ninnies on those killpen sites are women who never got to have a pony when they were little girls and have absolutely NO idea what goes into rehabbing a horse, both time and money.

I have pulled horses from killpens; the pens are real, some are better than others, the horses that land in my pasture after I bail and ship them here are real. I usually deal with Kaufman in Texas ( I refuse to deal with Thompson or any of the Stanley brothers lots), mainly because I have a friend from my horse show days who goes into the pens 1 or 2 times a week and looks for good horses that are in a bad situation through no fault of their own, that can be bought and rehomed. The kill pens do send horses to slaughter, but those aren't the horses you see on their web pages. And the USDA highly regulates what horses are allowed to cross the border (no blind, pregnant, minis, lame, etc). The KB has found a better market through marketing to the rescue industry and bleeding heart women, creating a vicious circle.

Horses get sent to auction, it's a sad truth. They get sent because their owners die and relatives don't care, there is a divorce, the kids outgrow them, or go off to college, or someone loses their job and can't afford to keep them, or the horse develops a health issue that then erupts into a behavior issue and bam - off they go to the Friday night auction in Elkhart TX. Kill buyers are at auctions and that's where they get their horses. Usually, the first 10-50 horses at auction are bought for good prices by good buyers. Those buyers will pay and pick up their horses and then leave since they got what they came for. That usually leaves another 100-200 head of horses to be bought for pennies by the kill buyers who have contracts with the slaughter houses in Mexico and Canada. Most of those horses are good horses that weren't lucky enough to be ran through first.

Horses on the east coast are outrageously overpriced, it's much cheaper (if you know what you're doing and have a reliable quarantiner and shipper) to buy them in Texas or the midwest and have them shipped to you - which is what I did/do. We have a horse property so I have room to quarantine and assess them for rideability/resale in a round pen. My last pull is a registered Appendix gelding that is probably worth around 15K out here as a Dressage or Hunter/Jumper after I sort him out. I paid $800 +500 shipping, and then my time and some vet expenses. He has ulcers and I would bet money that is why he wound up at auction. He started bucking when saddled because his belly hurt and his owner dumped him at auction instead of calling a vet to see why he was cinchy. A month on ulcer guard (omeprazole) and horse metamucil and he will be right as rain again.

There are shady horse rescues out there - AC4H was one, and Hicaliber out in California is another one I would not touch with a ten foot pole.

Wow, to this poster ^^. So interesting. Sometimes I don't want to know these ugly truths. Thanks for sharing.

+1 thanks for that, it is fascinating and sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

City shelters and reputable breeders IMO.

+1 I'd add breed-specific rescues that pull from shelters to this list, but the dozens of local rescues that always have cute puppies in high demand breeds/crosses seem too good to be true because they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a huge market for this in "horse rescue." Kill buyers set up a shell and post on the internet that THESE HORSES ARE GOING TO SLAUGHTER IN 3 DAYS UNLESS POEPLE DONATE AND BAIL THEM OUT. The bail price is substantially more than the kill buyers paid, hundreds of dollars more. People's heartstrings are pulled, but the next week there is another pen full or horses GOING TO BE SENT TO SLAUGHTER TUESDAY UNLESS BAILED.

I think they are mostly send to slaughter anyway. Who knows where they find hundreds of homes for lame, useless, half starved horses once they are "bailed." They probably get sent to a private farm for a few days then shipped to Mexico.

It is a known scam. The FBI recently raided one of the big operations (Another Chance 4 Horses). sleezy. I don't deal with "rescues."

I could write a book on killpens, this is an issue near and dear to my heart. Now, I preface this with I am a long time horseman and advocate with decades of riding, showing and training behind me and I mostly know what I am doing with horses. I have a great veterinarian that I work with too. Most of the ninnies on those killpen sites are women who never got to have a pony when they were little girls and have absolutely NO idea what goes into rehabbing a horse, both time and money.

I have pulled horses from killpens; the pens are real, some are better than others, the horses that land in my pasture after I bail and ship them here are real. I usually deal with Kaufman in Texas ( I refuse to deal with Thompson or any of the Stanley brothers lots), mainly because I have a friend from my horse show days who goes into the pens 1 or 2 times a week and looks for good horses that are in a bad situation through no fault of their own, that can be bought and rehomed. The kill pens do send horses to slaughter, but those aren't the horses you see on their web pages. And the USDA highly regulates what horses are allowed to cross the border (no blind, pregnant, minis, lame, etc). The KB has found a better market through marketing to the rescue industry and bleeding heart women, creating a vicious circle.

Horses get sent to auction, it's a sad truth. They get sent because their owners die and relatives don't care, there is a divorce, the kids outgrow them, or go off to college, or someone loses their job and can't afford to keep them, or the horse develops a health issue that then erupts into a behavior issue and bam - off they go to the Friday night auction in Elkhart TX. Kill buyers are at auctions and that's where they get their horses. Usually, the first 10-50 horses at auction are bought for good prices by good buyers. Those buyers will pay and pick up their horses and then leave since they got what they came for. That usually leaves another 100-200 head of horses to be bought for pennies by the kill buyers who have contracts with the slaughter houses in Mexico and Canada. Most of those horses are good horses that weren't lucky enough to be ran through first.

Horses on the east coast are outrageously overpriced, it's much cheaper (if you know what you're doing and have a reliable quarantiner and shipper) to buy them in Texas or the midwest and have them shipped to you - which is what I did/do. We have a horse property so I have room to quarantine and assess them for rideability/resale in a round pen. My last pull is a registered Appendix gelding that is probably worth around 15K out here as a Dressage or Hunter/Jumper after I sort him out. I paid $800 +500 shipping, and then my time and some vet expenses. He has ulcers and I would bet money that is why he wound up at auction. He started bucking when saddled because his belly hurt and his owner dumped him at auction instead of calling a vet to see why he was cinchy. A month on ulcer guard (omeprazole) and horse metamucil and he will be right as rain again.

There are shady horse rescues out there - AC4H was one, and Hicaliber out in California is another one I would not touch with a ten foot pole.

Wow, to this poster ^^. So interesting. Sometimes I don't want to know these ugly truths. Thanks for sharing.

+1 thanks for that, it is fascinating and sad.

I am the Kill pen buyer/rehabber, and another thing I want noted - for those of you who send your kids to riding camp or buy lessons - I can't tell you how many lesson horses get ran through auctions at either Shippensburg or Thurmont at the end of the year/season. Great buys for me as a side hustle, but really tragic for good horses because I can't save them all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I knew the rescue thing was a sham, think about it - how many cute fluffy dogs are there just sitting around to be rescued? If all the rescues were pitty mixes I could see that, but nowadays having a "rescue" dog is some kind of statement especially in progressive neighborhoods now that says you are PC, and just like most of that kind of thing my BS meter went off full blast.

+1

Basically I believe you have a legit rescue dog if you have a pit mix or Chihuahua.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

A breed-specific rescue that pulls from kill shelters, takes in strays or dogs from owners no longer able to care for them. Our rescue almost never has young puppies unless they pull a pregnant dog,mostly dogs ranging from a year and older.

[Anonymous]

I also kind of question the incentives involved with the rescues that brings stray dogs from the south up north for adoption. I know people who have great dogs great homes that way, but doesn’t it just encourage irresponsible pet ownership in certain areas of the country? I donate thousands every year to dog rescue groups - but maybe instead we should fund a “neuter your dog get $50” program in the Deep South.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait, so where should one adopt a dog from?

I've gone to the local SPCA and the county shelter. You'd be amazed how many great dogs are at those places. Their adoption fees are really low (usually like $60).

I don't deal with rescue groups. I know too many people who have had bad experiences with them. I also had a really horrible experience with a couple breed-specific rescue groups when I was trying to help a purebred dog I found at the pound but couldn't adopt myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is a huge market for this in "horse rescue." Kill buyers set up a shell and post on the internet that THESE HORSES ARE GOING TO SLAUGHTER IN 3 DAYS UNLESS POEPLE DONATE AND BAIL THEM OUT. The bail price is substantially more than the kill buyers paid, hundreds of dollars more. People's heartstrings are pulled, but the next week there is another pen full or horses GOING TO BE SENT TO SLAUGHTER TUESDAY UNLESS BAILED.

I think they are mostly send to slaughter anyway. Who knows where they find hundreds of homes for lame, useless, half starved horses once they are "bailed." They probably get sent to a private farm for a few days then shipped to Mexico.

It is a known scam. The FBI recently raided one of the big operations (Another Chance 4 Horses). sleezy. I don't deal with "rescues."

I could write a book on killpens, this is an issue near and dear to my heart. Now, I preface this with I am a long time horseman and advocate with decades of riding, showing and training behind me and I mostly know what I am doing with horses. I have a great veterinarian that I work with too. Most of the ninnies on those killpen sites are women who never got to have a pony when they were little girls and have absolutely NO idea what goes into rehabbing a horse, both time and money.

I have pulled horses from killpens; the pens are real, some are better than others, the horses that land in my pasture after I bail and ship them here are real. I usually deal with Kaufman in Texas ( I refuse to deal with Thompson or any of the Stanley brothers lots), mainly because I have a friend from my horse show days who goes into the pens 1 or 2 times a week and looks for good horses that are in a bad situation through no fault of their own, that can be bought and rehomed. The kill pens do send horses to slaughter, but those aren't the horses you see on their web pages. And the USDA highly regulates what horses are allowed to cross the border (no blind, pregnant, minis, lame, etc). The KB has found a better market through marketing to the rescue industry and bleeding heart women, creating a vicious circle.

Horses get sent to auction, it's a sad truth. They get sent because their owners die and relatives don't care, there is a divorce, the kids outgrow them, or go off to college, or someone loses their job and can't afford to keep them, or the horse develops a health issue that then erupts into a behavior issue and bam - off they go to the Friday night auction in Elkhart TX. Kill buyers are at auctions and that's where they get their horses. Usually, the first 10-50 horses at auction are bought for good prices by good buyers. Those buyers will pay and pick up their horses and then leave since they got what they came for. That usually leaves another 100-200 head of horses to be bought for pennies by the kill buyers who have contracts with the slaughter houses in Mexico and Canada. Most of those horses are good horses that weren't lucky enough to be ran through first.

Horses on the east coast are outrageously overpriced, it's much cheaper (if you know what you're doing and have a reliable quarantiner and shipper) to buy them in Texas or the midwest and have them shipped to you - which is what I did/do. We have a horse property so I have room to quarantine and assess them for rideability/resale in a round pen. My last pull is a registered Appendix gelding that is probably worth around 15K out here as a Dressage or Hunter/Jumper after I sort him out. I paid $800 +500 shipping, and then my time and some vet expenses. He has ulcers and I would bet money that is why he wound up at auction. He started bucking when saddled because his belly hurt and his owner dumped him at auction instead of calling a vet to see why he was cinchy. A month on ulcer guard (omeprazole) and horse metamucil and he will be right as rain again.

There are shady horse rescues out there - AC4H was one, and Hicaliber out in California is another one I would not touch with a ten foot pole.

Wow, to this poster ^^. So interesting. Sometimes I don't want to know these ugly truths. Thanks for sharing.

+1 thanks for that, it is fascinating and sad.

I am the Kill pen buyer/rehabber, and another thing I want noted - for those of you who send your kids to riding camp or buy lessons - I can't tell you how many lesson horses get ran through auctions at either Shippensburg or Thurmont at the end of the year/season. Great buys for me as a side hustle, but really tragic for good horses because I can't save them all.

I was the poster you responded to. My local auction is Shipsewana which is a trash fire for Amish rejects, and if the Amish can’t train it good luck.

I strongly prefer buying my jumper prospects directly from the track. I would rather use my track connections to get something slow, sound and with a good record/pedigree for a few hundred bucks than auctions. Though I used to ride for a lady that went to Ohio and got Amish draft crosses. I taught them to jumpmand we could easily get $7500–15k for them as field hunters. She trail rode them extensively. 100% sure they went on to do the job well.

[Anonymous]

Most racehorses end up at auction. If they haven't placed as three year olds they aren't worth the feed and stabling costs. Think about this the next time you are tempted to place a bet on a horse race. Thoroughbreds have been ruined by the very specific need for speed.

[Anonymous]

Rescue operations in my county get first choice on puppies and small breeds from the local animal shelter (which means there are NONE available to the public). They then charge rehoming fees of several hundred dollars, clearly a way for certain individuals to make $. Burns me up.