Are private schools immoral

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If you call yourself a liberal/progressive and don't go to your neighborhood school, or go private or charter instead. You are a hypocrite

That's not what the article says at all. It says white people in white neighborhoods are for neighborhood schools. White people in diverse neighborhoods are for school choice. You don't get to pat yourself on the back for picking a neighborhood school.

Let's go to the text:

"“White communities want neighborhood schools if their neighborhood school is white,” she says. “If their neighborhood school is black, they want choice.” Charter schools and magnet schools spring up in place of neighborhood schools, where white students can be in the majority."

You're looking at race, but the parents are looking at scores. I guarantee that if the all black school was a 10 on Great Schools, parents would be flocking to it. It's the 2s and 3s schools that parents want to escape and want choice.

A more realistic way to look at this is to evaluate parent responses to schools in the 6-8 range. Schools in that range that are predominantly white are given the benefit of the doubt, whereas schools that are majority kids of color in that range are assumed to be "teaching to the test." Those schools cannot win because white parents will always find a reason for why the school "isn't a good fit."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true:

"There’s no longer the belief that black people are racially inferior but that black culture is inferior."

Oh wow. Such a true statement

In examining my feelings, I feel like what I "think" I know about black culture is inferior-- but I also acknowledge that those perceptions are based on stereotypes. I think in my heart of hearts I see all my middle class black friends and family (and I have many black friends and am connect to a black family) as exceptions to black culture and not the rule. In my head I think of 2-parent, college educated, upwardly mobile blacks as embracing white culture. Totally unfair and most probably wrong -- but when I read this sentence it got me thinking and I think this is what I really feel underneath.

I need to work on this.

That's great insight, and totally right. If you can't look at the Obamas or Beyonce and see "Black culture," then you are probably defining Black culture to mean only negative things and assuming anything positive (even the stuff that's explicitly Afrocentric) is borrowed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Liberals have no trouble living with double standards and hypocrisy. This is just one example.

- another moderate R

Republicans want to use vouchers for private schools.

[Anonymous]

Keep up. The author of that article indicts all whites who send their kids to private and charter schools, not white liberals or white conservatives. All whites. Do conservatives really think it's somehow morally superior of them just not to believe in racial equality in the first place? "Don't blame me," they said, "we never thought integration was going to work in the first place."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

If you call yourself a liberal/progressive and don't go to your neighborhood school, or go private or charter instead. You are a hypocrite

That's not what the article says at all. It says white people in white neighborhoods are for neighborhood schools. White people in diverse neighborhoods are for school choice. You don't get to pat yourself on the back for picking a neighborhood school.

Let's go to the text:

"“White communities want neighborhood schools if their neighborhood school is white,” she says. “If their neighborhood school is black, they want choice.” Charter schools and magnet schools spring up in place of neighborhood schools, where white students can be in the majority."

You're looking at race, but the parents are looking at scores. I guarantee that if the all black school was a 10 on Great Schools, parents would be flocking to it. It's the 2s and 3s schools that parents want to escape and want choice.

A more realistic way to look at this is to evaluate parent responses to schools in the 6-8 range. Schools in that range that are predominantly white are given the benefit of the doubt, whereas schools that are majority kids of color in that range are assumed to be "teaching to the test." Those schools cannot win because white parents will always find a reason for why the school "isn't a good fit."

GreatSchools is just an internet company. You can't say a school "is" a 2 or 3 or 6 or 8. These are metrics given out by one company based on data from a flawed standardized test, averaged across a school of 700 students.

They've taken the whole of a school and neighborhood and community and reduced it to a number like some drunk dudes in a bar: "Yeah she's a 7. Too bad I only go for 9's or 10's."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Segregation has to do more with class than race now. My husband and I are Latinos and our two kids look stereotypically Latino (brown hair, brown eyes, tan skin). We are middle class and both have graduate degrees. I don't think any white families have a problem with us being at our predominantly white school. I don't send my kids to a predominately Latino school because we haven't found one that doesn't have a majority of kids who live in poverty. My kids pick up vocabulary and concepts being around other kids with educated parents.

THIS. I do not send my child to our zoned school because the majority of kids who attend are poor and the administration values test scores over learning. So yes, we chose a school that offers a better curriculum and a more diverse student body (some wealthy, most middle class, some poor). If I had it my way, every child would have that opportunity. But the systemic changes needed are far too large for any one person or any one community to fix on their own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Segregation has to do more with class than race now. My husband and I are Latinos and our two kids look stereotypically Latino (brown hair, brown eyes, tan skin). We are middle class and both have graduate degrees. I don't think any white families have a problem with us being at our predominantly white school. I don't send my kids to a predominately Latino school because we haven't found one that doesn't have a majority of kids who live in poverty. My kids pick up vocabulary and concepts being around other kids with educated parents.

THIS. I do not send my child to our zoned school because the majority of kids who attend are poor and the administration values test scores over learning. So yes, we chose a school that offers a better curriculum and a more diverse student body (some wealthy, most middle class, some poor). If I had it my way, every child would have that opportunity. But the systemic changes needed are far too large for any one person or any one community to fix on their own.

Did you attend your local zoned school before making that choice?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Segregation has to do more with class than race now. My husband and I are Latinos and our two kids look stereotypically Latino (brown hair, brown eyes, tan skin). We are middle class and both have graduate degrees. I don't think any white families have a problem with us being at our predominantly white school. I don't send my kids to a predominately Latino school because we haven't found one that doesn't have a majority of kids who live in poverty. My kids pick up vocabulary and concepts being around other kids with educated parents.

THIS. I do not send my child to our zoned school because the majority of kids who attend are poor and the administration values test scores over learning. So yes, we chose a school that offers a better curriculum and a more diverse student body (some wealthy, most middle class, some poor). If I had it my way, every child would have that opportunity. But the systemic changes needed are far too large for any one person or any one community to fix on their own.

Ok, then let's reimagine the moral case against segregation, this time about class rather than race.

Would people still agree with Dr. King if he had said "I have a dream that my four little children will not be judged by the content of their bank accounts but by the content of their character"?

Are we saying that content of bank account = content of character?

That would be ironic. New Hispanic immigrants are much harder workers than the native born population, more respectful of adults, and more focused on family.

[Anonymous]

This is a class thing. I'd never put my white kid in low scoring kid even if all the kids were white. Latinos just happen to be latest immigrants and they need more time to make it to UMC, same with many black people because their family money was taken from them, and job/ housing discrimination still continues.

“White communities want neighborhood schools if their neighborhood school is white,” she says. “If their neighborhood school is black, they want choice.”
White here means higher scores and black means lower score. And we all know why it is the way it is. Why try to make it a race thing when it's a class thing?! They should've also brought out Farms rate for each school. Maybe the article does, but I wouldn't get past the white/black thing.
Private vs public? Never have I seen so many white people giving DCPS (we talking about DC on DCUM, right?) a chance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true:

"There’s no longer the belief that black people are racially inferior but that black culture is inferior."

Oh wow. Such a true statement

In examining my feelings, I feel like what I "think" I know about black culture is inferior-- but I also acknowledge that those perceptions are based on stereotypes. I think in my heart of hearts I see all my middle class black friends and family (and I have many black friends and am connect to a black family) as exceptions to black culture and not the rule. In my head I think of 2-parent, college educated, upwardly mobile blacks as embracing white culture. Totally unfair and most probably wrong -- but when I read this sentence it got me thinking and I think this is what I really feel underneath.

I need to work on this.

That's great insight, and totally right. If you can't look at the Obamas or Beyonce and see "Black culture," then you are probably defining Black culture to mean only negative things and assuming anything positive (even the stuff that's explicitly Afrocentric) is borrowed.

This is off topic, but related to what you're talking about, PPs-- if you're white, try reading Debby Irving's book Waking Up White. It's clarifying soooooo much for me about my assumptions, why I have them, and the reality/history behind them. There is so much I've been oblivious to. There are knowable, systemic reasons for the chasm in prosperity between whites and blacks in this country, and knowable, systemic reasons why upward mobility has been out of reach for communities of color. There's a very short chapter early on about the GI bill that was incredibly eye-opening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Keep up. The author of that article indicts all whites who send their kids to private and charter schools, not white liberals or white conservatives. All whites. Do conservatives really think it's somehow morally superior of them just not to believe in racial equality in the first place? "Don't blame me," they said, "we never thought integration was going to work in the first place."

I love you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah click-bait

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/12/progressives-are-undermining-public-schools/548084/

I am a moderate republican and I actually kind of agree with her points

If you call yourself a liberal/progressive and don't go to your neighborhood school, or go private or charter instead. You are a hypocrite

It's why I'm not a liberal. At the end of the day you send your kid to the best school.... anyone who doesn't is kidding themselves

Other will say if you are Republican and use the public schools you are a hypocrite. Are you a hypocrite?

[Anonymous]

I am one mixed up limo lib... I live in a W district and send my kids to St. Johns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Segregation has to do more with class than race now. My husband and I are Latinos and our two kids look stereotypically Latino (brown hair, brown eyes, tan skin). We are middle class and both have graduate degrees. I don't think any white families have a problem with us being at our predominantly white school. I don't send my kids to a predominately Latino school because we haven't found one that doesn't have a majority of kids who live in poverty. My kids pick up vocabulary and concepts being around other kids with educated parents.

THIS. I do not send my child to our zoned school because the majority of kids who attend are poor and the administration values test scores over learning. So yes, we chose a school that offers a better curriculum and a more diverse student body (some wealthy, most middle class, some poor). If I had it my way, every child would have that opportunity. But the systemic changes needed are far too large for any one person or any one community to fix on their own.

Did you attend your local zoned school before making that choice?

Met with the principal one-on-one. All she could talk about was test scores. I didn't know if it was a district thing (maybe some parents like that?). So I visited a few other area public schools to see how they 'felt'; discussions there focused on curriculum, activities, parental involvement. Which would you choose?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so true:

"There’s no longer the belief that black people are racially inferior but that black culture is inferior."

Oh wow. Such a true statement

In examining my feelings, I feel like what I "think" I know about black culture is inferior-- but I also acknowledge that those perceptions are based on stereotypes. I think in my heart of hearts I see all my middle class black friends and family (and I have many black friends and am connect to a black family) as exceptions to black culture and not the rule. In my head I think of 2-parent, college educated, upwardly mobile blacks as embracing white culture. Totally unfair and most probably wrong -- but when I read this sentence it got me thinking and I think this is what I really feel underneath.

I need to work on this.

The phrase gutted me a little for very similar reasons. I’m choosing to send my kids to public because it aligns with our beliefs but they do live in one of the whitest school districts in the country....