why do people prefer AP schools to IB?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're two very different, but equally valuable programs. AP provides a wider variety of alacarte classes, and IB provides a comprehensive and writing-focused program.

Word on the street is that AP students get more college credits, but IB students are more prepared for college level writing.

Either program can be tailored to be heavy in either English, History, Science, or math.

AP classes are one year long
Some IB classes are one year and some are two years

IB has a bad rep in fairfax county because it was placed in the lower performing schools, however in most other areas it is a highly desired program.

Definitely don't rely on this board for info. There are several nuts who enjoy bashing each program. Do your own research and draw your own conclusion

Eight IB schools in FCPS produced a grand total of 13 NMSF this fall. The 16 AP schools, excluding TJ, had 65. With TJ, which offers AP and higher-level courses, the 17 AP schools had 210 NMSF. IB over-promises and under-delivers by every metric. It's no surprise the parents zoned for the wealthiest school districts in FCPS want to keep AP, while IB was foisted on the low-performing schools and hasn't managed to turn them around.

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Parents view AP as more flexible, meeting the needs of more students. You might have a student who takes 1 AP only their whole HS career, or 3. It's open enrollment.

This is the same at an IB school. You can take one IB class or a full schedule of IB classes, or anywhere in between.

[Anonymous]

I did not know that, thanks

[Anonymous]

It's much less work, duh!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're two very different, but equally valuable programs. AP provides a wider variety of alacarte classes, and IB provides a comprehensive and writing-focused program.

Word on the street is that AP students get more college credits, but IB students are more prepared for college level writing.

Either program can be tailored to be heavy in either English, History, Science, or math.

AP classes are one year long
Some IB classes are one year and some are two years

IB has a bad rep in fairfax county because it was placed in the lower performing schools, however in most other areas it is a highly desired program.

Definitely don't rely on this board for info. There are several nuts who enjoy bashing each program. Do your own research and draw your own conclusion

Eight IB schools in FCPS produced a grand total of 13 NMSF this fall. The 16 AP schools, excluding TJ, had 65. With TJ, which offers AP and higher-level courses, the 17 AP schools had 210 NMSF. IB over-promises and under-delivers by every metric. It's no surprise the parents zoned for the wealthiest school districts in FCPS want to keep AP, while IB was foisted on the low-performing schools and hasn't managed to turn them around.

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

Has the poor performance of IB schools been noted before? Sad. Perhaps you don't understand the impact of IB on demographics. The high-achieving Asian families overwhelmingly gravitate to AP schools.

[Anonymous]

AP is less strenuous. IB requires a much more dedicated student. So if you put IB in lower performing schools you get fewer high performing students, amazing how that works.

IB students are more well rounded, my Alma Mater looks very favorably on IB diploma holders, they feel those college freshmen are better prepared for the college classroom environment.

[Anonymous]

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

DP here.
I totally understand the impact of demographics on test scores. (I've taught in schools with extremely poor demographics--worse than any FCPS school.) I also understand that, because of these demographics, AP would be a much better choice for those schools. The lack of flexibility with IB is one of the reasons it is a particularly poor choice in those schools with poorer demographics.
It is easy to take an AP course here or there. It is much more difficult with the structure of the IB classes.

Also, the IB schools, for some reason, seem to structure everything in the school around IB. It is much more difficult to assimilate kids in this environment. IB high schools tend to be segregated into IB and non-IB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're two very different, but equally valuable programs. AP provides a wider variety of alacarte classes, and IB provides a comprehensive and writing-focused program.

Word on the street is that AP students get more college credits, but IB students are more prepared for college level writing.

Either program can be tailored to be heavy in either English, History, Science, or math.

AP classes are one year long
Some IB classes are one year and some are two years

IB has a bad rep in fairfax county because it was placed in the lower performing schools, however in most other areas it is a highly desired program.

Definitely don't rely on this board for info. There are several nuts who enjoy bashing each program. Do your own research and draw your own conclusion

Eight IB schools in FCPS produced a grand total of 13 NMSF this fall. The 16 AP schools, excluding TJ, had 65. With TJ, which offers AP and higher-level courses, the 17 AP schools had 210 NMSF. IB over-promises and under-delivers by every metric. It's no surprise the parents zoned for the wealthiest school districts in FCPS want to keep AP, while IB was foisted on the low-performing schools and hasn't managed to turn them around.

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

You are actually proving this person's point. Wealthy people don't seek out IB generally. Those IB schools are not necessarily in the worst locations in the county. They have just become the worst locations in the county because of IB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AP is less strenuous. IB requires a much more dedicated student. So if you put IB in lower performing schools you get fewer high performing students, amazing how that works.

IB students are more well rounded, my Alma Mater looks very favorably on IB diploma holders, they feel those college freshmen are better prepared for the college classroom environment.

What a run-on sentence! Anyway, not really. AP kids take more responsibility for their own education. IB is like an educational Happy Meal, with the IBO deciding what gets included in the box. But it makes a few kids at low-performing schools and their parents feel special, so FCPS is willing to spend extra money on it.

[Anonymous]

Have a friend who works at College Board. He says IB is better and sends his kid to an IB school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

DP here.
I totally understand the impact of demographics on test scores. (I've taught in schools with extremely poor demographics--worse than any FCPS school.) I also understand that, because of these demographics, AP would be a much better choice for those schools. The lack of flexibility with IB is one of the reasons it is a particularly poor choice in those schools with poorer demographics.
It is easy to take an AP course here or there. It is much more difficult with the structure of the IB classes.

Also, the IB schools, for some reason, seem to structure everything in the school around IB. It is much more difficult to assimilate kids in this environment. IB high schools tend to be segregated into IB and non-IB.

You clearly have not been to an IB school, there is no segregation at our school. Some kids do IB others don't, usually the kids that do not feel the work load is too strenuous, so they just take IB classes that interest them. My DC's friends are a thorough mix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They're two very different, but equally valuable programs. AP provides a wider variety of alacarte classes, and IB provides a comprehensive and writing-focused program.

Word on the street is that AP students get more college credits, but IB students are more prepared for college level writing.

Either program can be tailored to be heavy in either English, History, Science, or math.

AP classes are one year long
Some IB classes are one year and some are two years

IB has a bad rep in fairfax county because it was placed in the lower performing schools, however in most other areas it is a highly desired program.

Definitely don't rely on this board for info. There are several nuts who enjoy bashing each program. Do your own research and draw your own conclusion

OP, new poster here. Please heed this post above. DCUM has posters who leap into any discussion involving IB to bash it on every front and most of what they say is misinformed. I doubt they have ever had a child actually take IB classes or pursue the IB diploma in FCPS. We moved our DC to a school with IB but I don't bash AP; it just wasn't what our DC wanted but it's been great for DC's friends at other schools. It's a choice totally driven by the individual student's learning style, needs and preferences. The two programs are structured very differently and no thread on an Internet forum is going to give you a detailed, objective picture of the academics in each.

If you have a student who is considering a choice between AP and IB, I'd get off DCUM and set up appointments with the IB coordinator at whichever is your nearest IB school and the AP coordinator at your nearest AP school. Schools also hold AP or IB information events each year--call and find out when those are held. What matters is what your particular student wants and needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're two very different, but equally valuable programs. AP provides a wider variety of alacarte classes, and IB provides a comprehensive and writing-focused program.

Word on the street is that AP students get more college credits, but IB students are more prepared for college level writing.

Either program can be tailored to be heavy in either English, History, Science, or math.

AP classes are one year long
Some IB classes are one year and some are two years

IB has a bad rep in fairfax county because it was placed in the lower performing schools, however in most other areas it is a highly desired program.

Definitely don't rely on this board for info. There are several nuts who enjoy bashing each program. Do your own research and draw your own conclusion

Eight IB schools in FCPS produced a grand total of 13 NMSF this fall. The 16 AP schools, excluding TJ, had 65. With TJ, which offers AP and higher-level courses, the 17 AP schools had 210 NMSF. IB over-promises and under-delivers by every metric. It's no surprise the parents zoned for the wealthiest school districts in FCPS want to keep AP, while IB was foisted on the low-performing schools and hasn't managed to turn them around.

1. You say the same thing on every IB thread, and no one even reads it anymore
2. You clearly don't understand the impact of demographics on student performance and test scores

You are actually proving this person's point. Wealthy people don't seek out IB generally. Those IB schools are not necessarily in the worst locations in the county. They have just become the worst locations in the county because of IB.

DP here. No dog in this fight, as I'm not in FCPS and don't have a HS student yet. But I disagree entirely. Wealthy parents seek out the what they perceive to be the "strongest" environment for their kids, as do MC strivers. If you put IB into a school like McLean or Langley and allowed IB transfers, you better believe families in "lesser" zones would encourage their children to apply. Would more apply than to TJ? Probably not, but I think that has less to do with AP/IB and more to do with the fact that it's a highly rigorous test-in/application program, so of course it's always going to have the strongest students with the highest test scores (what are the requirements to transfer for IB in FCPS?). Putting an IB program into a less well-regarded school isn't necessarily going to be enough of a draw for those same parents, unless it is a test-in/elite program. That's all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't understand why one is preferable to the other.... is there some major difference academically?

As PPs have noted, AP is more "a la carte" and, in FCPS at least, tends to be the college-prep curriculum in most of the top schools.

Conversely, FCPS put IB in a number of struggling schools in the late 1990s and early 2000s with the thought that it would stem white flight by creating "school-within-a-school" environments. It hasn't worked out that way - the poor schools with IB, like Lee, Mount Vernon, and Stuart, are generally considered worse than they were 15-20 years ago.

One exception to the overall trend of installing IB at the lower-ranked schools was Woodson, which FCPS tried to convert from AP to IB years ago. The parents revolted and AP was restored to the school. In addition, because of the pupil placement policies in FCPS, parents who want their kids to attend higher SES schools often can pupil place their kids out of an IB school to a nearby AP school, space permitting. As a result, schools like Lee end up losing many top students to AP schools like West Springfield and Lake Braddock.

IB has its local HQ in Bethesda, and every IB school has a dedicated "IB Coordinator" responsible for promoting IB. They monitor these threads closely, and try to convince people that IB is superior to AP. However, as the title of your thread acknowledges, most people prefer AP schools to IB. We personally have been in both and prefer the AP environment. Most of the students take plenty of AP courses, and there is no divide similar to what we found at the IB school between the IB diploma candidates and, well, everyone else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It's much less work, duh!

Let me elaborate on my post above.

IB is much more rigorous and teaches problem-solving.
AP crams facts and there is zero critical thinking involved. From an intellectual perspective, it's nul.
However since IB requires more work, and universities do not differentiate between the two during admissions, parents and students correctly pick the one that requires less work -
because their goal is college entrance, and not growing as thinkers.

When too much pressure to enter college is created, expect people to take shortcuts.