Which schools in area send most to Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford? GDS

[Anonymous]

15:51 again. To help anyone who wants to compare the data, here is were I found current matriculation info for STA. https://www.stalbansschool.org/page/about/at-a-glance

I've got no connection to STA; I just know they put that limited college matriculation data online, so it's a useful benchmark. I assume all the other schools with similar profiles have comparable college results. If anyone has matriculation or acceptance data for other schools, you can post it here and compare to TJ.

FWIW, I agree with the PP who made the point that college admissions is really about the student and not the school, so it would be a mistake to assume causation. I suppose though that the correlation is there, so if your child is smart enough to get admitted to TJ or STA or any of these other schools, then he's probably smart enough to have a decent shot at attending a top college, no matter where he goes to high school. I just posted to this thread because I've corrected this same TJ exaggeration before, so it gets frustrating to see such alternative facts again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:14:10 again. TJ is a great school, but you diminish it when you exaggerate its successes so blatantly.

Not so blatant:

Class of 2016

Harvard about 5 or 6
Dartmouth about 9 or 10
Stanford about 9 or 10
Brown 12
Princeton 12
Columbia 12
Georgetown 13
Yale 13
UPenn 13
MIT 15
Duke 17
U of Chicago 18
Cornell University 29
UC Berkeley 35
University of Michigan 61
William & Mary 173
UVA 224

1. Those are all acceptances, not where the graduates are actually going to college. As a result, there is a lot of double counting in there. If one smart TJ student is admitted to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford, then she is listed 4 times in your numbers.

2. Those numbers do not provide an apples-to-apples comparison with any private school numbers we have. For STA for example, the numbers I posted are just for the colleges where its graduates actually attended, so there is no double counting in STA's matriculation numbers. Comparing TJ acceptances to STA matriculations doesn't make much sense.

3. Thankfully, we have actual TJ matriculation numbers, so we can see exactly how many students went to each school. Those are the TJ matriculation numbers I posted above. To save you the trouble, here are the details: Harvard (6 attending), Yale (7), Princeton (6), Stanford (7). Great results, but very different from mere acceptances. https://issuu.com/tjtoday/docs/tjtoday_senior_issue_2016

I hope that helps provide factual context for our discussion.

You make a valid point but you also have to consider that many TJ grads forego Ivy or Stanford to attend other top 25 schools since those non-ivy top 25 schools offer substantial merit scholarships including full-rides. Looking at both acceptances and matriculation numbers along with the amount of merit based scholarship amounts received by the graduating class (approximately 45 million dollars) would be more informative. Most TJ families are middle/upper middle HHI familes that do not qualify for financial aid so it would be difficult to turn down $150,00 to $250,000 merit based scholarships to top 25 schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:14:10 again. TJ is a great school, but you diminish it when you exaggerate its successes so blatantly.

Not so blatant:

Class of 2016

Harvard about 5 or 6
Dartmouth about 9 or 10
Stanford about 9 or 10
Brown 12
Princeton 12
Columbia 12
Georgetown 13
Yale 13
UPenn 13
MIT 15
Duke 17
U of Chicago 18
Cornell University 29
UC Berkeley 35
University of Michigan 61
William & Mary 173
UVA 224

1. Those are all acceptances, not where the graduates are actually going to college. As a result, there is a lot of double counting in there. If one smart TJ student is admitted to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford, then she is listed 4 times in your numbers.

2. Those numbers do not provide an apples-to-apples comparison with any private school numbers we have. For STA for example, the numbers I posted are just for the colleges where its graduates actually attended, so there is no double counting in STA's matriculation numbers. Comparing TJ acceptances to STA matriculations doesn't make much sense.

3. Thankfully, we have actual TJ matriculation numbers, so we can see exactly how many students went to each school. Those are the TJ matriculation numbers I posted above. To save you the trouble, here are the details: Harvard (6 attending), Yale (7), Princeton (6), Stanford (7). Great results, but very different from mere acceptances. https://issuu.com/tjtoday/docs/tjtoday_senior_issue_2016

I hope that helps provide factual context for our discussion.

You make a valid point but you also have to consider that many TJ grads forego Ivy or Stanford to attend other top 25 schools since those non-ivy top 25 schools offer substantial merit scholarships including full-rides. Looking at both acceptances and matriculation numbers along with the amount of merit based scholarship amounts received by the graduating class (approximately 45 million dollars) would be more informative. Most TJ families are middle/upper middle HHI familes that do not qualify for financial aid so it would be difficult to turn down $150,00 to $250,000 merit based scholarships to top 25 schools.

My kid graduated from TJ recently and he had to turn down a top school for another school which offered to pay full tuition and room/board for 4 years. It is not uncommon for TJ grads to follow the money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You make a valid point but you also have to consider that many TJ grads forego Ivy or Stanford to attend other top 25 schools since those non-ivy top 25 schools offer substantial merit scholarships including full-rides. Looking at both acceptances and matriculation numbers along with the amount of merit based scholarship amounts received by the graduating class (approximately 45 million dollars) would be more informative. Most TJ families are middle/upper middle HHI familes that do not qualify for financial aid so it would be difficult to turn down $150,00 to $250,000 merit based scholarships to top 25 schools.

Well, for better or worse, I really don't have to consider those points ... because I'm not trying to argue that private schools are holistically better than TJ. My point in posting was simply to respond to the demonstrable factual inaccuracy in your prior post. You seem focused on supporting your pre-determined conclusion that TJ must be superior. I fortunately don't really care about the conclusion, so I can just follow the data regardless of where it leads me. If you'd like to post actual data about the relative demographics of TJ compared to local private schools, then maybe you can support this new argument you're trying to craft. Until then though, I have no role. Good luck with your quest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:14:10 again. TJ is a great school, but you diminish it when you exaggerate its successes so blatantly.

Not so blatant:

Class of 2016

Harvard about 5 or 6
Dartmouth about 9 or 10
Stanford about 9 or 10
Brown 12
Princeton 12
Columbia 12
Georgetown 13
Yale 13
UPenn 13
MIT 15
Duke 17
U of Chicago 18
Cornell University 29
UC Berkeley 35
University of Michigan 61
William & Mary 173
UVA 224

1. Those are all acceptances, not where the graduates are actually going to college. As a result, there is a lot of double counting in there. If one smart TJ student is admitted to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford, then she is listed 4 times in your numbers.

2. Those numbers do not provide an apples-to-apples comparison with any private school numbers we have. For STA for example, the numbers I posted are just for the colleges where its graduates actually attended, so there is no double counting in STA's matriculation numbers. Comparing TJ acceptances to STA matriculations doesn't make much sense.

3. Thankfully, we have actual TJ matriculation numbers, so we can see exactly how many students went to each school. Those are the TJ matriculation numbers I posted above. To save you the trouble, here are the details: Harvard (6 attending), Yale (7), Princeton (6), Stanford (7). Great results, but very different from mere acceptances. https://issuu.com/tjtoday/docs/tjtoday_senior_issue_2016

I hope that helps provide factual context for our discussion.

Wait, what, "mere acceptances"? The acceptances speak to the choices kids have. As other pps have pointed out, public school kids, given the same set of acceptances, often make very different choices from private school kids. Public school kids are more likely than private to matriculate at a school that offers good aid, also, TJ kids are more likely to choose MIT over, I dunno, Princeton. My kid was one of 12 accepted from Blair to a so-called "top Ivy" that graduating year, but one of six that actually went because the other kids got full rides at places like Georgetown and historically black colleges, and the Ivies don't do merit aid. So you shouldn't abstract away from the very specific choices made by public school magnet kids, by focusing on matriculation not acceptances, and say this applies to OP and her kid. It sounds like OP can pay full freight for HYPM so her kid wouldn't be lured away by an offer of hefty merit aid. So maybe 4 years in a STEM magnet (if OP's kid is up for it) might be just the ticket for OP's kid if the goal (whose goal? OP's? her kid's) is being full pay at a liberal arts program at HYPM.

(Although this seems a bit drastic and I'm starting to feel sorry for OP's kid.)

[Anonymous]

PP, you seem to be reading a lot extra into OP's 10-word post.

You also clearly want to brag about TJ's students accepted to MIT, so maybe you should start a thread about that, because OP didn't say anything about MIT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, you seem to be reading a lot extra into OP's 10-word post.

You also clearly want to brag about TJ's students accepted to MIT, so maybe you should start a thread about that, because OP didn't say anything about MIT.

PP here. I couldn't care less about TJ--I'm in MoCo. I was merely concerned, as someone who deals with data all day (serious data and statistics) about private school PP's attempt to downplay another school's acceptance successes based on a faulty comparison of matriculations. But thanks for playing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, you seem to be reading a lot extra into OP's 10-word post.

You also clearly want to brag about TJ's students accepted to MIT, so maybe you should start a thread about that, because OP didn't say anything about MIT.

OP also didn't say anything about the "percentage" of students either. Op just said "most". According to your "only the facts" mantra, TJ appears to send the most students to Harvard, Princeton, Yale and Standard. In addition, if you want to use the last 5 years average number, you should use the last 5 years average numbers for TJ as well to be consistent. If not, only use the same "data" that you love to emphasize which would be the class of 2016 data.

[Anonymous]

Smart kids get into smart colleges. Qualified but rejected by HYPSM will go where? Penn or Northwestern ... UVA or Michigan at the worst? Those HYPSM qualified kids end up the top of their class at the tier 1b colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, you seem to be reading a lot extra into OP's 10-word post.

You also clearly want to brag about TJ's students accepted to MIT, so maybe you should start a thread about that, because OP didn't say anything about MIT.

OP also didn't say anything about the "percentage" of students either. Op just said "most". According to your "only the facts" mantra, TJ appears to send the most students to Harvard, Princeton, Yale and Standard. In addition, if you want to use the last 5 years average number, you should use the last 5 years average numbers for TJ as well to be consistent. If not, only use the same "data" that you love to emphasize which would be the class of 2016 data.

Zinger.

[Anonymous]

% ATTENDING 15 TOP COLLEGES

1 Thomas Jefferson Magnet 9.18%
2 Montgomery Blair Magnet 4.51%
3 Sidwell Friends School 14.40%
4 National Cathedral School (NCS) 15.79%
5 St. Albans School 14.21%
6 Maret School 10.42%
7 Georgetown Day School 9.54%
8 St. Anselm's School 5.22%
9 Holton-Arms School 7.09%
10 Potomac School 6.63%


https://www.lotusprep.com/best-high-schools-dc/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: % ATTENDING 15 TOP COLLEGES

1 Thomas Jefferson Magnet 9.18%
2 Montgomery Blair Magnet 4.51%
3 Sidwell Friends School 14.40%
4 National Cathedral School (NCS) 15.79%
5 St. Albans School 14.21%
6 Maret School 10.42%
7 Georgetown Day School 9.54%
8 St. Anselm's School 5.22%
9 Holton-Arms School 7.09%
10 Potomac School 6.63%


https://www.lotusprep.com/best-high-schools-dc/

What % do you think is Wilson? That's still the best DCPS high school, yes?

[Anonymous]

TJ sends the most number and percentage of students to the top 25 national/research schools in the country not just in the D.C. area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well we are gladly paying for private and have no need or want for my daughter to go to an Ivy.

You are failing your child if that is the goal for them. They will always disappoint you. SAD!

Thanks for posting, Donald.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thomas Jefferson and Montgomery Blair magnet

IF you are in the top of your class

a) that statement is true pretty much for any high achieving school.
b) TJ (don't know Blair Magnet - I live in VA) sends the most kids (by % of class and in absolute terms) top HYPS than any school in the DC area.

I feel like the same TJ booster makes this same false claim every six months, so I now know just where to get the data to correct it.

2016 graduating class info, all available online:
TJ had 457 graduates total. 26 students destined for Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford (5.7% of the class).
STA had roughly 80 (?) grads total. 9.8 students (5 yr average) destined for Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford (12.25% of the class).

I assume other strong independent schools in DC, such as Sidwell, GDS, or Maret, which all keep their college results private, had similar results.

No doubt that TJ is a great school. No doubt also that TJ's large class, which is 4-5 times bigger than any private school, yields huge raw numbers of students going to top colleges. But to claim that it's more on a percentage basis is just false. Maybe if we had college results for Sidwell, STA, NCS, GDS, and Maret, that might be a combined class as big as TJ, and we could compare their combined college results with TJ. Or if you had college results for the Blair magnet (100 grads), you could multiply them by 4.5 to compare.

Above figures regarding TJ appears incorrect. The numbers from class of 2016:

College Apply Accept

1. Harvard is not listed since 10 or fewer were accepted but typically on average 6 are accepted (typically 4 to 7).
2. Yale University 83 13
3. Princeton University 128 12
4. Stanford University is not listed since 10 or fewer were accepted but typically on average 10 are accepted (typically 9 to 12).

Yale + Princeton = 25. HYPS = about 41 acceptances. HYPSM = about 56 acceptances.

Acceptances to MIT was (Massachusetts Institute of Technology 126 applied 15 accepted). So, HYPSM results would be the best or one of the best in the area.



https://fcps.tjhsst.edu/coursemgmt/media/300/resource/TJ%20Profile%202016-17%20online.pdf

All great schools. However to keep the argument real, doesn't TJ have many more students? I think the only way to make it fair is to do a percentage of its students that are going and then you can compare the schools. STA only has 80 kids in a graduating class, Sidwell has 130? So I think to make comparisons fair you should do a percentage of its graduating class rather than actual numbers. Same with NCS - also has graduating class of only maybe 85. I by no means saying TJ is not a great school. It clearly is.

No skin in this game, but I disagree with you - - absolute numbers do matter when all of these high schools are selective in the first place. Colleges don't look at what percentage of the class they are taking (especially not all of these colleges collectively), they look at individual applicants to their school only. If more individuals from school A are accepted at all of these elite colleges than from school B, when both claim to be pulling the best students in the area into their cohorts, then absolute numbers do matter.