Nalle ES and Kelly Miller MS: flowers in the mud?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are nuts to buy based on liking the MS principal when your youngest is only 4.

+1 I would bet a million dollars (well, if I had a million dollars) that she won't be there when your kid gets there. Unfortunately that's just the reality in DCPS.

And I'd bet another million (if I, too, had a million dollars) that OP will be long gone by the time her kid enters middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are nuts to buy based on liking the MS principal when your youngest is only 4.

+1 I would bet a million dollars (well, if I had a million dollars) that she won't be there when your kid gets there. Unfortunately that's just the reality in DCPS.

And I'd bet another million (if I, too, had a million dollars) that OP will be long gone by the time her kid enters middle school.

OP here. I will be gone where? Tell me where to go! I am serious.

Everywhere we searched , renting is higher than the monthly payment for a $225,000 mortgage. We will soon be four, and have a granpa living with us (God bless him, incredibly competent and loving babysitter). We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

[Anonymous]

I have taught after-school classes at Kelly Miller. Granted it was over 10 years ago but it was WILD. Some kids were great. When I could get a core group of dedicated students we were in business. Most of the time it was a madhouse. Kids running the halls. Terrible behavior. Lack of accountability from adults. This is not the kind of place I would ever dream of sending my child. The best teacher I knew who taught there full time back then is no longer there. I know the commutes stink but it really can be safer/better in the burbs. We are now in Silver Spring. I thought I'd stay in DC too. I wanted to metro. Didn't happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are nuts to buy based on liking the MS principal when your youngest is only 4.

+1 I would bet a million dollars (well, if I had a million dollars) that she won't be there when your kid gets there. Unfortunately that's just the reality in DCPS.

And I'd bet another million (if I, too, had a million dollars) that OP will be long gone by the time her kid enters middle school.

OP here. I will be gone where? Tell me where to go! I am serious.

Everywhere we searched , renting is higher than the monthly payment for a $225,000 mortgage. We will soon be four, and have a granpa living with us (God bless him, incredibly competent and loving babysitter). We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

That is true - you won't find much helpful or recent on here. I suggest you go visit in person and determine if it fits right for you. No need for judgmental spewage from DCUM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you are nuts to buy based on liking the MS principal when your youngest is only 4.

+1 I would bet a million dollars (well, if I had a million dollars) that she won't be there when your kid gets there. Unfortunately that's just the reality in DCPS.

And I'd bet another million (if I, too, had a million dollars) that OP will be long gone by the time her kid enters middle school.

OP here. I will be gone where? Tell me where to go! I am serious.

Everywhere we searched , renting is higher than the monthly payment for a $225,000 mortgage. We will soon be four, and have a granpa living with us (God bless him, incredibly competent and loving babysitter). We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

I hear you, OP. I do. I just think it's naive of you to think you'd never seek a charter because, truth be told, those with those positive values and strong ideals, most of your like-minded parental peers in that neighborhood have.

[Anonymous]

I don't have any experience with the schools but I think the area you're moving to is fine. Lots of mixed income and good teachers. If you don't like Nalle you could look into taking the bus to Beers or Randle Highlands. Plummer might also work. There are also a few charters that would work. I would move somewhere affordable. Some of the so-called bad schools can be great for some kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I hear you, OP. I do. I just think it's naive of you to think you'd never seek a charter because, truth be told, those with those positive values and strong ideals, most of your like-minded parental peers in that neighborhood have.

I think this is right. Low income but academically-minded parents do charters. It's problematic for a lot of reasons but it's also the way things work.

[Anonymous]

I don't know anything about Nalle but have volunteered within KM. the school underwent a remarkable transformation in terms of culture and commitment to competitive HS placement under former principal Zaki. When Bowser was chanting Deal for All I think she missed the mark on instead championing a KM experience for more students. I think replicating their efforts would better address needs of high poverty kids than what I understand often happens at Deal. KM absorbed the closed Ron Browne school, has really rich partnerships with orgs such as City Year and Higher Achievement, and has a stronger college going culture. I don't know the current principal but hopefully Zaki's tenure will leave a legacy of improving performance.

Unfortunately across the city schools that serve high poverty kids of color have crappy PARCC scores. There is an 65 percentage point gulf between black and white kids on PARCC ELA scores underscoring the persistent gap between kids of dramatically different circumstances. The achievement gap in DC is the largest in the country but doesn't mean that your kid can't get a good education particularly with your engagement and support.


There are appealing single family homes nearby KM but crime is something to consider. Lincoln Heights nearby has persistent challenges. Unfortunately I don't have a good solution to the lack of affordable housing. I wish you all luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Looking for a house to buy off the beaten track for a family of 3 + one on the way (the other kid is almost 4 years old). Neighborhood schools are the main decision factor (after price!). We do not like the charter concept, have no car and no plans to get one in the near future, and would like to walk our kids to school and have them walk back by themselves with their friends when they grow older.

We were very impressed by Nalle ES and even more by Kelly Miller Middle School. KM Principal was particularly impressive. She has a clear vision for the school and teachers seem to respect her a lot. Most kids looked well-disciplined in both schools (of course, with exceptions, including a few kids asleep in the classroom). If one takes PARCC scores as an indication of school performance (I do), KM numbers rank at a totally different and higher scale than other MS with similar demographics (99% FARMS). I mean, numbers are still depressingly low (7.5% at grade level) but the school scored so much better than other similar DCPS middle schools (Eliot, Hart, Johnson, Kramer all showing no more than 1% of the school population at grade level). The IB population is extremely high for KM (95%!) and around 60% for Nalle which again are quite unique features. I like the IB numbers not only because I want my kids to have friends in the neighborhood, but also because they may proxy some parental involvement in the school.

I like the area and proximity to Benning Rd metro. House prices are still ok, 3 beds houses in the 300K range. I think we'll place an offer on a house soon.

Does anyone have direct experience with these schools and is willing to share?

OP, please take this for what it's worth, coming from someone who had a modest upbringing--something's gotta give. You have a dream list of qualities you want in your home--you list qualities that many others on this forum want, but find difficult to find even with more income to spend on housing--but you don't have a dream budget.

Could you rent for the time being, living in an apt. in a better school zone until your financial situation improves? Could you buy a condo somewhere like close to downtown Silver Spring, where there are a few older 3brs in that range? Or, as a secretary and healthcare worker, could you move even further out and find jobs closer to where you live? If you really want to stay in DC could you be more open-minded about charters, and religiously do your research and play the lottery until you land something you feel is acceptable?

It might be fine in the early years at Nalle, but I wouldn't want to take that gamble personally with my own child--who is around the same age as yours--even if I feel there's a good chance my kid would do okay. I grew up in a pretty non-academic environment, and only a few made it to college. Others did stints in jail, many had kids in their teens, and a few didn't make it out of their 20s. You say you prioritize housing price followed by schools, but at that budget, I'd switch those priorities and try to find the best school situation possible.

Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

I don't think (as the parent of a four year old) you have any idea how detrimental a school with 8% of the peers at grade level can be to a child. Your children won't just be at a school with peers who are not academically successful, they'll be surrounded by kids in the neighborhood who are not academically successful. You're not going to want your children playing with the neighbors if you're not there to supervise and you're not going to want to socialize with your neighbors.

I think you need to move to a city with a much lower cost of living. (Not the suburbs but out of the region entirely.) DC is no place to raise a family of you are struggling financially in this way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

I don't think (as the parent of a four year old) you have any idea how detrimental a school with 8% of the peers at grade level can be to a child. Your children won't just be at a school with peers who are not academically successful, they'll be surrounded by kids in the neighborhood who are not academically successful. You're not going to want your children playing with the neighbors if you're not there to supervise and you're not going to want to socialize with your neighbors.

I think you need to move to a city with a much lower cost of living. (Not the suburbs but out of the region entirely.) DC is no place to raise a family of you are struggling financially in this way.

Thank you. I appreciate your considerate thoughts. Loretta (OP)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

I don't think (as the parent of a four year old) you have any idea how detrimental a school with 8% of the peers at grade level can be to a child. Your children won't just be at a school with peers who are not academically successful, they'll be surrounded by kids in the neighborhood who are not academically successful. You're not going to want your children playing with the neighbors if you're not there to supervise and you're not going to want to socialize with your neighbors.

I think you need to move to a city with a much lower cost of living. (Not the suburbs but out of the region entirely.) DC is no place to raise a family of you are struggling financially in this way.

Thank you. I appreciate your considerate thoughts. Loretta (OP)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We could indeed find something equally affordable at more than 2 hours total daily commuting time, compared to 40 minutes if we get a house steps from the Blue Line. Commuting would be ok for us, but would take away supervision/study/quality time with the kids, which would be much more detrimental to them than a school with 8% peers at grade level. And I have reasons to be confident they would be among those at grade level or beyond.

So, please tell me where to go, with a nursing assistant salary at a medical facility along the blue line, and a secretarial job in the federal government.

Sorry , I know I am getting out of topic, I was hoping to get some insights on these two schools. Instead what I am finding is a bunch of people telling me what do with my life with little/no awareness of the challenges lower income people are undergoing, especially if they plan to complete a college degree (like one of us).

I guess this board is not the place to find Nalle and KM's families. Good bye.

I don't think (as the parent of a four year old) you have any idea how detrimental a school with 8% of the peers at grade level can be to a child. Your children won't just be at a school with peers who are not academically successful, they'll be surrounded by kids in the neighborhood who are not academically successful. You're not going to want your children playing with the neighbors if you're not there to supervise and you're not going to want to socialize with your neighbors.

I think you need to move to a city with a much lower cost of living. (Not the suburbs but out of the region entirely.) DC is no place to raise a family of you are struggling financially in this way.

Thank you. I appreciate your considerate thoughts. Loretta (OP)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Looking for a house to buy off the beaten track for a family of 3 + one on the way (the other kid is almost 4 years old). Neighborhood schools are the main decision factor (after price!). We do not like the charter concept, have no car and no plans to get one in the near future, and would like to walk our kids to school and have them walk back by themselves with their friends when they grow older.

We were very impressed by Nalle ES and even more by Kelly Miller Middle School. KM Principal was particularly impressive. She has a clear vision for the school and teachers seem to respect her a lot. Most kids looked well-disciplined in both schools (of course, with exceptions, including a few kids asleep in the classroom). If one takes PARCC scores as an indication of school performance (I do), KM numbers rank at a totally different and higher scale than other MS with similar demographics (99% FARMS). I mean, numbers are still depressingly low (7.5% at grade level) but the school scored so much better than other similar DCPS middle schools (Eliot, Hart, Johnson, Kramer all showing no more than 1% of the school population at grade level). The IB population is extremely high for KM (95%!) and around 60% for Nalle which again are quite unique features. I like the IB numbers not only because I want my kids to have friends in the neighborhood, but also because they may proxy some parental involvement in the school.

I like the area and proximity to Benning Rd metro. House prices are still ok, 3 beds houses in the 300K range. I think we'll place an offer on a house soon.

Does anyone have direct experience with these schools and is willing to share?

OP, please take this for what it's worth, coming from someone who had a modest upbringing--something's gotta give. You have a dream list of qualities you want in your home--you list qualities that many others on this forum want, but find difficult to find even with more income to spend on housing--but you don't have a dream budget.

Could you rent for the time being, living in an apt. in a better school zone until your financial situation improves? Could you buy a condo somewhere like close to downtown Silver Spring, where there are a few older 3brs in that range? Or, as a secretary and healthcare worker, could you move even further out and find jobs closer to where you live? If you really want to stay in DC could you be more open-minded about charters, and religiously do your research and play the lottery until you land something you feel is acceptable?

It might be fine in the early years at Nalle, but I wouldn't want to take that gamble personally with my own child--who is around the same age as yours--even if I feel there's a good chance my kid would do okay. I grew up in a pretty non-academic environment, and only a few made it to college. Others did stints in jail, many had kids in their teens, and a few didn't make it out of their 20s. You say you prioritize housing price followed by schools, but at that budget, I'd switch those priorities and try to find the best school situation possible.

Good luck.

Thank you. I appreciate your considerate thoughts. Loretta (OP)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know anything about Nalle but have volunteered within KM. the school underwent a remarkable transformation in terms of culture and commitment to competitive HS placement under former principal Zaki. When Bowser was chanting Deal for All I think she missed the mark on instead championing a KM experience for more students. I think replicating their efforts would better address needs of high poverty kids than what I understand often happens at Deal. KM absorbed the closed Ron Browne school, has really rich partnerships with orgs such as City Year and Higher Achievement, and has a stronger college going culture. I don't know the current principal but hopefully Zaki's tenure will leave a legacy of improving performance.

Unfortunately across the city schools that serve high poverty kids of color have crappy PARCC scores. There is an 65 percentage point gulf between black and white kids on PARCC ELA scores underscoring the persistent gap between kids of dramatically different circumstances. The achievement gap in DC is the largest in the country but doesn't mean that your kid can't get a good education particularly with your engagement and support.


There are appealing single family homes nearby KM but crime is something to consider. Lincoln Heights nearby has persistent challenges. Unfortunately I don't have a good solution to the lack of affordable housing. I wish you all luck.

Thank you. I appreciate your considerate thoughts. Loretta (OP)